end of the road wrote: » well given he wasn't engaging in cultural activities but an actual crime, it's not surprising they haven't called for the sentence to be suspended. but i suspect you know that. what do you think would happen if they did go on air after serious incidents and "explain" them away, not that such incidents can be explained away, as you know. would it be quite likely that they would be accused of condoning and justifying crime, dispite only doing what some people wanted them to do, go on air and explain the incidents away?
Jasiah Hot Talker wrote: » No sorry you’re wrong
sightband wrote: » Maybe the point is that they should just STFU entirely until they clean up their act. They are the first on the airwaves to cry victim about one of their own but there’s this deafening silence on their many thousands of victims that they terrorise annually.
tayto lover wrote: » They never come on the air and condemn travellers for criminality. That's what annoys me. Maybe if they did the travellers might listen and commit less crimes believable or not as the case might be.
end of the road wrote: » i'm not seeing the problem here. they will come on air and talk about issues effecting the traveling community. that is their remit. they follow that remit. there is absolutely no need for them to be going on air everytime a traveler commits a crime because it's not expected of us to all go on radio stations condemning or talking about crimes commited by fellow members of the settled community. a crime commited by a traveler is no different to any other crime. a crime is a crime, the origin or status of the person commiting the crime makes no difference in terms of the crime and it's impact. a criminal is a criminal regardless of background.
end of the road wrote: » i'm not seeing the problem here. they will come on air and talk about issues effecting the traveling community. that is their remit. they follow that remit. there is absolutely no need for them to be going on air everytime a traveler commits a crime because it's not expected of us to all go on radio stations condemning or talking about crimes commited by fellow members of the settled community.
end of the road wrote: » realistically, given that plenty of settled people will go on radio, social or any other media condemning crime on a daily basis, yet it doesn't seem to be having any effects on crime levels, how likely is it that those in the traveler community who do commit crime, will either stop doing it or reduce it, because pavee point went on the radio?
Neyite wrote: » Ah they do. They condemn [insert specific incident] but go to great pains to imply that [this particular criminal act] is some sort of anomaly. Then they say several times that the vast majority of travellers aren't like that. Then it's into victim mode as they claim that they are the actual victims of [criminal act] because they are all tarred with the same brush because of a tiny minority of criminals in their midst. Then they'll usually throw out some statistics that both absolve them of any responsibility and simultaneously blame settled people for whatever it is they were asked about. But I highly doubt Pavee Point have any influence in their community to reduce criminality.
Meanwhile, a member of Blanchardstown Travellers’ Support Group claimed the local authority had a role to play in the shooting incident in Mulhuddart. Catherine Joyce told RTɒs Morning Ireland the local authority knew the family involved was in crisis and if one of the families involved had been moved off the site, this incident might not have occurred.
sightband wrote: » I understand what you are saying, obviously they won’t come on air after a traveller commits yet another crime but they are so vocal about their rights without any accountability for their behaviour. Even a token “there are issues within the travelling community which need to be addressed by ourselves”...but there’s zero. It’s “we are victims and everyone treats us badly” end of...Ive yet to hear a single traveller or spokesperson for them say as much. They make an awful lot of people suffer for such a small community.
Rex Tasteless Gutter wrote: » They have sections on their website complaining that Travellers are stereotyped as criminals. But they are silent about the large number of crimes actually committed by Travellers. They persistently refuse to acknowledge that Travellers have this reputation not because of "stereotyping" by the settled community, but because Travellers actually do carry out a hugely disproportionate share of the criminal behavior in Ireland. Travellers are 0.6 percent of the Irish population, but comprise 10 percent of the male prison population and 22 percent of the female prison population.
tayto lover wrote: » Settled people don't claim ethnicity in their own country nor do they come on the radio claiming they're being picked on and suffering racism.
Chewbacca wrote: » They represent the traveller community and are very vocal about injustice from settled people. They campaign for rights, status, fairness, equality and more. Would you not agree that it would go a long way to bridge the gap between both communities if they stood up and openly condemned illegal actions/activities (whatever they may be) which their community conducts against the State or settled people.
end of the road wrote: » i personally think no currently. i think it actually may make things worse. while some people in the settled community focus their issues on all travelers rather then focusing on the people actually causing the issue, unfortunately this is likely to remain to be the case. when attitudes change, then perhapse pavee point will be able to do this, and it could help bridge the gap.
tretorn wrote: » How much more of this endless nonsense do we have to put up with. Who in this thread is focussing attention on all travellers. People are talking about individual travellers and their antii social behaviour and the thread running through each sad story is the ineffectiveness of the authorities to deal with these crimes. Three cowardly thugs attack a referee and maim him and they arent named and nor have they to the best of my knowledge been charged with this assault. Who decided they were to be banned from all football games and who is going to make sure this ban is observed, can you imagine theses thugs turning up at the gate with their slash hooks. I suppose travellers will now whine that they feel unwelcome at sportsgrounds, well who would want to be part of any club that travellers were members of.
Chewbacca wrote: » You think that if Pavee Point condemn the illegal activity conducted by the community they represent it would "make things worse"? Pavee Point make demands from the Goverment and from the Irish people. They campaign and receive council and State assistance, I have no problem with this. They are also not shy about pointing out allegations of discrimination or other various issues which are directed at travellers, yet we are not allowed speak ill of their actions. They campaign for fairness while elements of their community show none towards non travellers. Its not "fair" that they regularly target, exploit, terrorise and assault elderly people. They campaign for equality while elements of their community regularly flaunt the laws of the land as if they don't apply to them. If you demand respect from the State and non travellers, you should show it back. How can Pavee Point expect to be taken seriously (as an NGO) if they do not acknowledge issues within their community and make a concerted effort to address them. It completely undermines their position. Its up to Pavee Point and travellers themselves to bridge the gap, God knows the State has done their part. In regard to non travellers doing their bit, speaking for myself. I would applaud Pavee Point if they condemned illegal activity in their community. This would get me behind them and would gain my support. If travellers stopped robbing people that I know, that would also help. My negative attitude towards travellers does not come from racism or bigotry or any other "ism". They come from interactions with the Traveller community themselves, obviously its just the bad ones I have met. Ultimately, if Pavee Point or travellers themelves wont make the effort, why should we? Why should the State provide services and assistance to travellers who break the law?
end of the road wrote: » the fact we are currently speaking ill of the actions of some travelers, shows that we are in fact allowed to speak ill of actions commited by travelers. the job of pavee point is to campaign against discrimination against, and fairness for the traveling community, something they seem to do quite well. it's not fair that anyone commits crime, but unfortunately they do, and as it stands there is little will to do what needs to be done to deal more effectively with the problem of criminality. the gardai are underfunded and the sentencing is low for a lot of crimes. pavee point can only do so much, and the unfortunate reality is, that those who do discriminate against travelers, are the likely reason why pavee point feel unable to address criminality among an element of the community. if pavee point or travelers don't make the effort, it is still your job to make the effort, because ultimately we want the issues to be solved. if we don't make the effort, it is a lot more likely the issues won't be resolved, because we are in the majority. the state must provide services to those who break the law, where such services are required, because they have an obligation to do so, as such services will allow them to seak fair justice, and once finished their punishment, may provide necessary supports to those people, which may move them away from law breaking. if someone breaks the law, then it is on the state to punish them for doing so.
Royal Legend wrote: » Because if they did they would need they own 24/7 news radio station :mad:
jay0109 wrote: » Well they would have been busy the past couple of weeks...the feud that's taken over Drogheda, the Mulhuddart court case outcome, the referee getting beat up by players/fans of Mullingar FC, the Garda plan for Rathkeale for the xmas swarm. What else have I missed?
dan1895 wrote: » The lads in Galway scrapping in traffic outside the Garda Station
CinemaGuy45 wrote: » I would run a mile from anything these people had any involvement in they are just too dangerous and vicious as that poor referee has found out. I am happy to have nothing to do with them I don't want to know them and I have no problem saying I hate them with a passion all of them no exceptions. Tell me why should I make exceptions when there are people like you who will tie yourself in knots trying to cover up to deflect and blame others for their savage behaviour?
