bilston wrote: The Our Wee Country slogan illustrates pride in Northern Ireland. It has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the Republic of Ireland.
First Up wrote: » Its pretty obvious that the staunchest "unionists" hate the ROI more than they love the UK. The OWC (our wee country) slogan and mentality illustrates that. I'd be in no rush to try to lure them into a UI. They'd be an even bigger pain in the ass than the UK has been in the EU.
prawnsambo wrote: Ah, it's a bit like brexit tbf. There are unionists and there are UNIONISTS. The latter are pretty much in the minority. The DUP have support from both by default, but if the UUP got their act together the DUP would fade into the background. There actions over the last year or so have pretty much alienated the more moderate unionists and I suspect there will be a backlash.
First Up wrote: » I'd go further; I would want the unionist community to apply to join - and then think about it. We have more than enough to be getting on with in redrawing our political, economic and trading systems to be bothered with humouring them.
Bambi wrote: There is no way to "force" a UI
Donald Trump wrote: » I disagree We already know that any post Brexit declined will be the explained away as evil EU punishing the British people for their cheek in wanting democracy or some such shite or for "winning WWII" or some such variation. They'll get a few years out of that.
Silent Running wrote: » Well, the one that requires least work is a crash out no deal. It requires absolutely nothing to be done. Just wait out the clock.
The EU pressed on Friday with plans to forge a trade deal with the US, part of an effort -- backed by Germany -- to avert a trade war with President Donald Trump. Negotiating a deal was the key to a transatlantic truce secured last year after the US slapped tariffs on steel and aluminium imports from the EU and others, alarming the world. The effort is also part of a strategy to stop Trump from slapping damaging duties on car imports from Europe, a danger that has especially unnerved Berlin.
ToBeFrank123 wrote: » There's little to stop Eastern Europeans flying into Ireland then crossing into the North and then on to the UK mainland and then working in the black economy or just ending up homeless as many of them now are.
Zubeneschamali wrote: » Which is exactly why Norway is perfect. It is technically Brexit - they leave the EU, but it does the least damage possible.
ancapailldorcha wrote: » The working classes suffer more, those who are mobile amongst whom I am sufficiently fortunate to count myself by virtue of my being Irish will leave the country in larger numbers than at present while the Jacob Rees-Moggs of the country enrich themselves with Project Singapore-on-Thames. All the while the media will be desperately looking for scapegoats. If people equate Brexit with greater sovereignty, Murdoch, Desmond, the Barclays and Rothermere might find their margins taking a hit.
Havockk wrote: » How do you see that playing out? Once the realisation hits?
Adamcp898 wrote: » This is what you said: Then this: You're advocating the merging of NI with the RoI against the current unionist majority. Hardly anything as noble as respecting the "consent of the NI electorate". And I haven't expressed any opinion other than that it's generally a bad idea to force anything on anyone, something which I thought would be fairly obvious, so I'm not sure what I'm meant to be "not okay" with either. Emphasis mine.
No. The problem (not the only, just the major one) with what you've just outlined is that it would be an extremely antagonistic way to try and force a United Ireland and could lead to huge amount of unrest and violence.
Zubeneschamali wrote: » Russman wrote: » True, but I think most MPs don't want to leave at all but are terrified to say it for fear of their seats and being seen to "go against the people". Which is exactly why Norway is perfect. It is technically Brexit - they leave the EU, but it does the least damage possible.
Russman wrote: » True, but I think most MPs don't want to leave at all but are terrified to say it for fear of their seats and being seen to "go against the people".
VinLieger wrote: » Hurrache wrote: » May and her ministers apparently are set to block Bercow's peerage, the first time in 230 years, as a punishment for what they see as his bias during the Brexit debate. How incredibly petty of them
Hurrache wrote: » May and her ministers apparently are set to block Bercow's peerage, the first time in 230 years, as a punishment for what they see as his bias during the Brexit debate.
demfad wrote: » She was also aware of Banks having multiple meetings with the Russian ambassador to the UK and not one meeting as the book maintained. Withholding this information was extremely helpful to Banks and anyone else in this group (Wigmore, Farage) who may have been acting the maggot with Russians/US billionaires to deliver Brexit.
ancapailldorcha wrote: » As an aside, Isabel Oakeshott ghostwote Arron Banks' Bad Boys of Brexit. It's rather terrifying that residents of a post-industrial city like Derby would be so fervent about the prospects of a no-deal Brexit. They seem to genuinely think that the disaster capitalists are concerned with their well-being.
mrbrianj wrote: » You'd have to laugh at the 'German cars' line - do they realise that the UK sell just as many back into the EU? They wont listen to their own car manufacturers so why should Merkel listen to hers?
Gintonious wrote: » This is Monty Python scale stuff, listen to the cheer at around the 3 min remark when the blonde one says that May should walk away. Or the guy at the 2 min mark who thinks No Deal scare the EU into coming back to the table...
Gintonious wrote: » They were almost frothing at the mouth at the idea of a No-Deal. Honestly, the only reason I can think that they would want this, is because they don't know EXACTLY what it will do to them. QT in a few months will be a really fascinating watch.
For all of this is the afterlife of dead things. One of them is Brexit itself. When did Brextinction occur? On 24 June 2016. The project was driven by decades of camped-up mendacity about the tyranny of the EU, and sold in the referendum as a fantasy of national liberation. It simply could not survive contact with reality. It died the moment it became real. You cannot free yourself from imaginary oppression. Even if May were a political genius – and let us concede that she is not – Brexit was always going to come down to a choice between two evils: the heroic but catastrophic failure of crashing out; or the unheroic but less damaging failure of swapping first-class for second-class EU membership. These are the real afterlives of a departed reverie. If the choice between shooting oneself in the head or in the foot is the answer to Britain’s long-term problems, surely the wrong question is being asked. It is becoming ever clearer that Brexit is not about its ostensible subject: Britain’s relationship with the EU. The very word Brexit contains a literally unspoken truth. It does not include or even allude to Europe. It is British exit that is the point, not what it is exiting from. The tautologous slogan Leave Means Leave is similarly (if unintentionally) honest: the meaning is in the leaving, not in what is being left or how..... It may seem strange to call this slow collapse invisible since so much of it is obvious: the deep uncertainties about the union after the Good Friday agreement of 1998 and the establishment of the Scottish parliament the following year; the consequent rise of English nationalism; the profound regional inequalities within England itself; the generational divergence of values and aspirations; the undermining of the welfare state and its promise of shared citizenship; the contempt for the poor and vulnerable expressed through austerity; the rise of a sensationally self-indulgent and clownish ruling class. But the collective effects of these interrelated developments do seem to have been barely visible within the political mainstream until David Cameron accidentally took the lid off by calling a referendum and asking people to endorse the status quo.
Infini wrote: » The problem is that the British Government should have thought of this before pursuing such a reckless and stupid Brexit agenda to begin with though. The only way this whole issue gets put back in hibernation is the total abandonment of Brexit as this is the whole reason this problem was caused to begin with.
