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Home heating automation

[Deleted User]

Just starting to look into this now though probably wont be purchasing for a while unless a bargain pops up.

I know there are a number of options out there for this but many like the Nest for example appear to be mostly based around running automatically depending on temp etc or learning your usage.

What I want to know is which one is best to use like a traditional timer? I'd want to set a schedule for heating and water to come on and off and also boost it if I felt like it. Learning my usage or using the thermostat to turn on/off the heating is not something I would really use.

I do want to be able to boost the heat and water remotely so the place is warm before arriving home and have a nice interface for setting timers using an app as we change around our water and heating timing quite often and its a pain having to do this using the poor user interfaces and controls on a traditional heating timer.

I'm assuming they can all be used in this way but I wonder if any device in particular is more geared towards this type of usage?

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Caillte

Anyone else having a issue with nest thermostat 3rd Gen with constantly going off line?I have done all the trouble shooting on the site but none work. I see the ping goes from 800 to 4000 and I think thats the cause of my problems.

Anyone experience this and know a resolution?

Thanks

whatawaster

I rang Electric Ireland to sign up for the Nest 130 Euro offer.

The guy on the phone advised me to sign up for the 200 Euro cash back deal instead and that once two weeks have passed I will be able to get a nest as an existing customer.

I bought another one in Argos for 229 ( had a voucher for there).

So it's 230 + 130 - 200 = 160 for two nests and installation of one (I'm hoping the engineer will install the other one too)

Happy with the deal. For anyone looking for just one Nest it's basically free. Great value

deezell

whatawaster wrote: »

.........I bought another one in Argos for 229 ( had a voucher for there).
So it's 230 + 130 - 200 = 160 for two nests and installation of one (I'm hoping the engineer will install the other one too.......

Slip him a pony and he will.

VUDuo2

Caillte wrote: »

Anyone else having a issue with nest thermostat 3rd Gen with constantly going off line?I have done all the trouble shooting on the site but none work. I see the ping goes from 800 to 4000 and I think thats the cause of my problems.

Anyone experience this and know a resolution?

Thanks

We recently had a power cut and our Nest wouldn't work online (but worked fine on manual setting)

Anyway, I did a reset and it's online ever since - have you followed these instructions https://nest.com/support/article/How-to-restart-or-reset-the-Nest-Learning-Thermostat

reignschaos

reignschaos wrote: »

Another Tado Query

One of my Tado Thermostats isn't on the latest firmware and Tado are trying to resolve this. However in their correspondence to me they mentioned not all my devices were up-to-date, but they didn't mention which other device/s it was, just wondering what device it was. Here is my list of devices and the firmware on them.

Are these the firmware versions that others have on their device?

Smart Thermostat - Firmware - 54.8
Smart Radiator - Firmware - 54.4
Extension Kit - Firmware - 54.11
Bridge V2 - Firmware - 47.2

Thanks

So after 3 follow ups Tado eventually got the latest firmware installed on the stat that was left behind...now its ahead of the other one :eek:

Smart Thermostat1 - Firmware - 54.11
Smart Thermostat2 - Firmware - 54.8
Smart Radiator - Firmware - 54.4
Extension Kit - Firmware - 54.11
Bridge V2 - Firmware - 47.2

It will be interesting @Deezell to see how your upgrade call goes

deezell

reignschaos wrote: »

So after 3 follow ups Tado eventually got the latest firmware installed on the stat that was left behind...now its ahead of the other one :eek:

Smart Thermostat1 - Firmware - 54.11
Smart Thermostat2 - Firmware - 54.8
Smart Radiator - Firmware - 54.4
Extension Kit - Firmware - 54.11
Bridge V2 - Firmware - 47.2

It will be interesting @Deezell to see how your upgrade call goes

As it happens, I just put the request in today, consequent to getting a notification that my TRV battery was waning. They also stated that the battery life was shorter than expected, and would be updating the firware to rectify this. As this is the third time I've had to change batteries, and have received that exact same email, it seems the firmware has never actually been updated, so I'm asking for it to be done. I note there's no update to V2 bridge, which is unsurprising as it's old hat. There also three tweaks on the main stat I see, from 54.8 to 54.11, which are probably trivial. They haven't sorted the loss of timer as default manual setting, a bug which appeared recently. Manually changing temperature via the app defaults to "until ended by user", despite being set to a user defined timer. Manual changes via the actual stat or TRV are unaffected.

reignschaos

@Deezell be interesting to see what firmware version gets pushed to you for your smart TRVs, 54.11 seems to logical one based on the other numbers.

I agree, the bridge is obviously been left behind, due to the newer versions, which is fair enough.

One would have thought they would have checked the other devices in my set up to ensure that they were updated.

Tado's firmware push out is obviously done in some interesting manner.

deezell

reignschaos wrote: »

............Tado's firmware push out is obviously done in some interesting manner.

On request? On the basis of, it's not broken, don't fix it

Darando

Anybody know much about the Wolf Smartapp/BM2 available for Wolf Combi Boiler? Couldn’t see many reviews online....

deezell

Darando wrote: »

Anybody know much about the Wolf Smartapp/BM2 available for Wolf Combi Boiler? Couldn’t see much online....

Ye wha Gay? Seriously though, I've never heard of it, but a minutes research produces this;
"The Wolf BM-2 programming unit is for use exclusively in conjunction with Wolf heating appliances and Wolf accessories." It's a €260 ( German price) proprietary controller for Wolf boilers/solar thermal/mechanical ventilation combinations. Great I'm sure if you have the set, but if you just have a Wolf boiler you're better served with a well proven independent control stat/system.

Darando

Cheers, seen a bit of marketing stuff indeed like that, was just seeing if anybody might have seen it in action in real life.apologies, should’ve been clearer what I was askingðŸ‘

deezell wrote: »

Ye wha Gay? Seriously though, I've never heard of it, but a minutes research produces this;
"The Wolf BM-2 programming unit is for use exclusively in conjunction with Wolf heating appliances and Wolf accessories." It's a €260 ( German price) proprietary controller for Wolf boilers/solar thermal/mechanical ventilation combinations. Great I'm sure if you have the set, but if you just have a Wolf boiler you're better served with a well proven independent control stat/system.

reignschaos

deezell wrote: »

On request? On the basis of, it's not broken, don't fix it

LOL I hope that's not the case...so being the inquisitive person that I am, I asked Tado about the firmware situation and sought verification on my on Devices and associated firmware and their response is below.... which is reasonable.

"We are currently rolling out firmware updates with a staged procedure for many a lot of our products, hence it is very well possible that you have observed changes in the firmware of your devices in the last few days. Those updates are being rolled out intermittently so that we can monitor the process and address potential problems related to unique heating systems at an early stage. Therefore it is possible that some of your devices get updated later than others. However, this is nothing to be concerned about, the latest firmware will be installed on all your devices shortly."

savemejebus

Does anyone know if there are SEAI approved installers for the hive system? Wondering if I could get it setup using the SEAI heat controls grant.

deezell

savemejebus wrote: »

Does anyone know if there are SEAI approved installers for the hive system? Wondering if I could get it setup using the SEAI heat controls grant.

€299 Installed from Hives own site, €100 more than the diy price of €199. Bord Gais installers, so they'd be grant approved, plus an Echo dot free with the install. That and the grant sounds like a good deal, but it's not explicit if the install includes wiring to the HW zone valve if present, guote; "And if you’ve got a hot water tank, you can control that too.". I think this is required for the grant, as it counts as the second smart zone. It's €119 extra for an additional heating zone, which is good value as it requires an additional stat.

deezell

savemejebus wrote: »

Does anyone know if there are SEAI approved installers for the hive system? Wondering if I could get it setup using the SEAI heat controls grant.

2011

My heating control:

⦁ 1 x Sonoff TH16 that turns the boiler. I mounted this in my utility room local to the boiler. I then drilled a dole through the wall so that I could discreetly pass the temperature probe through into the kitchen just above a shelving unit. This provides me with a good reference temperature for the house.

⦁ 2 x Sonoff TH16 as shown in the first photo below. These are supplied from the small enclosure that I fed from the immersion heater circuit. The load is so small that it is not an issue and appropriately sized MCBs have been used. One Sonoff controls the zone valve for the domestic hot water. The temperature probe from this unit is held firmly against the hot water tank so that I can gauge how much hot water I have. The 2nd Sonoff controls the zone valve for the radiators.

This means that I essentially have 2 "smart zones". These are synced with Google Home, so for example if I want hot water I simply say "Hey Google turn on the boiler and the hot water". This will turn on the boiler and open the appropriate zone valve so that the hot water tank is heated.

Total cost about €120.

deezell

2011 wrote: »

My heating control:

⦁ 1 x Sonoff TH16 that turns the boiler. I mounted this in my utility room local to the boiler. I then drilled a dole through the wall so that I could discreetly pass the temperature probe through into the kitchen just above a shelving unit. This provides me with a good reference temperature for the house.

⦁ 2 x Sonoff TH16 as shown in the first photo below. These are supplied from the small enclosure that I fed from the immersion heater circuit. The load is so small that it is not an issue and appropriately sized MCBs have been used. One Sonoff controls the zone valve for the domestic hot water. The temperature probe from this unit is held firmly against the hot water tank so that I can gauge how much hot water I have. The 2nd Sonoff controls the zone valve for the radiators.

This means that I essentially have 2 "smart zones". These are synced with Google Home, so for example if I want hot water I simply say "Hey Google turn on the boiler and the hot water". This will turn on the boiler and open the appropriate zone valve so that the hot water tank is heated.

Total cost about €120.

Looks like great fun. Your zone valves should have relays which would call the boiler when either zone valve was activated, saving you the first sonoff relay. This is also a desirable safety mechanism, as the boiler shouldn't fire unless one zone is open. Its not a good idea to fire a boiler with all the heated water paths closed, which could happen in error if boiler firing is possible without absolute veto by the zone valves.
Can you create schedules, different temperatures at different times for each zone. I've not looked into the sonoff app, but im sure it's versatile enough.

2011

deezell wrote: »

Looks like great fun. Your zone valves should have relays which would call the boiler when either zone valve was activated, saving you the first sonoff relay.

You mean dry contacts and yes they do. However I would mean that I would need a cable from the hot press to the boiler which would be a “challenge”. I may yet do this though.

This is also a desirable safety mechanism, as the boiler shouldn't fire unless one zone is open.

Not a problem according to RGI (I asked when he was servicing it). Besides there is a bypass recirc line. The boiler eventually cuts off on hi temp.

Can you create schedules, different temperatures at different times for each zone.

Edit: I can have a 7 day timer for each or control each off the associated stat. I believe it can do more, I’m still learning.

Further edit: As per your suggestion, I agree that it would be desirable as it is more efficient to have the boiler switch off when the set point for both stats is reached. Essentially all I have done is replace the existing time clock with a Sonoff and add Sonoff's to the existing zone valves that were previously controlled by stats. The previous arrangement never shut off the boiler when the valves were closed just like most houses in Ireland of that vintage.

savemejebus

deezell wrote: »

€299 Installed from Hives own site, €100 more than the diy price of €199. Bord Gais installers

That would using perfect, unfortunately they don’t have any installers listed for Clare

2011

savemejebus wrote: »

That would using perfect, unfortunately they don’t have any installers listed for Clare

Pay an electrician to do it.

deezell

savemejebus wrote: »

That would using perfect, unfortunately they don’t have any installers listed for Clare

Harvey Norman are selling them, same price structure, and they have a branch in Limerick. Worth a phone call. Any grant registered sparks could install, not really a job for a plumber or a gas fitter anyway. Seai website is a mess. The link for heating control grants is here.
https://www.seai.ie/resources/publications/Homeowners-Guide-To-Heating-Controls_Dec2017.pdf
The web address in this pdf for contractors is this;
https://hes.seai.ie/GrantProcess/ContractorSearch.aspx
If you try and tap the link in the pdf file on your screen or pc it wont work because the full stop after the last word "aspx" should not be part of the URL. Plenty of reg heating control fitters in Munster. Good luck with getting one to install and sign off on a grant form for €100. Try Hardly Normal in limerick first, they advertise for €299. If you pull it off, let us all know here.

savemejebus

2011 wrote: »

Pay an electrician to do it.

That would be the most straightforward but getting a grant registered one to do it would be the thing.

deezell wrote: »

Harvey Norman are selling them, same price structure, and they have a branch in Limerick. Worth a phone call. Any grant registered sparks could install, not really a job for a plumber or a gas fitter anyway. Seai website is a mess. The link for heating control grants is here.
https://www.seai.ie/resources/publications/Homeowners-Guide-To-Heating-Controls_Dec2017.pdf
The web address in this pdf for contractors is this;
https://hes.seai.ie/GrantProcess/ContractorSearch.aspx
If you try and tap the link in the pdf file on your screen or pc it wont work because the full stop after the last word "aspx" should not be part of the URL. Plenty of reg heating control fitters in Munster. Good luck with getting one to install and sign off on a grant form for €100. Try Hardly Normal in limerick first, they advertise for €299. If you pull it off, let us all know here.

Thanks, if i have any success I'll post.

2011

savemejebus wrote: »

That would be the most straightforward but getting a grant registered one to do it would be the thing.

How much is the grant for this actually worth?

savemejebus

2011 wrote: »

How much is the grant for this actually worth?

€700, so would cover just about everything.

2011

savemejebus wrote: »

€700, so would cover just about everything.

I mean how much is the grant worth for the heating controls.

savemejebus

2011 wrote: »

I mean how much is the grant worth for the heating controls.

Sorry, i guess I'm not following.

The grant is 700. Based on the hive site's prices, installation for a multizone system would be probably 519.

deezell

savemejebus wrote: »

Sorry, i guess I'm not following.

The grant is 700. Based on the hive site's prices, installation for a multizone system would be probably 519.

From what I gather two zones are required, but HW can be one, so a 2 channel hive/Nest/Tado with Ext kit/Drayton Wiser 2 will fit the bill. Add on a smart TRV for €60-70 and you have 3 zones. Wiser kit 2 only €188, hive €199. Youd think that if you can get it installed for an extra ton, youd have change from the grant, or zero to pay
The reality is more like grant eligible quotes will always be on excess of €700. Im curious to know if the 'free' nests and hives being installed by energy companies are putting this €700 in their pocket, for a €200 trade price install.
One well known company operating out of baldonnell/mayo want €795 for a single nest install. Ive seen grant quotes for over a grand.

savemejebus

€795 is taking the michael alright.

I have 3 zones, upstairs, downstairs and hot water so I'm figuring one 'hive heating and hot water' and one additional thermostat (to get separately would be £233 from amazon) would be what i need and also satisfy the grant requirements. Not confident to install it myself so checking to see if the grant (if possible) would be a more cost effective method to get it.

loyatemu

we have 2 zones + HW (gas boiler)

I was looking at the Drayton system but I'm not clear as to how it controls the zones. We have a thermostat per zone (upstairs and downstairs); the timer/controller has separate programs for heating and hot water but AFAIK it has no individual control over the heating zones, the thermostats control those via powered valves.

This has been the system in most places I've lived so I don't think this is unusual but if the Drayton only replaces the controller how can it individually control the zones?

Krombopulos Michael

I signed up to electric ireland and got 2 nests installed for €400 (upstairs zone / downstairs zone / Hot Water). Had to wait a few weeks for engineer and was installed pretty quickly.