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Cork developments

snotboogie

I noticed that the Limerick equivalent is a very popular thread over on their forum so I thought I might get one going here. To kick things off I'll list the bigger current projects I can think of:

Under Construction

Navigation Square: Four building office development on the former Navigation House site on Albert Quay. 310,000 sq ft of office space for up to 3000 employees. First phase to be completed Feb 19'

89-90 South Mall: 50,000 sq ft office, 5 storey office building.To be completed in December 18'

Dalata Hotel South Mall: Six storey hotel, 165 beds. To be completed in December 18'

Various Student Accommodation: Western Road and Beamish site are under construction, Crows Nest has planning and should start soon, Square Deal is facing appeals, Coca-Cola site on the Carrigrohane Road has had planning for over a year but nothing has happened? O’Riordans Joinery, Gillen House on Farranlea Road, Model Farm Road/Melbourne Road and Copely Street are all at various stages of planning and/or limbo.

Planning/Appealed

Horgan's Quay: Office Space for 5,000 employees, 200 apartments, 136 bed hotel and 3000 sq metres of restaurants and retail. Got planning permission in March but it was appealed by Port of Cork. Uncertain when the final decision will be. Construction on the Hotel will hopefully begin in Q4 this year with the office and apartments commencing in 2019.

Sullivan's Quay: 6 storey Office & 193 bed 4 star Hotel. Planning granted and immediately appealed. Given that demolition is nearly complete I'd expect this to go into construction as soon as planning is granted. Potential hold up over the height of the hotel, at 12 storeys and 47 metres, it is set to make the top 20 tallest buildings in the state if completed. An Taisce not happy.

Former Victoria Hotel: Knocking much of the Victoria and rebuilding to the back and refurbishing the original historic front/facade and to integrate the two sections into a new high order retail unit, of 25,000 sq ft, over four floors. Rumoured to be taken over by Zara. Planning granted in Feb, nothing happened on site since.

Metropole Redevelopment: €50m redevelopment of the Metropole Hotel to include a new five-storey boutique hotel on Patrick's Quay. Planning granted with amendments in March. No date for work to start.

Wilton Shopping Centre: €100 million revamp proposed. Mistake made in planning permission. In the process of resubmitting.

In Limbo

Event Centre: 6000 all seater multi purpose event centre with a tourist brewery experience. Arguably the most controversial construction project in the history of the city. After a bleak 6 months at the back end of 2017 there have been two instances of positive murmurs from the Government and BAM in January 2018 and April 2018. Construction allegedly to start in Q4 2018 but there are still conflicting and contradictory statements from all parties involved. Most would be shocked to see this start in 2018.

Anderson Quay/Camden Quay/Trinity Quarter: All have had planning for years with no work on site. Camden Quay allegedly had some work going on last week but I'd be shocked if it was related to the actual construction. I can't see any of these sites being developed as per their current proposals.

Concept/Pre Planning

Docklands Tower: 40 storey mixed use tower with the redevelopment of the existing customs house warehouses into cultural, tourist and retail space. By a mile the most ambitious development in Ireland. Announced over one year ago and no sign of a planning permission application yet, allegedly waiting for the Docklands development plan this summer to rezone heights for the site. If we don't see a planning application by the end of the year I'd be worried.

Ford Distribution Depot: Put on sale last week. Former site of the extremely ambitious Atlantic Quarter. Major development opportunity

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snotboogie

This is way behind where I thought it was:

“1st February 2019: We understand a main contractor has been identified, however contracts have yet to be signed on the construction of a new Student Accommodation and ancillary student support facilities at Victoria Cross, Cork for UCC. ”

https://twitter.com/cisireland/status/1091364004545613824?s=21

cgcsb

chalkitdown1 wrote: »

I think that might be the point....

Bloody disgraceful how they've left it. Brand new stadium with all these green areas around it and it's boarded up and left to rot.

Well you couldn't accuse the Cork folk of being direct could you. :pac:

chalkitdown1

cgcsb wrote: »

Page no longer exists. What was it?

I think that might be the point....

Bloody disgraceful how they've left it. Brand new stadium with all these green areas around it and it's boarded up and left to rot.

cgcsb

who_me wrote: »

Ahhh.... I thought it was going to be a link to this.

Edit - actually seems to be something weird with that site. Sporadically when I visit it, it redirects to some spammy Russian site? Seems fine now though.

V dodgy link there lad

who_me

Captainsatnav wrote: »

Googled 'Marina Park Cork' to see what latest was...imagine my surprise when I clicked this link...

https://www.corkcity.ie/services/recreationsport/marinaparkmasterplan/

Ahhh.... I thought it was going to be a link to the Marina Commercial Park redevelopment.

Edit - actually seems to be something weird with that site. Sporadically when I visit it, it redirects to some spammy Russian site? Seems fine now though. Deleted link now.

Captainsatnav

cgcsb wrote: »

Page no longer exists. What was it?

cgcsb

Page no longer exists. What was it?

Captainsatnav

Googled 'Marina Park Cork' to see what latest was...imagine my surprise when I clicked this link...

https://www.corkcity.ie/services/recreationsport/marinaparkmasterplan/

who_me

Captainsatnav wrote: »

I'd buy a gaf in or around there...

Before I bought my current place, I was looking at the Glenmont apartments nearby, near the Silversprings. Nice, modern apartments, but the really cool bit was each apartment had a huge terrace/balcony on the roof of the apartment to the front of it.

And from there, you had a great view over the Tivoli docks. I actually thought it was a great feature, seeing the cranes in action and the containers being shuffled about, especially at night. Didn't buy in the end, thought they were a bit isolated.... they'll probably shoot up in value now if Tivoli is redeveloped and a station built.

who_me

igCorcaigh wrote: »

I remember talk of a planned bridge. Any news on that?

That was the Eastern Gateway Bridge, I think? Was heavily touted back when Howard Holding's Atlantic Quarter development was being proposed... everyone still agrees it's absolutely essential if that part of the docklands is going to be developed. Any century now, I'd say...

Captainsatnav

Markcheese wrote: »

The article mentions A railway station, with a site that big, I hope theyd want more than 1...

I'd buy a gaf in or around there...

igCorcaigh

who_me wrote: »

From what I can see the site is about 2km East to West. If the station is fairly central, then nowhere in there is going to be more than 1km from the station.

If there is a line & station there, then I hope there'll be bridge over to PUC; it'd be a great way of getting to the stadium.

I remember talk of a planned bridge. Any news on that?

who_me

Markcheese wrote: »

The article mentions A railway station, with a site that big, I hope theyd want more than 1...

From what I can see the site is about 2km East to West. If the station is fairly central, then nowhere in there is going to be more than 1km from the station.

If there is a line & station there, then I hope there'll be bridge over to PUC; it'd be a great way of getting to the stadium.

igCorcaigh

https://twitter.com/CorkEveningEcho/status/1090905722618105856?s=19

Markcheese

marno21 wrote: »

Port of Cork have appointed design experts for the Tivoli masterplan

Public consultation expected in the next few weeks.

This being driven by a semi state company in house will likely mean it'll be somewhat efficient

https://www.96fm.ie/news/major-proposals-for-tivoli-docks-in-the-planning-s/

The article mentions A railway station, with a site that big, I hope theyd want more than 1...

marno21

Port of Cork have appointed design experts for the Tivoli masterplan

Public consultation expected in the next few weeks.

This being driven by a semi state company in house will likely mean it'll be somewhat efficient

https://www.96fm.ie/news/major-proposals-for-tivoli-docks-in-the-planning-s/

snotboogie

what the hell! wrote: »

Hoarding and signs gone up for demolition at the Sunbeam site in Blackpool. What did we say was happening there?

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/Construction-to-proceed-on-new-homes-on-the-Sunbeam-site-bfcd1961-3a10-407d-9c5a-967017a8b2e3-ds

what the hell!

Hoarding and signs gone up for demolition at the Sunbeam site in Blackpool. What did we say was happening there?

snotboogie

Markcheese wrote: »

I hope you're right, I hadn't realised that part of the beamish site had a specific zoning,( other than mixed use development)

Even if it didn't a change that big to the development would 100% need to go back for planning. The site would no longer be the same use if it was all student apartments with a small office development and could easily be rejected.

Markcheese

snotboogie wrote: »

The city council would refuse it because its not zoned for accommodation.

600 homes for Old Whitechurch Rd

I hope you're right, I hadn't realised that part of the beamish site had a specific zoning,( other than mixed use development)

snotboogie

Markcheese wrote: »

How could city council /Bord pleanála refuse planning for more student appartments on the remainder of the brewery site? The area already has tall, student accommodation right next door,
There could be height issues next to the river,
That can be addressed... There would be an issue over "dead" Street frontage, that can be addressed...
And the archaeology has already been done on that portion of the site for underground parking, so it's not unfeasible to do regular appartments, or an office development...

The city council would refuse it because its not zoned for accommodation.

600 homes for Old Whitechurch Rd

Markcheese

How could city council /Bord pleanála refuse planning for more student appartments on the remainder of the brewery site? The area already has tall, student accommodation right next door,
There could be height issues next to the river,
That can be addressed... There would be an issue over "dead" Street frontage, that can be addressed...
And the archaeology has already been done on that portion of the site for underground parking, so it's not unfeasible to do regular appartments, or an office development...

Markcheese

Nigel Fairservice wrote: »

Does anyone know anything about that building behind the Bank of Ireland on the South Mall and on the corner or Parliament bridge? It has been derelict for many years. The building was half renovated about 10 years ago (for apartments I think) and subsequently abandoned and it's just lying there. Any plans to finish it off?

It was / is gonna be a hotel.. I think the crowd that owns (or maybe owned) Jacobs on the mall started to develop it...

Nigel Fairservice

Does anyone know anything about that building behind the Bank of Ireland on the South Mall and on the corner or Parliament bridge? It has been derelict for many years. The building was half renovated about 10 years ago (for apartments I think) and subsequently abandoned and it's just lying there. Any plans to finish it off?

snotboogie

BAM would need planning permission to put student apartments on the section of the site for the event centre. The only reason they are getting permission for the current apartments is because they still have the leverage of the Events Centre hanging over the city council. No way they get planning for student apartments on the actual site...

I posted in the other thread but what is the actual update here? The 9 million is a loan? We knew that already. They need to negotiate over the payback terms? City Council needs legal advice based on these terms? I’ve read Eoin English’s article which does a great job at giving the full history but doesn’t really say what the current issue actually is

Markcheese

who_me wrote: »

Bottlehill (48m landfill, never used)
Mahon Point event centre (yes, an event centre was included in the approved plans, never built)

I'd love to hear what the latest is with the port relocation work, and the €12m "budget error" (by BAM, but I don't know who's picking up the bill)

I don't think it's fair to suggest it's just a public sector thing though, I'd seen world-class incompetence from the private sector too.

They came to an arrangement over the port of Cork... I assume for a large project like that, it would be a subsidiary company of bams that would have submitted the tender, which bam could jettison, if needed... So port of Cork would have had a job getting the originaly agreed deal..
They probably still got a good deal, but bam'll make it back on the extras...

BAM are running rings around public bodies on the event centre site... They know there's money in the site, that's why they bought out Heineken's share... Its difficult to negotiate with a body thats gonna win whatever happens, and is happy to spin this to their advantage.. The original planning design was never possible, they just needed something in a hurry..
Its a pity someone doesn't come out of left field with a better proposal for a different site,
Not that bam ll care they've successfully got loads of really tall student accommodation on South main street, and if the event centre gets canned they'll get more... (which they probably wouldn't have been able to do first day without the event centre farce)

[Deleted User]

who_me wrote: »

I don't think it's fair to suggest it's just a public sector thing though, I'd seen world-class incompetence from the private sector too.

Indeed but there is generally a person who pays the price for said failure

who_me

namloc1980 wrote: »

Public management of big projects in the city is beyond incompetent: Tramore Park, Marina Park, Event Centre....and those are just the big ticket items. Not one of them delivered or even close to being delivered and they've been going on for years and years.

Bottlehill (48m landfill, never used)
Mahon Point event centre (yes, an event centre was included in the approved plans, never built)

I'd love to hear what the latest is with the port relocation work, and the €12m "budget error" (by BAM, but I don't know who's picking up the bill)

I don't think it's fair to suggest it's just a public sector thing though, I'd seen world-class incompetence from the private sector too.

namloc1980

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm talking on the public side

Public management of big projects in the city is beyond incompetent: Tramore Park, Marina Park, Event Centre....and those are just the big ticket items. Not one of them delivered or even close to being delivered and they've been going on for years and years.

[Deleted User]

EnzoScifo wrote: »

I wouldn't call it incompetent. They know exactly what they are doing. They want to taxpayer to take on all of the risk involved with the event centre and if that doesn't happen then they will be only too delighted to build more student apartments on the site.

I'm talking on the public side