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NBP: National Broadband Plan Announced

ED E

They've published!

The government has published a new map outlining in detail 700,000 rural homes and businesses which will be connected to state-subsidised broadband of at least 30 megabits per second (Mbs) from 2016.

http://www.independent.ie/business/technology/news/revealed-700000-homes-and-businesses-to-get-subsidised-fast-broadband-in-new-plan-30769126.html

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Johnboy1951

and that we will have shovels in the ground and work under way in 2019 to bring high-speed fibre to some of those homes.

Maybe I am just cynical, but this made me wonder why he felt it necessary to insert that word some.

Was it a direct indication of what the NBP will be? Fibre to some and something else to the rest?

fritzelly

KOR101 wrote: »

Leo in the Dail on Tuesday.
and that we will have shovels in the ground and work under way in 2019

From September to later in the year to next year to this decade

LMAO

tsue921i8wljb3

KOR101 wrote: »

Leo in the Dail on Tuesday.

I assume that the normal procurement process is being followed. I met the Ministers, Deputies Naughten and Donohoe, on this issue just last week. I will ask the Minister for Communications, Climate Action and Environment to give the Deputy a more detailed answer than I can. I am confident it is on track and we will be able to sign a contract, and that we will have shovels in the ground and work under way in 2019 to bring high-speed fibre to some of those homes. It will be the biggest single public investment in rural Ireland in a very long time, as big a project in many ways as rural electrification.

I look forward to having the contracts signed.

Hopefully there wasn't a massive intake of breath and mass faintings when they opened the tender and saw the figures quoted.

KOR101

Leo in the Dail on Tuesday.

I assume that the normal procurement process is being followed. I met the Ministers, Deputies Naughten and Donohoe, on this issue just last week. I will ask the Minister for Communications, Climate Action and Environment to give the Deputy a more detailed answer than I can. I am confident it is on track and we will be able to sign a contract, and that we will have shovels in the ground and work under way in 2019 to bring high-speed fibre to some of those homes. It will be the biggest single public investment in rural Ireland in a very long time, as big a project in many ways as rural electrification.

I look forward to having the contracts signed.

tsue921i8wljb3

user1842 wrote: »

It should have been part of the agreement with Eir to cover these houses. They are clearly commercially viable as Eir fibre will pass right by them.

To say that these houses are not commercially viable is a joke.

I understand the reason for removing them is that they can't get 30mb but that does not automatically put them into the intervention area. The intervention area is where it is not commercially viable to rollout broadband.

When the Department were updating the map the should have realised this and not just circle houses without agreeing with Eir to add these circles their fibre roll out.

This kind of messing undermines the 300k Eir roll out and the agreement with the Government.

These houses are exchange fed via ADSL2. They sit between 2 VDSL cabinets.

Honestly I hope/assume that Eir will just cover them, it makes no sense not too.

I think the issue is that these premises were not "discovered" until after the agreement was signed. I place the blame squarely on open eir. They had pre-qual data for all these lines and they should have known of their existence.

Having said that the Department did submit a list of such premises to eir asking for them to be covered and it does seem, in some areas at least, that they are being done.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=107616474&postcount=4716

user1842

Siena Gigantic Backyard wrote: »

They have marked each premises that can't get 30Mb. I suppose they could make fields, carparks and the like yellow but that would not really be helping anyone.

It should have been part of the agreement with Eir to cover these houses. They are clearly commercially viable as Eir fibre will pass right by them.

To say that these houses are not commercially viable is a joke.

I understand the reason for removing them is that they can't get 30mb but that does not automatically put them into the intervention area. The intervention area is where it is not commercially viable to rollout broadband.

When the Department were updating the map the should have realised this and not just circle houses without agreeing with Eir to add these circles their fibre roll out.

This kind of messing undermines the 300k Eir roll out and the agreement with the Government.

These houses are exchange fed via ADSL2. They sit between 2 VDSL cabinets.

Honestly I hope/assume that Eir will just cover them, it makes no sense not too.

BandMember

Rodin wrote: »

I'd scrap it altogether.

Mobile broadband is the way to go.

So much cheaper.

Ah good evening Mr. Bolger, we've been expecting you.....

[Deleted User]

Rodin wrote: »

I'd scrap it altogether.

Mobile broadband is the way to go.

So much cheaper.

Nice bait I r8 8/8.

I'm not even going to seriously respond to a point that has been consistently rebutted on this topic and others related to rural broadband.

tsue921i8wljb3

Rodin wrote: »

I'd scrap it altogether.

Mobile broadband is the way to go.

So much cheaper.

Good man. A visionary like you is just what the country needs.

tsue921i8wljb3

listermint wrote: »

But its no accurate though if it was the areas around them would also be yellow.

Its - 'ridiculous' is what it is.

They have marked each premises that can't get 30Mb. I suppose they could make fields, carparks and the like yellow but that would not really be helping anyone.

Rodin

I'd scrap it altogether.

Mobile broadband is the way to go.

So much cheaper.

listermint

Siena Gigantic Backyard wrote: »

It has been adjusted. The yellow dots would have originally been dark blue and will need to be covered under the NBP which in itself will not be trivial because of their location.

It all stemmed from the original poor mapping practice of drawing a 1KM radius circle around each cabinet and assuming every premises within was covered. eir must have known about such cases but nothing was said and we ended up with the current mess.

But its no accurate though if it was the areas around them would also be yellow.

Its - 'ridiculous' is what it is.

BArra

Those houses marked in amber were originally included in the 300k, the dark blue around them means 30mb is available but..it's not, they just ambered the houses when eir reduced their ftth rollout

tsue921i8wljb3

listermint wrote: »

The map ergo should be adjusted then because they are not providing coverage to the fields around them nor the roads. So its not accurate.

It has been adjusted. The yellow dots would have originally been dark blue and will need to be covered under the NBP which in itself will not be trivial because of their location.

It all stemmed from the original poor mapping practice of drawing a 1KM radius circle around each cabinet and assuming every premises within was covered. eir must have known about such cases but nothing was said and we ended up with the current mess.

listermint

Siena Gigantic Backyard wrote: »

It is the result of homes that were ostensibly covered by FTTC that transpired were not actually receiving at least 30Mb for various reasons. I think there were 80000 such premises at last count scattered throughout the country.

The map ergo should be adjusted then because they are not providing coverage to the fields around them nor the roads. So its not accurate.

tsue921i8wljb3

listermint wrote: »

Did they literally just put circles around the houses...?

That map doesnt even make sense. You obviously are not covering the areas if they are an island of colour surrounded.

It is the result of homes that were ostensibly covered by FTTC that transpired were not actually receiving at least 30Mb for various reasons. I think there were 80000 such premises at last count scattered throughout the country.

listermint

Did they literally just put circles around the houses...?

That map doesnt even make sense. You obviously are not covering the areas if they are an island of colour surrounded.

user1842

I feel sorry for these guys. Fibre, fibre everywhere but..........
(I would hope EIR would cover these guys as fibre is passing within 10 meters of some properties. However as there is no sign of any work, with regard to the light blue area, I would not hold out hope).

BarryM

There were/are many errors leading to the present fiasco.

1 Instead of slavishly following the UK, principally, the physical network, owned by the state at the time, should have been separated from the service suppliers in the privatisation.
2 A policy of investment in baseline infrastructure for telecoms, with sharing between public and private money, should have been implemented.
3 Other state owned enterprises, ESB. CIE, the Guards, etc., etc. should have been required to coordinate their telecoms investments.
4 State services, such as breast check, flu vaccine, exam management, CSO, etc., should be required to provide "first mover" investment in data management, to create basic investment.

+++

Some aspects of these could and should be implemented.

Marlow

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

'Allow'? It could not be prevented under law ....... what does the writer think should have been done about that?

This is not about allowing or disallowing. Eircom PLC (as a group) could have been and were planning to do that rollout anyhow.

The stunt they pulled .. and this is what the writer is on about .. is that they told the government, that they would roll it out 2 years earlier/quicker, committed to deadlines and the premises were then removed from the NBP. If they had stayed earmarked under the NBP, it would have been feasable for example for SIRO to cover these premises.

A lot of these premises have broadband in some form or shape, be it from regional providers, mobile broadband, even sub-standard ADSL1. The requirement of the NBP was 30 Mbit/s minimum and scalable upwards from there.

By removing the premises from the NBP, the government deemed to have saved a few bob, but essentially derailed the NBP.

/M

bennyineire

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

'Allow'? It could not be prevented under law ....... what does the write think should have been done about that?

With most of the rest of the article I do agree.
I believe it would be preferable to have a slower roll out on electricity network, fully owned by the tax payer.
Even at a much higher cost!

But he suggesting ridiculous things like getting Irish water and the ESB to put in ducting. The vast majority of light civil works by Irish water and the ESB is been done in Urban areas.

We just need to build the FXXking thing now, no more delays even if it does cost more

Johnboy1951

rodge123 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/eile/brainstorm/2018/0924/995704-time-for-a-reboot-on-irelands-broadband-plan/

Would they just shut up and let the goverment spend whatever they want in the nbp!
Sign it dennnissssssss!

The reason for this vastly higher than expected subsidy is due to the ridiculous decision to allow Eir to carve out the 300,000 most commercially viable premises in the original intervention area proposed for the NBP.

'Allow'? It could not be prevented under law ....... what does the writer think should have been done about that?

With most of the rest of the article I do agree.
I believe it would be preferable to have a slower roll out on electricity network, fully owned by the tax payer.
Even at a much higher cost!

rodge123

https://www.rte.ie/eile/brainstorm/2018/0924/995704-time-for-a-reboot-on-irelands-broadband-plan/

Would they just shut up and let the goverment spend whatever they want in the nbp!
Sign it dennnissssssss!

Poulgorm

user1842 wrote: »

I really worry about the future of this. An extra network is being creating on top of another providers network and pole infrastructure. Basically it puts Eir in the driving seat and will be a total mess when it comes to repairs, upkeep and new connections once the network is built.
What happens when Eir changes owner again? or this consortium have a disagreement and part ways in the future.
Network industries are natural monopolies and should never be in the hands of private companies.
I really, really hope this does not end in tears but I think it will.

When (if?) the rural part of the country has FTTH, Eir's copper network will become obsolete. Eir want to get out of copper anyway. Eir will be glad to be rid of the obligation to supply and maintain a copper network to rural Ireland. They have already said that they want to ditch it.

So, your fears are unfounded, I think

dashoonage

Nuphor wrote: »

Spotted https://www.nationalbroadbandireland.ie/ with a "Coming Soon" message just after the announcement (relatively recently registered in August).

Seems to have been updated today with a password prompt - guess we'll see something here over the next few weeks/months.

never mind.

Nuphor

Spotted https://www.nationalbroadbandireland.ie/ with a "Coming Soon" message just after the announcement (relatively recently registered in August).

Seems to have been updated today with a password prompt - guess we'll see something here over the next few weeks/months.

fritzelly

The whole thing gets dodgier every passing day

tsue921i8wljb3

Another article raising the issue of Denis O'Brien having any part of this process. It is still unclear if DOB has actually put any money into the consortium or if Actavo are simply there as a logistics supplier.

Something that has not really been mentioned is the withdrawal of John Laing. As the article states a lot of serious players have now left and questions need to be asked about whether the consortium's funding is secure.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/technology/denis-o-brien-s-entry-provides-another-twist-to-state-s-broadband-saga-1.3636244

Also I had not realised that it was the Kelly Group that had built the enet trial network in Ballyseedy.

https://www.kelly.co.uk/case-studies/enet-ftth-tralee/s677/

rob808

westyIrl wrote: »

Just noticed that the DCCAE published this on youtube today. Just usual gibberish really.

However, @2:05

Naughten said somewhat similar in the Dáil yesterday. They do seem to be differentiating for some reason.

Jim

The 100mb a EU target that why he probably said it in the Dail.

westyIrl

Just noticed that the DCCAE published this on youtube today. Just usual gibberish really.

However, @2:05

100Mbps to the home and 1Gbps to businesses.

Naughten said somewhat similar in the Dáil yesterday. They do seem to be differentiating for some reason.

Jim