kuro68k wrote: » The British government is going to take it right to the cliff edge and hope that someone else compromises. Of course they have their excuses already lined up if no-one does, only real question is who they will blame.
cml387 wrote: » Don't see that. If the commons have a say in the post-rejection scenario, a crash out scenario will be voted down by a majority.
10000maniacs wrote: » We all agree that the crash out will be voted down, but what then? The commons can then argue for amendments to May's deal, withdrawal of article 50 (no-Brexit) or a people vote.
devnull wrote: » You cannot vote down crashing out. Crashing out happens automatically if you don't have any other arrangement.
Larbre34 wrote: » So, we all agree there is no majority for anything. Do we agree that crash out is the default consequence? After all, an extension to Article 50 must be requested and that has no majority, especially as Brussels will not contemplate renegotiation.
theguzman wrote: » Whatever about Brexit etc. the UK will really be catastrophic trouble if Corbyn gets his hands on power, in the US there was an entire system dedicated to ensuring people like Corbyn never got anywhere near political power.
Econ__ wrote: » Lads, why don't you just try to think this through for a second. Worst case scenario: It's the 15th of March and the Commons is deadlocked, and cannot decide upon a way forward. There is a deal already negotiated and sitting on the table. In what world do MPs, after realising that a consensus on an alternative course of action has failed to materialise, actively choose to walk off the cliff instead of demanding that they vote again on the already negotiated deal? No such world exists. The fact that no deal is the default outcome is nothing more than a theoretical footnote.
Infini wrote: » It certainly is possible even more that being able to rescind A50 is actually an option now by the looks of things. The refererendum was ultimately advisory they arent compelled to Brexit as the result could very well be argued as a deadlock. The result wasnt an overwhelming one with less than 2% majority in favour of leave and thats only out of those who did vote. Take into account the russian troll factor, blatent lies of the campaign, cheating and dodgy spending of the leave campaign amongst others and the fact that 2 1/2 years of this results in a WA most cannot agree to and the economic costs and Parliment can very well direct the UK government to cancel brexit and revoke A50 based on the above and because Brexit simply cannot be delivered without either giving up control (not taking it back) or suffering drastic economic damage. The problems the UK have are their own homegrown ones not the EU's and they cant keep blaming others for their own failures. They need to bite the bullet on this and end this charade its either stay in the EU with control, leave and give up control with no say or crash and wreck their own country. The choice is obvious to us but its up to them to cop on and make the best one.
cml387 wrote: » Well I've been watching the debate on BBC Parliament and I have to say that TM was very impressive, particularly as she emphasised that without the backstop, there would be no deal. As for Corbyn, he wants to move the debate onto everything except the motion up for debate. It's just pathetic. By the way, it's interesting to note that Irish affairs haven't had such a fundamental affect on British constitutional affairs since the Home Rule debates.
Water John wrote: » Sky News saying BJ's contribution to the debate didn't go down well in the HoC's. Basically, BJ was saying we go back to the EU, basically with threats, and be ready to Crash out.
Nody wrote: » There's no difference between today or 15th March and chances of that deal getting voted through then is about as similar as now. You only need to see how every single person basically bends under the party whip no matter how strong their objections are esp. if they can use it to blame the other side (i.e. Corbyn wanting to use the Brexit crash out to get into government and get a new deal that's everything they dream off). Secondly and this is the part you (along with the UK parliament appear to miss) voting through the deal on the 15th is still leading to a crash out because there's simply not enough time to run it through all relevant parliaments etc. in EU and May asking for more time is about as likely as her resigning or withdrawing A50. The deal needs to pass now or there is simply not enough time to get it approved; and if it's not approved you can take a wild guess on what's the alternative is.
SimonTemplar wrote: » Sorry, things move so fast I've been kept out of the loop on this. Why did the government attempt to keep the legal advise secret. It is supposed to contain some damning criticism of Brexit or TM's deal?
Econ__ wrote: » This is profoundly wrong. If MPs reject the deal now, there is significant hope for them than alternative avenues can be successfully pursued - there is time available. This is not the case if they were to vote down the same deal on March 15th, and many would adjust their vote accordingly. Your assumption only works if you pretend that time doesn't exist as a significant & material variable.
prawnsambo wrote: » We don't know... yet.
This whole thing is the stupidest, saddest, most infuriating, pointless omnishambles I've *ever* experienced. Those of you who seem to feel the EU is the source of all your problems in life, I've got news for you: it really isn't. You've been brainwashed by years of tabloid propaganda. Sure, the EU isn't perfect (what political entity is??), but the overall benefits outweigh the negatives.
Rhineshark wrote: » Some of it appears to be (?) that the UK can unilaterally withdraw A50, which the gov preferred not to be known as it removes most of the invented difficulties with an option to vote Remain in another referendum. Or, as an assistant politics editor for the BBC interpreted it, that they can unilaterally extend A50 and the ECJ said so (which is wrong on all counts).
Water John wrote: » Parliament will be giving orders to the Govn't on, extending Art 50, not TM's decision anymore. After today's votes the possibility of a 2nd Ref has increased and it's more likely to be between TM's Deal and Remain. I am presuming JC doesn't get the opportunity of dealing with the EU where he offers a permanent CU.
