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Domestic solar PV quotes 2018

wexfordman2

Hi,

Thinking this might be a worthwhile information point and reference.

Good to get an idea of prices, and see if the recent grant is causing anomies etc.

If anyone cares to post up quotes they got (but excluding the company/supplier to keep mods happy).

We should show quote if system dimension, something along the lines of

4kw solar with 5kw battery and diverter 9,900 ex vat
5kw solar with 5kw battery and diverter 11,200 ex vat.

Additional info
This was for a "premium" solar panel with 30 year warranty.

Provider is seai registered, so grant is apicable, and he claims HRI/vat refund available also, however I believe thats an error.

Payment terms
20% on order
Additional 50% prior to install
Remaining 30% post commissioning

Quite for market standard panels as follows

4kw with 5kw battery 8750 ex vat
5kw with 5kw batter 9750 ex vat

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unkel

DrPhilG wrote: »

Installer said that the inverter would depend on the size of panels used. He reckoned that you normally have an inverter close to the panel capacity to increase efficiency. I'm sure I could request a 5kw though.

Pretty sure it's including VAT but I'll check!

It used to be the done thing to size the inverter a bit below the size of the panels, for maximum efficiency. Having looked at the efficiency curve of a few modern inverters, this no longer looks like a valid argument. A modern 5kW inverter should be over 90% efficient even at a load of just 500w. If it were me, I'd oversize the inverter if there is a reasonable chance you will increase your array in future.

What exactly is the model number of the inverter(s) they are proposing?

DrPhilG

Installer also sweetened the deal by offering a Zappi 2 car charger installed for €700, minus €600 grant which makes it damn near free considering that I could sell my old charger afterwards.

DrPhilG

unkel wrote: »

It used to be the done thing to size the inverter a bit below the size of the panels, for maximum efficiency.

That's what he said, yeah.

unkel wrote: »

What exactly is the model number of the inverter(s) they are proposing?

Growatt SPH series, so model presumably dependent on my requirement.

unkel

That's a helluva system with diverter, Zappi, battery and 4kwp for under 5k to you (you will need a BER after rating too). I'm very jealous

unkel

DrPhilG wrote: »

Growatt SPH series, so model presumably dependent on my requirement.

Looks good. I would ask him for the 6kw version. It has dual MPPT so you could add another string with a different orientation, perhaps on your house (either west or east, depending on your electricity use during the day, in the future. EN50438 cert and all. Spec sheet:

Linky

DrPhilG

unkel wrote: »

Looks good. I would ask him for the 6kw version. It has dual MPPT so you could add another string with a different orientation, perhaps on your house (either west or east, depending on your electricity use during the day, in the future. EN50438 cert and all. Spec sheet:

Linky

If I added more on the house, would that not require extra cabling from the house to the garage?

unkel

From the panels on the roof of your house, directly to the inverter. The roofers can do that for you or you can do it yourself. We are talking DC cabling with standard MC4 connections. You can buy cable with the MC4 connections prefitted already. It is just click and play. No need for any electrician in any of this.

DrPhilG

unkel wrote: »

From the panels on the roof of your house, directly to the inverter. The roofers can do that for you or you can do it yourself. We are talking DC cabling with standard MC4 connections. You can buy cable with the MC4 connections prefitted already. It is just click and play. No need for any electrician in any of this.

Won't the inverter and battery be in the garage though from the current planned install?

unkel

Yes, so you would need the solar DC cable to go from the roof of your house to your inverter in the garage.

DrPhilG

unkel wrote: »

Yes, so you would need the solar DC cable to go from the roof of your house to your inverter in the garage.

This would also require hell to freeze over before my wife would allow cabling across the yard, lol.

unkel

It's only an option

You might have more space on the roof shed after the 4kwp (13 panels?) install. You bothering with planning permission for the install?

DrPhilG

unkel wrote: »

It's only an option

You might have more space on the roof shed after the 4kwp (13 panels?) install. You bothering with planning permission for the install?

Didn't think I need to!

unkel

Yes you do. No PP needed for installs up to 12m2 (7 panels max, so about 2kwp)

DrPhilG

unkel wrote: »

Yes you do. No PP needed for installs up to 12m2 (7 panels max, so about 2kwp)

Oh piss, that's surely going to make it too expensive and add God knows how long?

DrPhilG

Installer insists that since July 18 planning isn't required. Also they do the grant application etc so I only pay them the net amount anyway so if they don't get the grant through its their problem.

H.E. Pennypacker

DrPhilG wrote: »

Installer insists that since July 18 planning isn't required. Also they do the grant application etc so I only pay them the net amount anyway so if they don't get the grant through its their problem.

The installer is wrong and you may be forced to remove the panels at your own expense (there was a recent case where a lady was made do just that). I’d also bet that the small print in your contract will leave you liable for the shortfalll.

Do you really want to deal with an installer who is either economical with the truth or lacks any understanding of their obligations?

The solar PV grant is a pilot project and is being very closely monitored by the SEAI.

DrPhilG

Thanks, that is dodgy for sure. He insists that the regulations changed in July, and that the "SEAI don't care about planning".

I've sent him back a link to the case of that woman in Limerick...

How long does a planning application take and is it expensive?

niallers1

DrPhilG wrote: »

Thanks, that is dodgy for sure. He insists that the regulations changed in July, and that the "SEAI don't care about planning".

I've sent him back a link to the case of that woman in Limerick...

How long does a planning application take and is it expensive?

Planning may have a problem with them being oversize but the SEAI will pay the grant if it is over the planning limit. I know this becuase I received the grant already from SEAI. (22.4 Sqm)
I just looked at your photo from earlier, nobody will have an issue with where you plan to put them.

In my case I paid 50% upfront, 30% when the panels were on the roof and working away and 20% when the grant application paperwork was all sorted with the SEAI.

Planning "should" catch up eventually with the grant size from SEAI.
In the case of Solar thermal, The planning law took the maximum size allowed from the maximum allowable grant from SEAI which was 12sqm at that time.

I have been told by somebody in the SEAI that increasing the allowable PV size is currently being discussed with planning.

DrPhilG

niallers1 wrote: »

I just looked at your photo from earlier, nobody will have an issue with where you plan to put them.

I wouldn't think so, but I'm not prepared to break the rules and hope for the best.

I'll have to either apply for planning, wait for the rules to change, or forget about it.

unkel

I'd say you're right, niallers1. And the case of the lady who got told to take down her panels. She had the front of her roof (in suburbun housing estate), facing the road, completely plastered in panels. And there was more to it than that iirc. I'd say DrPhilG has little to fear here with a one off remote house and panels on his shed. Personally I would prefer to have permission though. I don't think it would be hard to get and I don't think it's expensive

kceire is the planning expert here, he might come on to explain the details / the process

optip

6 kWp (20x300w panels) Solar PV system with 5kWh battery storage
Trina Panels / Sonnen Inverter & Batteries
€13,465.00 including VAT before grant (€9,665.00 net cost assuming 3800 grant)

wexfordman2

unkel wrote: »

That's a helluva system with diverter, Zappi, battery and 4kwp for under 5k to you (you will need a BER after rating too). I'm very jealous

Yep, that's a Good price, I think I got a quote off the same crowd, but it wasn't as good as that.

One the panel warranty, i think/thought then diferrence in the premium panels was nit the warrandly lenght, but the depredation, with the glass glass ones not having as good a degredation curve. I was tempted for the glass glass for that reason, but in the end, I opted for the cheaper panel, but got a few more of them, which i figured would more than compensate for the slightly worse deterioration .

As unkel said, I would get a quote for the 6kwp using the standard cheper panels, you'll get more kwp and better degradation with a closer cost 5kwp versus a higher cost 4kwp (not saying cheapo panles, reputable ones).

The fact that you would have night rate, and an electric vehicle, two things to think about.

1) with night rate, there is an additional benefit, as during low porductiin periods, you can charge up at night time cheap rate, and discharge during the day. I have 6kwh battery, and these days find the battery drained by about 8pm.

The inverter has to be a hybrid inverter also.

2) For the reasons abive look at a bigger battery as well.

Get a quote for 6kwp with 5 or 6kwh battery, using the standard panels not the premium ones.

Can't remember what the second thing was :-)

Gumbo

DrPhilG wrote: »

Thanks, that is dodgy for sure. He insists that the regulations changed in July, and that the "SEAI don't care about planning".

I've sent him back a link to the case of that woman in Limerick...

How long does a planning application take and is it expensive?

No rule change took place.
No regulations have changed and no new exemptions exist for solar panels.

The same 12 Sq. M or 50% roof coverage still applies.

Planning takes 8 weeks from the day you lodge to get a decision.

DrPhilG

kceire wrote: »

No rule change took place.
No regulations have changed and no new exemptions exist for solar panels.

The same 12 Sq. M or 50% roof coverage still applies.

Planning takes 8 weeks from the day you lodge to get a decision.

Thanks.

Any idea on cost of application?

Gumbo

DrPhilG wrote: »

Thanks.

Any idea on cost of application?

Where are you based?

DrPhilG

kceire wrote: »

Where are you based?

Donegal

DrPhilG

wexfordman2 wrote: »

1) with night rate, there is an additional benefit, as during low production periods, you can charge up at night time cheap rate, and discharge during the day. I have 6kwh battery, and these days find the battery drained by about 8pm.

Is it worth the extra €1200 though? Don't think it would save more than €50 a year more than with the small battery which means a pretty huge payback time.

Given that the grant only covers the small battery, I think if be more inclined to look at second hand purchase and expansion later.

wexfordman2

DrPhilG wrote: »

Is it worth the extra €1200 though? Don't think it would save more than €50 a year more than with the small battery which means a pretty huge payback time.

Given that the grant only covers the small battery, I think if be more inclined to look at second hand purchase and expansion later.

Dunno, depends in your usage I suppose. But on night rate saving alone, an extra 2.5kwh will save you 91 euro (based on day rate of 20c, night rate of 10c) just charging at night and discharging during the day.

During the summer you save more as the 2.5kw would be charged for free, especially with 6kwp solar.

daheff

Where do the batteries get physically located?

wexfordman2

daheff wrote: »

Where do the batteries get physically located?

Mine are in the attic, within a metre or so of the inverter .