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Chapter 2 - Finding Nemo

Swashbuckler

2018 - Chapter One: The Day That Never Comes - Post 1 to 634

2019 - Chapter Two: Finding Nemo - Post 635 onwards

Original Post:
I've decided to set up one of these in the hope that every now and then someone will come along and in their good nature, answer one of my many questions about my training. I find I've been posting a lot of questions in the Random Running thread so maybe this is a better way of going about it.

Background
36 year old male. Been running for 7 years but only started properly focusing my training since January. Only learned what a tempo, LSR etc. were this year! Previous to that I just went out most days and ran 6 miles at as fast as I could manage. No direction or focus to my training. Had ran some half marathons and mixed in circuit training. But this year I really fell in love with running. Thanks to advice from people on here and chatting to some advanced runners I've met at many races this year I've manage to see significant improvements.

PB's;
5k - 18:22 - Parkrun (2017)
10k - 37:44 - Run Killarney (2017)
Half Marathon: 1:31:35 Charleville (2012). Most recent Half was in June - Half Thru the Heart which I did in 1:33. Extremely tough course and the distance was a little short.

Short to Medium term targets (over the next ~10 months);
5k - Sub 18
10k - Sub 37
Half Marathon - Sub 1:30

Long term targets/dreams;
5k - Sub 17
10k - Sub 35
Run my first Full Marathon (maybe by end of next year).
Run a really good Full Marathon.

Myself and my wife have a baby on the way so I'd say the training could be impacted for a while but I really hope I can keep it up to the same level.

I generally do two/three sessions a week (mix of intervals and tempo), one long run and the rest easy runs. Train 5-6 times a week with one day off.

I do all my Mon-Fri training within my one hour lunch break. LSR is either at the weekend or in the morning before work.

I know I should probably join a club. I would love to but we'll see how life changes once baby arrives. Even if I could do one session a week with a club I think it would be of benefit.

Last weeks training;
Mon: 7 miles steady/progressive starting at 7min/mile and finishing at 6:30min/mile. I'm thinking this run isn't of much benefit as it's in no mans land pacewise for me?
Tues: 5 x 1 mile intervals. Intervals at 5:50min/mile average with 3min recovery between.
Wednesday: 10k easy/recovery @ 7:30min/mile. Not sure if this should be slower but I read that it's bad to have easy and LSR paces the same i.e. too much running at the slow pace. The 7:30 pace felt easy.
Thursday: 15 mile LSR @ 8min/mile. Total time: 2 hours.
Friday: 4 mile recovery jog @ 8:50 min/mile.
Saturday: Parkrun 5k - 18:22.
Sunday: Rest

Probably overdid it a bit last week. Not sure to be honest but I feel good. I'm still learning. I'll be giving up the Parkruns in a couple of weeks for a while so I wanted to run a couple of them pretty hard to end up on a good note.

Any advice is greatly appreciated. I'm looking to improve and still relatively new to proper training so I'm willing to take any advice on board.

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Comments

healy1835

Super report Paul. Fair play for digging in and holding a decent pace when you were under the cosh. And you were dead right to go for it from the off.....no question about it, you had it in the legs. Jealous of your impending move to XC.....Will try and dip my toe myself and get one or two races in after Dublin

Wubble Wubble

That's an amazing result. Congrats on the PB, more than merited especially for the sheer determination to get across the line.

Swashbuckler

average_runner wrote:

How do you go about improving your longer distances ? What is the correlation between the 5k up to the marathon?

hot buttered scones wrote:

Great report and great running. Well done - and it's no more than you deserve with all the hard work you've put in. That took some grit to finish out the race - those last 2 miles or so over the bridge and back up past the creamery are tough even with fully functioning calves! Charleville is one of my favourite races, especially the loop through Kilmallock, and I think you described it very well. If you think the crowds of runners and the support was good there, just wait until you do DCM next year - it'll blow you away. ;-)

OH God no.... I've said it before and I'll say it again, ye marathon lads/ladies are nuts. A different breed. If I'm "death marching" in a half, what the hell will the full do to me. Haha

eyrie wrote:

Going to have to disagree with you there . Well ok, not disagreeing that it was awful and harrowing for you going through it, but that sheer force of will is certainly inspiring. Well done you.

Thanks Eyrie. And thanks for saying that. I guess I hadn't thought of it that way.

eyrie

Ahh, beautiful! I'm sorry to hear you suffered like that but it's really something reading about it. As you say yourself the numbers aren't the most important thing and no number can really do justice to that effort, but congratulations on a very nice number all the same!

One thing I learned yesterday is that not all PB's are created equal. Some are great stories of inspiration and some are just an awful harrowing experience. Yesterday was the latter. Haha.

Going to have to disagree with you there :pac:. Well ok, not disagreeing that it was awful and harrowing for you going through it, but that sheer force of will is certainly inspiring. Well done you.

hot buttered scones

Great report and great running. Well done - and it's no more than you deserve with all the hard work you've put in. That took some grit to finish out the race - those last 2 miles or so over the bridge and back up past the creamery are tough even with fully functioning calves! Charleville is one of my favourite races, especially the loop through Kilmallock, and I think you described it very well. If you think the crowds of runners and the support was good there, just wait until you do DCM next year - it'll blow you away. ;-)

kerrylad1

Well done man.Fantastic running.That is one hell of a time.

Swashbuckler

Safiri wrote:

You told me you live in a caravan

For four months of the year I'm an honorary weekend kerry caravan man.

Safiri

Swashbuckler wrote: »

Haha the only way I could get into XC
Those West Limerick AC lads are too far away from where I live.

You told me you live in a caravan;)

Swashbuckler

Safiri wrote:

Sweet baby jesus! How can a man of your fine western heritage don that?

Haha the only way I could get into XC

Those West Limerick AC lads are too far away from where I live.

Safiri

Swashbuckler wrote: »

I'm the guy in the Limerick AC singlet.

Sweet baby jesus! How can a man of your fine western heritage don that?

*unfollowed*:p

Swashbuckler

Thanks everyone for the kind words. The mental scars are slowly beginning to heal!

ariana` wrote:

Super report, what a run, you're some man for gritting it out, ouch Brilliant PB and no doubt there is more - it's usually helpful to have 2 legs operating at full capacity for the full distance

Haha very true. If only I had known that at mile 4 I'd have slowed down

lol

shotgunmcos wrote:

No doubt the coaching program and support go a long way but I disagree, grit and determination is all you!

Some of it is me for sure but some of those specific sessions definitely shift the threshold.

OOnegative wrote:

Some guts shown in that race, huge well done!!! If iâ€™m right going on pictures, that beard surely is slowing you down a second or two per mile!!

Thanks! You must have the wrong guy. I know there was a lad with a fine beard in the sub 80 group. I'm more of a designer stubble guy. Haha. If you're looking at pics I'm the guy in the Limerick AC singlet. Shades on. Blue adidas. Grimacing in pain.

MY BAD

Great race report, fair play for holding on at the end. Congrats on the PB

Younganne

great report and great running. The desire was there after all the hard training to grit it out to the end. Well done Sir.

OOnegative

Some guts shown in that race, huge well done!!! If i’m right going on pictures, that beard surely is slowing you down a second or two per mile!!

Murph_D

6:27 for that last mile is pretty astounding - a measure of your desire. Great to meet you too.

shotgunmcos

Great run, well done on the PB and kudos for digging in for the last mile with cramps.

No doubt the coaching program and support go a long way but I disagree, grit and determination is all you!

ariana`

Super report, what a run, you're some man for gritting it out, ouch :eek: Brilliant PB and no doubt there is more - it's usually helpful to have 2 legs operating at full capacity for the full distance :pac:

Duanington

Congratulations P, well done for gritting it out man, great desire in there.
No doubt you'll come out of the winter gunning for another PB over the distance.

ReeReeG

That's some read. Thanks for sharing. Well done on the new PB, you certainly fought for it.

Kellygirl

Brilliant pb. That last mile sounds like torture. Tough going but you are amazing to have kept going. Well done.

jake1970

Excellent running and equally excellent time, well done!

skyblue46

Normally I'd aspire to run races in the manner you do but two legs cramping.....I think I'd pass on that!! That's an amazing time P. Just rewards for the efforts and attitude over the months. Well done.

Swashbuckler

I promised drama didn't I? One thing I learned yesterday is that not all PB's are created equal. Some are great stories of inspiration and some are just an awful harrowing experience. Yesterday was the latter. Haha.

The training has been well documented. Was feeling in great shape. Huge progress made since Limerick where I improved on a soft pb by running 1.21.52. I expected better in Charleville. Weather forecast was very uncertain all week with threats of a storm. In the end it didn't materialize. I think this reinforced the approach I wanted to take on the race but more on that later.

Saturday was spent looking after baba and heading to my folks for the night. My missus was away with her mum and sisters for the weekend. So I was on solo daddy weekend duties for the first time! Quality time with baba and family. I'd like to say Saturday was nice and relaxed but at the best of times I'm a worrier and having baba away for the first time on my own and getting used to some faces she hadn't seen in a few weeks had me a little tense. By evening time all was good and I could sit back with the family after baba had gone to bed. Another thing of note on Saturday was seeing the results come in from Dublin Half. I know I shouldn't be influenced by other people's results but two results in particular again reinforced how I was going to approach Charleville.
I had been thinking about this in the run up to Charleville. Firstly I had decided the Charleville result would not define success for me. The training had gone so well. It was in the bank. That was the success.
The week before Charleville was spent fielding questions of "what time was I targeting" and people looking at me weird when id say I wanted to run as well as I can on the day. Haha. People want numbers. I guess I figured most of my LT/Tempo stuff in the run up to it had been around 6.10. In theory that's probably my ten mile/half marathon pace? That would have me around 1.20.30.
But as the day approached and I decided the result didn't matter, the storm didn't materialize (weather on the day was ideal) , some results from Dublin I wanted to at least match (sorry lads I'm a competitive fecker. Haha) I decided to go at this one aggressively and whatever happens happens. I can't say I regret that decision but I dunno lads, I half regret that decision. Haha.

Anyway I'm rambling.

I had an "OK" night's sleep. 12 to 5.30am. Got up at had brekkie at 7am. Baba woke a while later. Fed her and hit the road for Charleville at 8.45 with race due to start at 10. Had to collect the tshirt. Headed up to the GAA HQ and the crowd was big already. Ran into some of Luke's Tallaght crew and introduced myself. Decided during the warmup that the shades would be required. Thought about an extra layer but decided against. Finished the warmup and headed down to start line at 9.45. It was packed. Met a clubmate and we slotted in a less than ideal position but it was the best we could do. About 7 rows back. A huge crowd in front. Never seen so many club singlets in my life from all over the country. Great to see. Surrounded by people of all levels from sub 67 people to sub 2.30 people. Some range!

The race started without any real warning (or maybe I was distracted). Off we went. I must say it felt a bit chaotic for the first mile. People everywhere. Managed to find a small bit of space but kept asking myself was I feeling OK and was this pace OK for the first mile. I decided it was. By the end of mile 1 I was in some "space" with a whole bunch of people running at the effort I wanted to be at. It really is an ideal race for finding groups of people to work with. I could see the sub 80 pacer group up ahead. This confused me a little coz my first mile clocked at 6.02 which is sub 79 pace. I figured maybe I must have been a good bit behind the sub 80 pace group at the start. Either that or they were banking time early. Given I wasn't closing them at a huge rate I figured they must be motoring at sub 79 pace. I asked myself how I felt. Felt fine but had the obvious doubts how fine I'd feel later.
The first few miles had me working past some of the people around me and eventually linking up at the back of the sub 80 group. By now a few miles had passed and I knew the sub 80 group were going sub 79 pace. I decided to settle with them and hope my grit would take me through.
First few miles/5k split;
6.02/5.59/5.59/18.42
Pretty aggressive start. Asking myself am I a little mad for trying this. Apologies in advance for the haphazard way I'll be recording the splits. I used the lap button which screwed with the mile markers in my Garmin but the plus side is I recorded the 5k/10k and ten mile splits (all were marked on the route too which was a nice extra) .

There wasn't a lot to report over the middle section of the race. I settled in with the group. Miles 4 to 6 were a little worrysome and probably the point in the race when I was starting to doubt my ability to carry this through to the end. I could feel it a bit in the legs already. But I was still clocking away the fast miles and not needing to hang in there yet.
Miles 4 to 6 and 10k split;
5.59/6.01/6.00 - 37.23
Madness really when I think about it now.

I think this is the part where we hit kilmallock and looped around the arches. Strangely enough it was here where I started to feel OK. Maybe I can do this! The loop through kilmallock was great to be honest. Working in a pack of strong runners, crowd cheering. Definitely a boost. The pacer was great. Regular words of encouragement. We even had time for a bit of humor as he reminded the group now was not the time to push on. Just as he spoke a big alsatian barked from behind a fence. One of the lads joked "I think you might be wrong". We laughed. It was the second last time I would laugh in the race. Further up the road and I was feeling it now. A great group of kids out to support us shouting not long to go. That was at mile 9. I laughed. That was the last time I'd laugh.
Miles 7, 8, 9 and 10 splits;
6.01/6.00/6.08/6.02.
Ten mile split was 60.12. That's a big PB over ten miles... Doesn't count though. Haha.

Suffering like hell now. No two ways about it. Can't honestly say I was using any tricks to keep going. Just hanging on for dear life. At this stage the group started pulling away from me a little. I knew I was struggling but if I could just keep going there was a great time on the cards here. Entered into the last mile on my own and not sure if I can make it. Then all of a sudden two big jolts of cramp in both calves. I fecking let a roar out. Hurt like hell. Passed the sign for Charleville. Come on Paul. Even if you jog to the line you've a good time here. You can't quit now. Everything in me wanted to stop. More jolts of cramp. They're pretty frightening when they happen. Haha. I turn the bend and head down towards the 13M sign. I take a look at the watch and it feels like sub 80 is slipping away from me. I'm literally hobbling down the road with the left leg dragging. In bits. My buddy gave me some shouts of encouragement and shouted the clock time. Afterwards he told me how shocked he was at the state I was in. Haha. I pushed as hard as I could without seizing my legs up. I see the clock and it's 1.19.45. Ticking away but at this stage I know I'll probably amble across the line just under. Official time was 1.19.48. Gun time was four seconds slower at 1.19.52. Mile splits for 11/12/13;
6.11/6.08/6.27

Crossed the line in bits and was helped to a chair. I'm not melodramatic honestly. I was just in pieces. I'm not sure how I ran that 6.27. It felt a lot slower to be honest. Sub 79 was lost in the last three miles but on reflection I was very happy with the result. Just didn't like the way it came about. That race kicked the crap out of me. Harrowing to be honest. It's funny. You train and train and feel strong as an ox but then get the crap kicked out of you by the race. Not complaining tho. 2 minutes off my pb and improving all the time.

Absolute highlight of the day was our mini Boards reunion. Met up with aquinn, misterpaul , MurphD, diegob, yaboya and annapr. Genuinely the highlight of my day. I love meeting Boardsies and want to meet more of the gang in the next while. Something special about meeting the people that share your running journey every step of the way. A philosophical end to my report.

I have to finish up by acknowledging Luke. The training has been magnificent and very specifically tailored. The gains are there to see. Sometimes the numbers don't tell the whole story though. The sheer grit and determination isn't just a personality thing. It's developed through great coaching. Those sessions target a lot more than just simple physiological responses. I count myself as very lucky.

So cross country should be a doddle in comparison....................

ariana`

This is one i am waiting for... no pressure

Swashbuckler

Mellow Yellow 26.2 wrote:

I gave you a follow on Strava to keep a closer eye on your training. This is one of the best logs here Quality race well done. One of my training buddies was just in ahead of you

Cheers man. Just followed you back. A hell of a collection of runners you own! Appreciate the comments. Haven't had a proper chance to compile a decent report yet but I was passed by a few at the end. I barely made it to the line to be honest.

MY BAD

I gave you a follow on Strava to keep a closer eye on your training. This is one of the best logs here Quality race well done. One of my training buddies was just in ahead of you :pac:

Kellygirl

Swashbuckler wrote: »

If it's OK I'll forego my usual update of the week and cut to the race report (when baba gives me a minutes rest). Basically the week was a nice little taper.
Monday easy 7M. Tuesday easy 7M. Wednesday a handy enough session of 1M at 6.10. 3mins jog. 4x2min at 5.45 off 2mins if I remember correctly. Thursday easy 6M. Friday off. Saturday 3M Shakeout.
Nothing major to report on the running front. Felt great all week and the taper had me as fresh as I would want to be but still primed. Race report to come.

Looking forward to this one!!

Swashbuckler

If it's OK I'll forego my usual update of the week and cut to the race report (when baba gives me a minutes rest). Basically the week was a nice little taper.
Monday easy 7M. Tuesday easy 7M. Wednesday a handy enough session of 1M at 6.10. 3mins jog. 4x2min at 5.45 off 2mins if I remember correctly. Thursday easy 6M. Friday off. Saturday 3M Shakeout.
Nothing major to report on the running front. Felt great all week and the taper had me as fresh as I would want to be but still primed. Race report to come.

Safiri

Cracking run man! Well deserved:)

skyblue46

Have a good one P. Best of luck.