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Is anyone else starting to become a bit worried? mod note in first post

Autochange

Bear markets
Fud
Regulation
Wall Street manipulation
The supposed tether ticking time bomb

What are your thoughts? Have you cashed out? Have you been buying the dips?

MOD NOTE:
Its good to see healthy debate and discussion taking place and I am sure every supporter of cryptocurrency and blockchain can agree that the contrarian viewpoint is worthwhile reading, if only to act as an anchor and help prevent investors from getting carried away in an echo chamber of "everything is wonderful, just keep going"

However, there have been a few reported posts recently which I did not action as I wanted to see the thread level out itself rather than start forcing viewpoints and I have been in two minds about that decision.

I'm not going to single any posters out but I'm going to ask that all posters read the forum charter and I want to point out that it was established years ago in the Television forum, that dropping in on a forum to tell the followers of that forums topic (in that case a particular tv show) that it was all crap and only idiots watched it etc etc was the exact definition of being a dick and attempting to troll. I know this because I was the mod of the forum at the time. Now look at the forum charter again.

There is pretty much one rule on this forum : if you cannot discuss in a civil manner, and I mean discuss, not soapbox or attack, then you have absolutely no business posting here and I have no qualms about removing your ability to do so.

This forum is for people that have in interest in cryptocurrencies, blockchain and their application to financial investments. that can be positive or negative but if you really feel the need to start pulling out memes / hiding insults in imaginary hashtags / attacking personalities or just generally being a dick there are other forums you can post in where I will let the local mods determine if it is within the scope of allowable behaviour. Here, it is not.

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SteelyDanJalapeno

Jaysus, back to school methinks

Bob24

cnocbui wrote: »

It was perfectly clear. 'a €3.5K coin' refers to a coin - one unit - which has a value of €3.5K. 'one worth €140' likewise refers to a coin where one unit is worth €140. So the complete sentence posits a holding of one unit of each coin and a comparison of the respective value increases of each, given the applicable percentage rates.

Even If I didn't have a portfolio or own any coins, what I said was still true with respect to the comparative value increases of the two coins. Would you prefer 1% of €1 Billion or 100% of €1,000?

No need to keep discussing/explaining this forever as it is now clarified, but the simple fact that at least 3 posters understood it differently from what you meant shows that the initial wording wasn’t that clear and the confusion was purely on that wording rather than an actual technical disagreement (basically every single of the past few posts are saying the same thing).

Pintman Paddy Losty

I still don't think he gets it to be honest.

bunderoon

Anyone keeping an eye on Bitcoin Cash price increase and if so, any idea what's happening?

Grumpypants

He clearly meant if he had 1 coin worth 3.5k and 1 coin worth €180 then a 10% rise in the first one is much better than a 65% rise in the second one.

JohnnyFlash

Grumpypants wrote: »

He clearly meant if he had 1 coin worth 3.5k and 1 coin worth €180 then a 10% rise in the first one is much better than a 65% rise in the second one.

I understood it as well, and I'm the sort who remains perplexed about posters getting excited over a 10% rise when the overall value of their digital coin portfolio has dropped by over 95% since the start of this year.

As an aside; there's huge trading volumes at the moment. There's someone or something desperately trying to sell, and a consorted effort by others to buy. My concern there is that most of the buy pressure is coming from people using Tether. And that isn't healthy, despite that Bloomberg article earlier in the week showing they had funds to back the tethers.

I'm a skeptic about the whole space, obviously. But if I was crypto holder then I'd be moving my portfolio into bitcoin over all the other coins to minimise losses. Those coins are like zombies walking at this stage.

cnocbui

bunderoon wrote: »

Anyone keeping an eye on Bitcoin Cash price increase and if so, any idea what's happening?

My assumption is that BCH rides on the coattails of BTC. The GFC has awoken from it's brief let up and is back on and investors in almost all asset classes are struggling to generate any returns - both the bond and equity markets in the US have had negative returns this year. House prices have been and are still falling there, so good luck with that house flipping.

Currently the US equity market is now a Bear den - the Dow has retraced a bit but earlier today had fallen 650 points. It fell a good bit yesterday also. Then there was this gem earlier in the week:

he Bank of International Settlements (BIS), an umbrella group for the world's central banks, warned on Sunday that a normalization of monetary policy is likely to trigger a flurry of sharp sell-offs over the coming months.
"The market tensions we saw during this quarter were not an isolated event," Claudio Borio, head of the monetary and economic department at the BIS, said in the report.

There is an ongoing flight to cash everywhere. Gold is a traditional refuge and cash substitute and has seen some positive gains today. My thesis has always been that BTC is gold like rather than coin like and I think has picked up some of the flight to cash trade and so BCH has been dragged along with it.

Of course I could be completely wrong.

Bigmac1euro

Jesus Revolut is handy.
Made a nice little return on BCH this morning.
Lumped a few quid into BCH this morning and converted back to euro a few hours later.
Easiest few quid I’ve ever made haha.
In saying this one of my previous investments is down 88%

sexmag

steo_magra wrote: »

Jesus Revolut is handy.
Made a nice little return on BCH this morning.
Lumped a few quid into BCH this morning and converted back to euro a few hours later.
Easiest few quid I’ve ever made haha.
In saying this one of my previous investments is down 88%

I lumped 200 quid onto shipcoin about 10 days ago and have received a 25% increase,not bad.

However the stock market has gone bear,what effect that (if any) is having on cryptos remains to be seen

What I've always been unsure off is how an influx of close to 20 billion can be pumped into the crypto market in 24 hours and not be centralsied in 1 coin,it seems to be devided almost evenly to all cryptos, where is it coming from?

Bigmac1euro

sexmag wrote: »

I lumped 200 quid onto shipcoin about 10 days ago and have received a 25% increase,not bad.

However the stock market has gone bear,what effect that (if any) is having on cryptos remains to be seen

What I've always been unsure off is how an influx of close to 20 billion can be pumped into the crypto market in 24 hours and not be centralsied in 1 coin,it seems to be devided almost evenly to all cryptos, where is it coming from?

I was only thinking this today.
It seems besides BCH everything else is on a steady pace upwards. BCH is just rocketing ahead.

Grumpypants

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I understood it as well, and I'm the sort who remains perplexed about posters getting excited over a 10% rise when the overall value of their digital coin portfolio has dropped by over 95% since the start of year.

That's if you pick an arbitrary point to start counting from. If you pick the jan before then they are still up 400%.

Bob24

Grumpypants wrote: »

That's if you pick an arbitrary point to start counting from. If you pick the jan before then they are still up 400%.

For sure it all depend on the starting point - there are also people out there who got their bitcoins for 1 euro so there are still on an handsome profit.

Having said that it is probably true to say that a vast number (even a majority?) of people currently holding crypto got into it after the summer last year. So taking a starting poing between September-December 2017 is probably relevant to a lot more people compared to something like Jan 2017 .

grindle

sexmag wrote: »

What I've always been unsure off is how an influx of close to 20 billion can be pumped into the crypto market in 24 hours and not be centralsied in 1 coin,it seems to be devided almost evenly to all cryptos, where is it coming from?

Market cap increasing by $20b does not mean that much entered to cause the spike, probably closer to $500m-$1b entering would cause it. Look at any order book across the exchanges, spreads are generally wide and liquidity is low. It'd take $4m of a BTC sell on Bitmex right now to drop Bitcoin's cap by $200m

Grumpypants

Bob24 wrote: »

For sure it all depend on the starting point - there are also people out there who got their bitcoins for 1 euro so there are still on an handsome profit.

Having said that it is probably true to say that a vast number (even a majority?) of people currently holding crypto got into it after the summer last year. So taking a starting poing between September-December 2017 is probably relevant to a lot more people compared to something like Jan 2017 .

Even going to September in 2017 it started its rally but was only hitting 5k. Which would about 20% down right now.

The point is it suits a certain narrative to say it's lost 95% as it sounds like a complete collapse but the reality is it has been one if the best performing investments in the last 10 years.

Those that got in in the last 12 months just need to wait for the next spike.

makeorbrake

Grumpypants wrote: »

That's if you pick an arbitrary point to start counting from. If you pick the jan before then they are still up 400%.

Yup, doctor death has been calling curtains on btc since it was at $60

sexmag

Grumpypants wrote: »

Even going to September in 2017 it started its rally but was only hitting 5k. Which would about 20% down right now.

The point is it suits a certain narrative to say it's lost 95% as it sounds like a complete collapse but the reality is it has been one if the best performing investments in the last 10 years.

Those that got in in the last 12 months just need to wait for the next spike.

And it will happen,plenty of people will have FOMO again, getting burned once doesn't just mean they'll stop putting money in, any chance at making money and people are willing to get invovled,sure people buy bad things from shops and still go back,not to mention a new younger generation who will see benifits of their futures with cryptos, the work is becoming more digital day by day. What I'm saying can be construed as diliousnal but it's also entirely possible.

makeorbrake

sexmag wrote: »

And it will happen,plenty of people will have FOMO again, getting burned once doesn't just mean they'll stop putting money in, any chance at making money and people are willing to get invovled,sure people buy bad things from shops and still go back,not to mention a new younger generation who will see benifits of their futures with cryptos, the work is becoming more digital day by day. What I'm saying can be construed as diliousnal but it's also entirely possible.

I think its very possible that we have not seen total capitulation - so we may go right down to 2k yet. However, the fundamentals are still right. All through 2018, the development work has been ongoing - on the projects and on the ecosystem.

All the correct 'blocks' are being put in place for institutional investment - from custodial solutions, insurance, electronic brokerages catering specifically to major investors, etc. Regulation is still not clear but its still a long way down the road from where it was at in January. This may be a slow burner but I'm confident that we will see a market uptick at some stage in 2019.

JohnnyFlash

grindle wrote: »

Market cap increasing by $20b does not mean that much entered to cause the spike, probably closer to $500m-$1b entering would cause it. Look at any order book across the exchanges, spreads are generally wide and liquidity is low. It'd take $4m of a BTC sell on Bitmex right now to drop Bitcoin's cap by $200m

500-1b of tethers, Grindle. Liquidity with that fiat thing is far lower. It genuinely wouldn’t surprise me if coinbase and the likes have had any significant amount of punters this year throw their credit card details on there and make an ‘investment’ in the future of crypto.

The whole thing is still circling the drain. All it takes is for people to take off their sunglasses of delusion and take a good long look at reality.

grindle

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

500-1b of tethers, Grindle. Liquidity with that fiat thing is far lower. It genuinely wouldn’t surprise me if coinbase and the likes have had any significant amount of punters this year throw their credit card details on there and make an ‘investment’ in the future of crypto.

The whole thing is still circling the drain. All it takes is for people to take off their sunglasses of delusion and take a good long look at reality.

I'm loving your newfound positivity about the space. :pac:

Yeah, genuine fiat entry is much lower. $500m of fiat in a day would be like the November madness again, the exchange volumes would be through the roof.

[Deleted User]

Grumpypants wrote: »

Those that got in in the last 12 months just need to wait for the next spike.

Hodl comment. No indication, at all, that this will happen.

kaymin

Meanwhile:
'Focusing first on the remittances market in India, Facebook (NASDAQ:FB) is working on making a cryptocurrency - called stablecoin and pegged to the U.S. dollar - that will let users transfer money over WhatsApp, Bloomberg reports. The company has long been expected to make a move in financial services, after hiring former PayPal president David Marcus to run its Messenger app in 2014. In May, Marcus became the head of Facebook's blockchain initiatives.'

Suggests the current crop of cryptos are being sidelined

TallyRand

kaymin wrote: »

Meanwhile:
'Focusing first on the remittances market in India, Facebook (NASDAQ:FB) is working on making a cryptocurrency - called stablecoin and pegged to the U.S. dollar - that will let users transfer money over WhatsApp, Bloomberg reports. The company has long been expected to make a move in financial services, after hiring former PayPal president David Marcus to run its Messenger app in 2014. In May, Marcus became the head of Facebook's blockchain initiatives.'

Suggests the current crop of cryptos are being sidelined

Now there's a coin I can see a visible case for, one that average joe will use and understand and hpoefully not be a electricity whoring greed race. I would definitely invest in that coin (which would really mean just investing in Facebook PLC) ho hum I'm getting positive about a crypto coin!

unkel

Deleted User wrote: »

Hodl comment. No indication, at all, that this will happen.

True. No indication that the opposite will happen either. If someone bought 1BTC for say $20k and held onto it until now, would you advise them to sell it today, or to HODL?

[Deleted User]

unkel wrote: »

True. No indication that the opposite will happen either. If someone bought 1BTC for say $20k and held onto it until now, would you advise them to sell it today, or to HODL?

At that point it's a case of "is it beyond the point of selling, has it depreciated too much that you may as well ride it out now?"

But it's not a case of "Don't worry Bra, it'll rocket in a massive spike real soon". It's more "Let's see if this will work as a long term investment, and raise in a sustainable manner"
The spike may happen but will only fuel another stupid cycle like last year.

*edit* I would actually counter that there is ample evidence that there is a gradual decline to low value (not going to say none) over the entire 2018 year but that these coins play on their own in a way and can recover. Just it would be better (long term) to recover slowly

Grumpypants

There is an awful lot pointing to another rise. The number of new wallets, the number of new developers, the number if apps and the amount of money they make.

The spike in 2017 was the anomaly, not the crash in 2018. That was just a correction.

The tech is better now than it was when any of the last runs happened.

kippy

Grumpypants wrote: »

There is an awful lot pointing to another rise. The number of new wallets, the number of new developers, the number if apps and the amount of money they make.

The spike in 2017 was the anomaly, not the crash in 2018. That was just a correction.

The tech is better now than it was when any of the last runs happened.

I don't see how to be honest.
Some of the tech may be feasible but the vast majority of the coins themselves aren't.

The runs didn't happen because of the tech or the coins.

Nermal

TallyRand wrote: »

Now there's a coin I can see a visible case for, one that average joe will use and understand and hpoefully not be a electricity whoring greed race. I would definitely invest in that coin (which would really mean just investing in Facebook PLC) ho hum I'm getting positive about a crypto coin!

You're going to 'invest' in a stablecoin?

TheAnalyst_

Fill your boots boys. Get a bank loan if you have to.

TallyRand

Nermal wrote: »

You're going to 'invest' in a stablecoin?

No, but I'd consider investing in FB if this was in the pipeline, was that not clear?

sexmag

kaymin wrote: »

Facebook (NASDAQ:FB) is working on making a cryptocurrency - called stablecoin and pegged to the U.S. dollar - that will let users transfer money over WhatsApp, Bloomberg reports.

So buy stablecoin with money,transfer the stable coin through what's app,person then trades stable coin for dollars? Assuming theres minimal fees I can see it working but the money would be in FB stocks as the coin is attached to the dollar.

Might make them the most valuable company in the world