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Cork developments

snotboogie

I noticed that the Limerick equivalent is a very popular thread over on their forum so I thought I might get one going here. To kick things off I'll list the bigger current projects I can think of:

Under Construction

Navigation Square: Four building office development on the former Navigation House site on Albert Quay. 310,000 sq ft of office space for up to 3000 employees. First phase to be completed Feb 19'

89-90 South Mall: 50,000 sq ft office, 5 storey office building.To be completed in December 18'

Dalata Hotel South Mall: Six storey hotel, 165 beds. To be completed in December 18'

Various Student Accommodation: Western Road and Beamish site are under construction, Crows Nest has planning and should start soon, Square Deal is facing appeals, Coca-Cola site on the Carrigrohane Road has had planning for over a year but nothing has happened? O’Riordans Joinery, Gillen House on Farranlea Road, Model Farm Road/Melbourne Road and Copely Street are all at various stages of planning and/or limbo.

Planning/Appealed

Horgan's Quay: Office Space for 5,000 employees, 200 apartments, 136 bed hotel and 3000 sq metres of restaurants and retail. Got planning permission in March but it was appealed by Port of Cork. Uncertain when the final decision will be. Construction on the Hotel will hopefully begin in Q4 this year with the office and apartments commencing in 2019.

Sullivan's Quay: 6 storey Office & 193 bed 4 star Hotel. Planning granted and immediately appealed. Given that demolition is nearly complete I'd expect this to go into construction as soon as planning is granted. Potential hold up over the height of the hotel, at 12 storeys and 47 metres, it is set to make the top 20 tallest buildings in the state if completed. An Taisce not happy.

Former Victoria Hotel: Knocking much of the Victoria and rebuilding to the back and refurbishing the original historic front/facade and to integrate the two sections into a new high order retail unit, of 25,000 sq ft, over four floors. Rumoured to be taken over by Zara. Planning granted in Feb, nothing happened on site since.

Metropole Redevelopment: €50m redevelopment of the Metropole Hotel to include a new five-storey boutique hotel on Patrick's Quay. Planning granted with amendments in March. No date for work to start.

Wilton Shopping Centre: €100 million revamp proposed. Mistake made in planning permission. In the process of resubmitting.

In Limbo

Event Centre: 6000 all seater multi purpose event centre with a tourist brewery experience. Arguably the most controversial construction project in the history of the city. After a bleak 6 months at the back end of 2017 there have been two instances of positive murmurs from the Government and BAM in January 2018 and April 2018. Construction allegedly to start in Q4 2018 but there are still conflicting and contradictory statements from all parties involved. Most would be shocked to see this start in 2018.

Anderson Quay/Camden Quay/Trinity Quarter: All have had planning for years with no work on site. Camden Quay allegedly had some work going on last week but I'd be shocked if it was related to the actual construction. I can't see any of these sites being developed as per their current proposals.

Concept/Pre Planning

Docklands Tower: 40 storey mixed use tower with the redevelopment of the existing customs house warehouses into cultural, tourist and retail space. By a mile the most ambitious development in Ireland. Announced over one year ago and no sign of a planning permission application yet, allegedly waiting for the Docklands development plan this summer to rezone heights for the site. If we don't see a planning application by the end of the year I'd be worried.

Ford Distribution Depot: Put on sale last week. Former site of the extremely ambitious Atlantic Quarter. Major development opportunity

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cgcsb

marno21 wrote: »

The objection by the Green Party to the building is just comical though. I was under the impression that they encouraged sustainable dense development. Sure why not spread the planned uses of the building around the N40 and get people to drive there while we're at it.

The Green party in DCC have been steadfast in their determination to damage the environment over the past 20 years, opposing everything from dense living arrangements to sustainable energy.

who_me

cgcsb wrote: »

lol, like seriously where do you define the boundaries of Dublin City Centre?

I've seen strange definitions of what's considered central/city-centre in Dublin - was laughed at previously for calling O'Connell St. "city centre". (Seen the same in Cork, to be fair. Anything away from Patrick St/Grand Parade/Oliver Plunkett St. is no longer city centre.)

Given how our cities are growing, I think our definition of "city centre" has to too.

WoolyJumper

cgcsb wrote: »

lol, like seriously where do you define the boundaries of Dublin City Centre?

Just making the point that it is about a 10 minute walk from Busaras to O'Connell street. Likewise its roughly a 10 minute walk (maybe a little longer) from Kent to Patrick's street. I'm aware Busaras is city centre but it wouldn't be most people's main destination when heading into the city. It's likely they would be heading at the very least to O'Connell street if not beyond that. City Centre was probably a bad choice of words when I meant somewhere more central....at the same time there is no need to be pedantic.

[Deleted User]

WoolyJumper wrote: »

Just making the point that it is about a 10 minute walk from Busaras to O'Connell street. Likewise its roughly a 10 minute walk (maybe a little longer) from Kent to Patrick's street. I'm aware Busaras is city centre but it wouldn't be most people's main destination when heading into the city. It's likely they would be heading at the very least to O'Connell street if not beyond that. City Centre was probably a bad choice of words when I meant somewhere more central....at the same time there is no need to be pedantic.

It is also around the corner from a train station

[Deleted User]

who_me wrote: »

I've seen strange definitions of what's considered central/city-centre in Dublin - was laughed at previously for calling O'Connell St. "city centre". (Seen the same in Cork, to be fair. Anything away from Patrick St/Grand Parade/Oliver Plunkett St. is no longer city centre.)

Given how our cities are growing, I think our definition of "city centre" has to too.

i would class the city centre as the island section from the port of cork right up to the turn off to the wood street to the mercy and st finbarrs road on the other at the cross section of washington street, effectively the start of the mardyke is the cut off

ScrubsfanChris

Full size: https://i.imgur.com/M0PQdCt.jpg

Shedite27

ScrubsfanChris wrote: »

Full size: https://i.imgur.com/M0PQdCt.jpg

Can't decide if a tower on the Port Of Cork site would
a) be a lovely landmark
b) ruin the view of the river splitting

opus

opus wrote: »

Was out for an early morning jog today & spotted that work has kicked off at the red place that's been derelict for as long as I can remember at the bottom of Sundays Well Road. Hope they put in good flood barriers

Took a walk in that direction at lunchtime to see progress & it's got a new roof.

Looks like it's going to be a refurb of the existing building & the construction of one new town house if I'm reading the planning application correctly.

Nigel Fairservice

Shedite27 wrote: »

Can't decide if a tower on the Port Of Cork site would
a) be a lovely landmark
b) ruin the view of the river splitting

I hope it goes ahead. I think it would be a great statement driving into the city.

chalkitdown1

Shedite27 wrote: »

Can't decide if a tower on the Port Of Cork site would
a) be a lovely landmark
b) ruin the view of the river splitting

Ruin the view for whom? The birds?

Surely it would enhance the split since it'd be sitting right in the middle of it?

rounders

chalkitdown1 wrote: »

Shedite27 wrote: »

Can't decide if a tower on the Port Of Cork site would
a) be a lovely landmark
b) ruin the view of the river splitting

Ruin the view for whom? The birds?

Surely it would enhance the split since it'd be sitting right in the middle of it?

That is a very blunt one sided opinion. I'm in favour of the development but I understand the point the poster is making. From that picture you won't be able to see One Albert Quay from that angle for example.

No need for the birds comment

[Deleted User]

The river recombines there, just saying

[Deleted User]

rounders wrote: »

That is a very blunt one sided opinion. I'm in favour of the development but I understand the point the poster is making. From that picture you won't be able to see One Albert Quay from that angle for example.

No need for the birds comment

From that angle? Who's looking at that angle?

That's the birds reference. And One Albert Quay is such a historic vista that it needs preserving?

Who need An Taisce, with comments like these

rounders

Deleted User wrote: »

rounders wrote: »

That is a very blunt one sided opinion. I'm in favour of the development but I understand the point the poster is making. From that picture you won't be able to see One Albert Quay from that angle for example.

No need for the birds comment

From that angle? Who's looking at that angle?

That's the birds reference. And One Albert Quay is such a historic vista that it needs preserving?

Who need An Taisce, with comments like these

Coming in the lower glanmire road is the same view and you know it. Stop being pedantic.

And I said above that I'm in favour of the development. I never said anything about One Albert being history. Just simply pointing out that there is elements of a view being hindered by the port of Cork development.

This is what is wrong with Boards. People with only an interest in hearing their point of view and shut down everyone else's opinion.

SleetAndSnow

https://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=156574204&postcount=146

Gotta hand it to Cork City Council, at least they are trying to get the Prism built and remove the fear of tall buildings, unlike Dublin.

marno21

I'd rather see the 40 storey from the Lower Glanmire Road than the roof of a building that had floors chopped off for no practical reason.

TheChizler

marno21 wrote: »

I'd rather see the 40 storey from the Lower Glanmire Road than the roof of a building that had floors chopped off for no practical reason.

There are numbers between 1 and 40.

While I'm delighted there's big plans for the site I'm also not sure that I'll like the final result. Maybe it will be a bit imposing on that site narrowly framed by the river. Could work out fantastic either.

I'm hoping it's not just a grand development for the sake of a grand development.

mrpdap

TheChizler wrote: »

There are numbers between 1 and 40.

While I'm delighted there's big plans for the site I'm also not sure that I'll like the final result. Maybe it will be a bit imposing on that site narrowly framed by the river. Could work out fantastic either.

I'm hoping it's not just a grand development for the sake of a grand development.

Fully agree. It’s a prime location, something spectacular would be wonderful but not grand for the sake of grand.

SleetAndSnow

mrpdap wrote: »

Fully agree. It’s a prime location, something spectacular would be wonderful but not grand for the sake of grand.

I think it could be brilliant because it not only combines a rather striking looking building with a nice spire, it restores the run down warehouses rather then removing them, allows them to be used again as tourist, cultural and heritage uses. They want too add a nice boardwalk where you can look over the river and want it to have ''Significant public access'' aswell as a restaurant at the top floor to look over the entire city. It could really help rejuvenate that area by attracting tourists etc down that way to see the 'tallest building'', possibly going into the coffee shops in the area then etc. Rather then just a museum in the warehouses which wouldn't be the most attracting of things.

portOfCorkProposedDev_large.jpg?width=648&s=ie-448208

portOfCorkProposedDev_large.jpg?width=648&s=ie-448208

okedoke

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/ucc-to-open-business-school-for-4000-students-in-city-centre-902767.html

Not sure if this was posted already. UCC to build business school on Brooks site

Rhys Essien

SleetAndSnow wrote: »

https://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=156574204&postcount=146

Gotta hand it to Cork City Council, at least they are trying to get the Prism built and remove the fear of tall buildings, unlike Dublin.

Just a reminder that height restrictions are now gone so as such they can reach for the sky’s.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/building-height-restrictions-in-towns-and-cities-lifted-37604346.html

cgcsb

Nigel Fairservice wrote: »

I hope it goes ahead. I think it would be a great statement driving taking the luas into the city.

:rolleyes:

cgcsb

rounders wrote: »

That is a very blunt one sided opinion.

That's the thing about opinions, they tend to favour one outcome over another.

rounders wrote: »

I'm in favour of the development but I understand the point the poster is making. From that picture you won't be able to see One Albert Quay from that angle for example.

No need for the birds comment

...is this satire? I never know in Cork.

[Deleted User]

TheChizler wrote: »

There are numbers between 1 and 40.

While I'm delighted there's big plans for the site I'm also not sure that I'll like the final result. Maybe it will be a bit imposing on that site narrowly framed by the river. Could work out fantastic either.

I'm hoping it's not just a grand development for the sake of a grand development.

No matter what they do it would be imposing by sheer virtue of it being the first real tower in the city (country)
It would open up that area for real high density work/living environment. All the potential for people to live and work in the city, no need for traffic every morning (and across the river to the docks).

This is the kind of development which can help the city finally grow beyond small provincial city.
I would also think that the council will push hard on all these developments fairly quickly. Brexit is not the real threat to Cork (in the long term), it is a United Ireland. Cork will be completely forgotten about if that ever happens as you will, all of a sudden, have a massive counter-point city in Belfast. A city as big as Dublin and at the complete other end of the country to Cork. No way could we compete with that, especially with all the grants and promotions to invest in the North would bring, in a UI event.

CHealy

Deleted User wrote: »

Cork will be completely forgotten about if that ever happens as you will, all of a sudden, have a massive counter-point city in Belfast. A city as big as Dublin and at the complete other end of the country to Cork.

You are vastly overstating the size of Belfast, that city is way closer in size to Cork than it is to Dublin.

AugustusMinimus

The Green Party need to grow up.

They are either for modern developments which are Green and support Hugh density living or they can act as luddites for the rest of their existence.

They appear to espouse certain aspirations yet when such aspirations come to fruition they oppose them.

And oh my Lord, some of their policies have been so ungreen. The motor tax cuts for diesel cars must be the most ungreen decision taken in this country for years. Filling the air with NOX and particulates. Just wow.

cgcsb

Belfast Cork
City: 340,200 125,657
Urban: 483,418 208,669
Metro: 671,559 399,216

The metro areas are closer in population, indicating Cork's suburbanisation is worse. Belfast City has almost 3 times the population of Cork City and the Metro area is only about 1.7 times the size of Cork.

That's actually Crazy considering there were walls around Belfast City Centre and it was subject to curfew at sunset only 20 something years ago. You would think the opposite would be the case. Cork needs to move more people closer to the City.

[Deleted User]

CHealy wrote: »

You are vastly overstating the size of Belfast, that city is way closer in size to Cork than it is to Dublin.

Indeed I was apologies, saying that it is still 3 times Cork. So will dwarf Cork for investment by EU, government, and business.

Cork Council (at least the future planning dept. of late) do not seem like slouches, they are pushing ahead into the future and I have no doubt that they are factoring a potential for Belfast to be our real direct competitor and getting out ahead of this

CHealy

cgcsb wrote: »

Belfast Cork
City: 340,200 125,657
Urban: 483,418 208,669
Metro: 671,559 399,216

The metro areas are closer in population, indicating Cork's suburbanisation is worse. Belfast City has almost 3 times the population of Cork City and the Metro area is only about 1.7 times the size of Cork.

That's actually Crazy considering there were walls around Belfast City Centre and it was subject to curfew at sunset only 20 something years ago. You would think the opposite would be the case. Cork needs to move more people closer to the City.

Not disputing that Belfast is a bigger city than Cork, it clearly is, but having spent lots of time there I can tell you its no where near x3 times the size of Cork. It has that same 'can be anywhere in 15 mins' feel that Cork has and the city center itself wouldnt be much bigger than ours. Its more dense, lots and lots of terraced housing and it extends on into Lisburn/Dunmurry/Dundonald which are big towns in themselves (same as Ballincollig).

Deleted User wrote: »

Indeed I was apologies, saying that it is still 3 times Cork. Still will dwarf Cork for investment by EU, government, and business

See above. Id put Cork and Belfast on a level playing field if we were under the same umbrella nationally.

Dublin
Cork/Belfast
Limerick/Galway/Derry
The rest

Meursault

If there is a United Ireland, all 26 counties will suffer. We'll be paying for Unification for decades, similar to the German solidarity tax that was imposed (and which is still in place), following German re-unification.

I don't want to get off topic here, and get in to the merits or otherwise of unification, but we can safely assume a lot of capital projects will suffer in Cork and elsewhere.

To return to the skyscraper debate, I hope they go ahead with that 40 storey building or at least something of a similar size and ambition. The point where the two arms of the Lee meet has so much potential. Those old bonded warehouses would look fantastic, if they were renovated. Otherwise, I can see them going the same way as all the other great old buildings around cork, like St Kevins, Vernon Mount, etc.