kuro68k wrote: » The British government is going to take it right to the cliff edge and hope that someone else compromises. Of course they have their excuses already lined up if no-one does, only real question is who they will blame.
correct horse battery staple wrote: » Funny that, the Great British negotiators have been completely outclassed and outmaneuvered by these pesky Irish + EU negotiators And they want the same people to make trade deals with China and Trump, lambs to the slaughter.
LuckyLloyd wrote: » Bear in mind that we've been here before over Chequers, where 'big beats' (Politicos :rolleyes:) like Johnson and Davis resigned. Resignations don't change anything in of themselves. They've still got to get their letters into 1922; one of them needs to stand; and they need to win. She doesn't strike me as the resigning under pressure type. Which of them has the balls to step forth and stand? Johnson and Davis didn't. Angry opinion pieces in the Telegraph do not a leadership challenge make. Make yourselves relevant or stop the remonstrating imo.
LuckyLloyd wrote: » Any link lads?
flatty wrote: » That they haven't. They were utterly hamstrung by a solo run by may and her self created red lines, on top of which, there was never really a negotiation to be had. These are the terms, you accept or don't. I don't understand the high praise for our govt. They just did what anyone would have in the circumstance, buoyed by open European support. Just an average job. The fact that the EU moved a bit was entirely down to the good nature and genuine decency of barnier and tusk Imo. The UK govt have been an utter shambles. The referendum and campaign have been a shoddy corrupt disgrace. May has had a clear get out of jail card throughout as the leave side are placed under investigation, potentially criminal. She has chosen not to use this. Why she refuses to rerun the referendum is the single most curious fact at present. But I digress. The UK negotiating team have actually done a more than decent job, fighting against a vastly superior arsenal, with a hand tied.
Donald Trump wrote: » Well I suppose that in fairness they did not capitulate and managed to do the diplomatic work early on to get the EU fully behind them. There was a lot of worry early on that Ireland would be pushed to one side and ignored once the shit came close to hitting the fan
flatty wrote: » The fact that the EU moved a bit was entirely down to the good nature and genuine decency of barnier and tusk Imo.
Zubeneschamali wrote: » I think the only path to passing this in the HoC is to convince the ERG that if they don't back this, they won't get any Brexit at all. A threat to go to the people with a new referendum with options Leave with this deal or Remain would do it, since Remain would win.
Seth Brundle wrote: » https://twitter.com/Aiannucci/status/1063007128645001216
Sam Russell wrote: » I do not get the push for a second referendum - there is not enough time. Such a referendum would take months and months to organise and I have heard date of early May suggested. That is after 29th March 2019. The options I see are: 1. Labour abstaining. 2. An amendment to the 'meaningful vote' is made to cancel Brexit in its entirety, and beg the EU to forget the last two years. 3. A cliff edge MadMax episode. How long would that last? 4. A general Election, but that would require Labour to campaign for Remain/No Bexit, and take most of the time left. I favour one of the first two.
Zubeneschamali wrote: » A threat to go to the people with a new referendum with options Leave with this deal or Remain would do it, since Remain would win.
Nody wrote: » Take a step back for one moment; why would EU (and Barnier who negotiated the peace deal in the first place) want to throw Ireland under the bus (which has been claimed over and over again as recently as yesterday on this thread)? What benefit would EU have if they said eff the NI border issue and we'll deal with it later? UK has been asking for unicorns and pixy dust since day 1; wanting to have single market access without paying for it etc. The Irish border may have been a big issue in the negotiations to resolve but honestly in the grand scheme of things remove the issue and what would EU have gained? Nothing because the NI border issue was not a sticking point to get a deal with the UK but for UK to realize what's actually on the table to choose between in terms of options rather than the "We eat cake and keep it" which was their view for most of the duration.
ilovesmybrick wrote: » Here you go, you'd feel sorry for poor buggers like that who are realising the utter sh*te they were sold. https://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/james-obrien/leave-voter-cries-apologises-for-brexit/
seamus wrote: » Sterling has taken a hammering this morning and it's only going to get worse.
joe40 wrote: » The British people were definitely sold a pup in the first referendum. However in the last election they still returned a government of May's Tory party with her red lines, and no deal is better than a bad deal ****e. Along with 10 DUP MPs from the north who campaigned for a leave. This mess is hurting me personally, but the Brits had 2 opportunities to stop this or at least minimise the damage. I know a large minority are sensible and see this for what it is, but a majority of clowns in Britain and NI got us to this stage.
seamus wrote: » Such a referendum would likely be considered illegitimate since it doesn't include a "do nothing" option.
kowtow wrote: » It's worth bearing in mind for perspective, that even with the big fall in sterling in the last 24 hours it is at a higher level against the Euro than it has been for most of the last four months, and it remains within a couple of pips of where it was this time last year and into December. I can assure you that Sterling / EUR for the last year has been remarkable more for it's lack of volatility than for anything else - albeit in the wake of the big adjustment which took place following the referendum itself.
seamus wrote: » We are actually in "Deal or No Deal" territory now. It's this, or nothing. And right now it looks like "nothing" is winning.
Zubeneschamali wrote: » Not for a second - if Labour thought voting against this meant No Deal in March, they would vote for it. They are going to vote against it because they know more about how Parliament works than that.
Water John wrote: » We are not down to this Deal or No Deal. As I said last night we are in the early stages of the end game. A whole lot will happen even today. Will Gove jump? He'll only do that if he sees it as advantagous to himself, feck the country. If he does the pound plummets. This Deal are quite long odds to get through the Ho C at this stage. Do the EU call a Summit knowing the Deal will probably not make it through the HoC?
Water John wrote: » Do the EU call a Summit knowing the Deal will probably not make it through the HoC?
