Folkstonian wrote: » Very sweeping and unsubstantiated. I don’t think there are many people in the U.K. looking to leave NATO, for instance, other than the oddball Trotskyists of Momentum. Certainly not much appetite among the wider public.
Tell me how wrote: » They are perfectly fine with a Union, as long as everyone accepts that the UK is at the head of it (British Empire/Commonwealth for instance). If the buildings of the EU parliament were in London, there would be no Brexit.
downcow wrote: » I don’t have the time or the energy to respond to all that. Problem is you seem to think remain told truth and leave told lies. The fact is they both equally stretched the truth.
Infini wrote: » Wouldn't call it nonsense. Older people will sometimes tend to look at things through the nostalgia glasses and think oh things were better back then etc. It's a natural reaction to the changing times. Also if your gonna use the remoaner argument I can use the Bullshíteer responce and that oh so truthful bus right at the top of the list of their lies and deceptions and thats just the beginning of it. Lets not forget all the statements they made then contradicted themselves down the road even just a few weeks later. Brexit is a mistake because all the arguments made for it have been proven hollow and quite a few of the things that have happened have come to pass though not all because at the end of the day predictions are not 100% guaranteed. That being said quite a few of these things have happened before the UK has even hit their arse on the door on the way out! As for your whole argument seriously your obviously posting in a way that "oh its all the vested interest groups/establisment lying" argument. Lets be clear Sterling in the 2 years since Brexit has dropped drastically its nearly 33% down from its height at one point. On top of that there's been a halt to investment well documented in this and previous threads and thing will get worse because when people don't know what happens their first reaction regardless of their line of business is to hold on everything until things become clear because blind decisions cost them time and money when they dont pan out. And dont get me started on the likes of the Daily Fail and co and their deliberately distored tabloid BS. Lets be clear Brexit is a policy with absolutely NO benefit and all Drawbacks because some of those in England cannot share power with others and when they dont get their own way they resort to blaming everyone else and not their own faults. It will end badly.
Strazdas wrote: » I can't see any other country leaving in the near future. Even the European far right have no particular problem with EU membership. On the specific issue of EU membership, I would class the Brexiteers as 'extreme right' : they believe that the UK cannot belong to any form of single market or customs union, never mind political union.
ambro25 wrote: » We know all that well. But she's alone now and, at her age and ever-decreasing levels of mobility and independence, there's a sell-by-date and it's not that far away. So her choice is, move country and abandon the UK to live with us, or (when the time comes) live out the rest of her days in a care home with an annual or bi-annual visit from us. Depending on the flavour of Brexit, and the specifics of reciprocated measures governing UKinEU/EUinUK residency, a choice to be made either by end 2020 (2022 if extended)...or within the next 80 days.
Tell me how wrote: » It remains to be seen just what the impact will be when the UK leaves. As soon as they do so, expecting that they will at least continue to function without all out anarchy, they are going to become a somewhat aggressive force towards the European project. I suspect that Euro-Sceptics in other countries still within the EU are going to both use and be used by the UK in an effort to forge new ties.It has the potential to be very messy and will just take a sufficient right wing government (Hungary/Poland/France/Italy???) to grant a referendum on their membership and then they will have the UK on the outside promising all sorts of things in an effort to sway opinion towards leaving. It is ironic that given the events of WW2, that we are now facing a period where the UK could be one of the most destabilising forces in Europe (Russia aside) and Germany trying to advocate for stability and unity. As Angela Merkle said, we will find out just how much we have learnt from WW2 when all who remember it are gone.
Strazdas wrote: » It explains why most countries wouldn't go near a Leave referendum, they'd be fully aware that the consequences of leaving without a plan would be pretty disastrous. The Brexit voters were convinced though that the UK was almost like a superpower and that walking away from union would have virtually zero negative impact.
WomanSkirtFan8 wrote: » [quote= I suspect also that a big part of the Brexit vote is that the Leave voters thought their country way too big and way too powerful to fail." Yep. A perfect example of good ole hubris in it's purest and truest sense . To me, it sounds too much like "unsinkable". Now, where have we all heard that one before?!
downcow wrote: » This is more patronising nonsense from the remoaners. This is helping to drive not sures into the arms of brexiteers. Firstly you left out that the remain was most popular with the wealthy, the establishment, the middle classes and the media, city of London bankers, etc, etc. You put down those who want to exit by stating the places they get their info. Maybe you could tell me how you got so well informed without using the television and print media, the knowledge you already have from experience and discussion with friends?? I think the only thing you didn’t put down was google:-).
downcow wrote: » And while you are at it. What are the great facts you process that has formed such certainty in you mind about the disaster that brexit would be?
Leroy42 wrote: » The main problem, and why the polls haven't moved more than marginally, is that the entire UK, including the media and politicians, still operate under the notion that nothing is going to change. Sure there may be checks at the border but a few new boats will sort that out. And a few minutes extra in the queue is no biggie. They firmly believe, lead by the likes of IDS etc, that a deal will be done at the last minute so nothing will change. (Except all the things they don't like of course, they never seem to be able to explain this contradiction.
downcow wrote: » This is more patronising nonsense from the remoaners. This is helping to drive not sures into the arms of brexiteers. Firstly you left out that the remain was most popular with the wealthy, the establishment, the middle classes and the media, city of London bankers, etc, etc. You put down those who want to exit by stating the places they get their info. Maybe you could tell me how you got so well informed without using the television and print media, the knowledge you already have from experience and discussion with friends?? I think the only thing you didn’t put down was google:-). And while you are at it. What are the great facts you process that has formed such certainty in you mind about the disaster that brexit would be?
devnull wrote: » Whilst there certainly is a link to the more educated you are, the least likely you are to vote Brexit, all the polls also suggested that the age plays a factor as well - I know in my own family that whilst the older well educated people are less supportive for Brexit than the older uneducated, they are still more supportive of it than the younger educated. The older generation at least in my experience believe what they read in the newspaper and don't challenge it. They are used to a period where there is not the kind of misinformation going on that is now. You challenge the Brexiteer people in my family about their beliefs and they'll not be able to properly back anything up, instead they'll come out with what they saw on TV, read in the paper or 'everyone knows that" or 'my friend told me'.
McGiver wrote: » At this stage, my concern is more about imports. I've noticed how many consumer goods are in fact British in Ireland, including good/niche food products.
judeboy101 wrote: » Sky and BBC reporting its mostly iranians, they have the money to pay for the crossing / boats. UK won't bring other ships from med to patrol as they afraid it will encourage more crossings.
correct horse battery staple wrote: » The % of goods exported to UK is down to 9% and continues to fallhttps://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/gei/goodsexportsandimportsoctober2018/
J Mysterio wrote: » It's often said that many of the Brexiteers - or just people who support Brexit - are the uneducated or uninformed, but I was startled talking to my parents over Christmas to learn that many family friends or relations we have in the UK are for Brexit, and so they don't discuss it. These are people I would have considered to be worldly, erudite, informed and sensible. Boggles the mind.
jochenstacker wrote: » www.expre... well, no need to read any further than this.
Evd-Burner wrote: » She will still be able to visit she will just have to apply for an ETIAS and have some limitations imposed which if she is only over to visit will not make much of a difference. Did she reply about anything when you informed her you would never move back?
dresden8 wrote: » https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/486911/Migrants-travelling-to-UK-across-the-Channel-in-makeshift-boats-and-dinghys No mention of Iranians here.
ambro25 wrote: » My (UK) mother in law is spending the Festive Season with us in Luxembourg, been here since mid-Dec. She holidayed with us in southern France this summer. She's never discussed Brexit in front of me yet, I only know that she voted for it through my wife. I "caught" her sobbing quietly the other morning. She was taken in by the anti-immigrant crisis talk of the campaigns. She's lately realised at last, hearing my wife, my kid and I talking about it every now and then after a latest development, that we'll (probably) never move back to the UK, after what the country has become and done to us as a multinational family. She's also copped for a daily dose of multinational continental news every night (Lux, Belgian & French news), fully realising how little at least some countries on t'Continent (i) cover Brexit and (ii) think of the UK now. To say she bitterly regrets her vote, is the epitomy of understatements. I'm not bitter about it. I just wish she'd opened more about it, when it mattered: it's not as if her daughter and I haven't been a couple for 25 years, married 22 of those, nor as if she didn't see us move & live in Ireland, then visited us every time she pleased, all under FoM.
J Mysterio wrote: » <...> It's often said that many of the Brexiteers - or just people who support Brexit - are the uneducated or uninformed, but I was startled talking to my parents over Christmas to learn that many family friends or relations we have in the UK are for Brexit, and so they don't discuss it. These are people I would have considered to be worldly, erudite, informed and sensible. Boggles the mind.
