Bit cynical wrote: » I think we need to remember that if the UK crash out, then the hard border will be in place fairly soon afterwards. It is no longer a case of the backstop being insurance against the hard border just as you can't take out insurance against a crash that has already happened. There will be no open border to preserve. New solutions will have to be found. That will require flexibility. The old "we're not budging" will not work from either side.
downcow wrote: » Well I don’t know about your media etc down there but everyone was fairly united up here that he was useing a threat of violence on the border in a wholly unacceptable way. SDLP sf unionists and political commentators. But sure in your eyes he done nothing wrong
unit 1 wrote: » Ok so the uk crash out and we trade under wto rules while a fta is negotiated. Surely the first item on the fta talks agenda would be the border question, and we are back on the backstop merry go round. The backstop is simply not up for grabs, nor can it ever be. If the uk find wto rules not to their liking they will still have to grab the nettle in the trade talks. Put simply from day one they never had any leverage over the eu and should finally man up and admit their stupid mistake and cancel brexit, any compensation due for the costs incurred trying to mediate for their silly escapade would probably be a bridge too far but steps would be needed to prevent others from getting the same silly ideas.
lawred2 wrote: » eh don't start that business now - I didn't follow up an unexplained accusation of sectarianism with a flounce Asking you to justify such an accusation is not baiting now. As for the second bit - what exactly is it that Varadkar is supposed to have done 'tonight'?
downcow wrote: » We are not interested in being like England tbh that’s a pretty naive suggestion given the fantastic diversity across England I don’t know which bit you think we are trying to copy. We want to remain in a union with the other diverse regions of the UK.
downcow wrote: » I am super confident that you don’t need to worry about your fear of a UI it’s not happening. It would be like turkeys voting for Xmas. ... The last serious polls put those wanting UI we under 25%.
downcow wrote: » I don’t want to dwell on this as it’s off topic but you are baiting me to respond Here is what I feel is spawned by sectarianism. And before you jump all over me I am also influenced by my sectarianism but I have tried to raise my self awareness of it. It seems there is an incredible lack of self awareness of this in nationalist community Here’s some of what he said “ The DUP are a party that were fundamentally opposed to stopping a conflict that killed over 3,500 people. This is the worry we have in the south.” ?????? “Any party that considers the GFA a negotiating tool, or dismisses it, is hardline in my opinion” Exactly what Irish politicians have been doing most recently tonight your premier “ I think it would be a mistake to try and incorporate both the northern Irish subvention and their politics in the south.” Those terrible northerners
An Ciarraioch wrote: » 58% of DUP supporters favour a soft Brexit, so surely Sammy & Co should be pushing for Norway Plus?https://mobile.twitter.com/LucidTalk/status/1088066433299505152
lawred2 wrote: » To be honest if you're going to accuse someone of sectarianism you probably should give a fair attempt at a reply.. I'm afraid what you've just posted doesn't cut it It's not much more than baiting
Enzokk wrote: » I think you are talking about putting a border between us and the EU. We have not voted for that. If the backstop is agreed and it comes into effect then nothing changes for residents of NI. You will still be able to cross the border to Ireland without hassles. You will still be able to travel to the UK without a hassle. You will still be able to call yourself British and your laws will still mostly come from Westminster, especially if the DUP and SF doesn't agree to reconvene Stormont. If the government decides to restrict the movement of people from the EU to the UK then you get to stand in the same lines as those that share your passport waiting to visit EU countries.
downcow wrote: » Tbh if feel it is nonsense. I am not cheering brexit. I am picking the best of two less than wonderful options. Your right I am opposed to the backstop for same reason you guys go bananas any time there is mention of the slightest check at you French border. We are not interested in being like England tbh that’s a pretty naive suggestion given the fantastic diversity across England I don’t know which bit you think we are trying to copy. We want to remain in a union with the other diverse regions of the UK. And then your argument completely falls down when you tells us how you know the future voting habits of NI public at a time of flux. I am super confident that you don’t need to worry about your fear of a UI it’s not happening. It would be like turkeys voting for Xmas. I have many friends in south who envy our free prescriptions free doc appts etc etc. Do you realise the swing that would be required. The last serious polls put those wanting UI we under 25%. So relax and don’t you be worrying
downcow wrote: » This is the endless circular discussion. I get told there is nothing in this to worry about and nothing that challenges my identity etc Then I suggest that if you guys really feel like that then sure you take it. Then people almost have kittens lol You can’t have it not ways
downcow wrote: » Tbh if feel it is nonsense. I am not cheering brexit. I am picking the best of two less than wonderful options. Your right I am opposed to the backstop for same reason you guys go bananas any time there is mention of the slightest check at you French border.
downcow wrote: » That is so prejudiced and clouded by sectarianism I wouldn’t know where to start to reply to it.
listermint wrote: » Ok let's start being clear rational and honest now. The stuff you are cheering on , this brexit. This back stop removal this remaining the same as England. All of this fun stuff you have in your heart or your head will be the end of northern Ireland as you know it. There will be a united Ireland referendum and it will pass. That's the actual reality. Not that I'm super happy about it tbh as it would bring the sort of archaic attitude you've displayed so far in this thread back into this country down south . But alas we are an island and a special one that punches above its weight in the world so so be it I say. But what I will say is the likes of your own attitude and the dups has done more to accelerate the end of the northern Ireland project than anything ever before. How does that make you feel. Genuinely feel
RobMc59 wrote: » The weight of each tanker delivery is 24500 kg-about 27000 litres,into a 90000 kg capacity tank.There are 2,sometimes 3 deliverys each week and as I said earlier,is only available from Germany or Holland which is going to be scary if a hard brexit.
mickoneill31 wrote: » https://twitter.com/EMA_News/status/1088844259934064640?s=19 Mental
prawnsambo wrote: » I took it to be litres. The maximum tonnage allowed on roads is 54 tonnes afaik, which would be roughly 50k litres, depending on the density of the liquid.
listermint wrote: » Ok let's start being clear rational and honest now. The stuff you are cheering on , this brexit. This back stop removal this remaining the same as England. All of this fun stuff you have in your heart or your head will be the end of northern Ireland as you know it. There will be a united Ireland referendum and it will pass. That's the actual reality. Not that I'm super happy about it tbh as it would bring the sort of archaic attitude you've displayed so far in this thread back into this country down south . But alas we are an island and a special one that punches above its weight in the world so so bet it I say. But what I will say is the likes of your own attitude and the dups has done more to accelerate the end of the northern Ireland project than anything ever before. How does that make you feel. Genuinely feel
downcow wrote: » I wouldn’t know where to start to reply to it.
downcow wrote: » I was never away anywhere but thanks for your concern. This might shock you but I have spent most of my life working in peace building. I suppose it’s my interest to learn from other opinions that brings me on here.
ilovesmybrick wrote: » If the DUP don't strike you as hard line I'm honestly lost for words. And I don't, nor would I ever, vote sinn fein. The DUP are a party that were fundamentally opposed to stopping a conflict that killed over 3,500 people. This is the worry we have in the south. You may have been spared the refugees that came down because of the petrol bombs thrown in their family windows in Belfast, but I remember those kids coming into my primary school. Any party that considers the GFA a negotiating tool, or dismisses it, is hardline in my opinion. Because I don't want my kids to hear about bombs thrown in a class mates window as I did in third class. Or having a gun pointed to my head crossing the border at the age of 7. What is, to you, worth the risk of that coming back? And as an edit: this may be unpopular to some posters on this forum, but I have no interest in reunification m. I think it would be a mistake to try and incorporate both the northern Irish subvention and their politics in the south.
lawred2 wrote: » which one is the more enlightened one?
mickoneill31 wrote: » I listened to the Brexitcast podcast today. Then I listened to Brexit Republic. Light years of a difference in terms of quality and analysis. The BBC has really plumetted in the last couple of years. Might be worth a listen to some of the posters who don't have much of a clue about why the back stop is necessary.
