The Frederick St protest and reaction

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Every Garda in that footage as visible numbers as far as I can see. Can you give a timestamp for the one that doesn't?

Footage in the last 15 seconds. No visible numbers on several Gardai. Precautionary on their part. But utterly in contravention of their code of practice.

The people on here who say property owners have every right to do what they want with their properties, I'm interested:

1. Would you be happy if every house on your block was boarded up and left empty for years?
2. Would you be happy if 30 people moved into one house next door to you?

If you wouldn't be happy with that then what would you do about it? Just put up with it because it's someone else's property so they're entitled to do whatever they want with it?

tayto lover wrote: »

If no criminal offence was being committed then why did the court make the order?
My bet is that the judge didn't agree with you.

A misunderstanding of legal proceedings here. Judges make orders for a variety of circumstances where possibly no criminal offences have taken place (search warrants, seizure of documents, etc). There may or may not be criminal offences at play here but the judge's order is not relevant to that.

BBFAN wrote: »

The people on here who say property owners have every right to do what they want with their properties, I'm interested:

1. Would you be happy if every house on your block was boarded up and left empty for years?
2. Would you be happy if 30 people moved into one house next door to you?

If you wouldn't be happy with that then what would you do about it? Just put up with it because it's someone else's property so they're entitled to do whatever they want with it?

Every house on that street is not boarded up.

When those properties are redeveloped, its highly unlikely they will be social housing or low cost rentals. The muppets who occupied them have possibly ensured the landlord will get planning for the property and it will come to market with high cost rental units. If I was the owner, I'd be putting in planning for a couple of apartments now, the council would be wary of refusing it in case the owner publicises that planning was refused even though he tried to make it available for rent.

30 people can move into a property if the property has planning for enough rental units to accommodate them.

tayto lover wrote: »

There are loads of council houses boarded up...
I counted 18 in about a half-hour drive around Dundalk

Louth County Council have admitted that they're financially broke, though, and don't have anything left in their housing budget.

davo10 wrote: »

Every house on that street is not boarded up.

When those properties are redeveloped, its highly unlikely they will be social housing or low cost rentals. The muppets who occupied them have possibly ensured the landlord will get planning for the property and it will come to market with high cost rental units. If I was the owner, I'd be putting in planning for a couple of apartments now, the council would be wary of refusing it in case the owner publicises that planning was refused even though he tried to make it available for rent.

30 people can move into a property if the property has planning for enough rental units to accommodate them.

So, no answer to my question then?

tayto lover wrote: »

I have been saying this since the poor unfortunates died on the streets in the cold snaps over the last number of years.

Not saying this against you personally, but they're always 'poor unfortunates' when they die in doorways.

So long as they have the misfortune to have breath in their lungs, they're often considered scum, junkies, bums, and so on.

What exactly is the difference between the average person on the homeless list, and the rough sleeper, except that the latter typically refuses to take an offer of accommodation?

BBFAN wrote: »

So, no answer to my question then?

Are all the houses on that street boarded up? No.

If 30 people were occupying a house next door illegally, I would hope the gardai and the owner would turf them out on their holes.

There's your answer.

NasserShammaz wrote: »

Go back under your bridge 17yr old :rolleyes:

The geese appreciation society are getting terribly rude these days.....

Turner

Seathrun66 wrote: »

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Every Garda in that footage as visible numbers as far as I can see. Can you give a timestamp for the one that doesn't?

Footage in the last 15 seconds. No visible numbers on several Gardai. Precautionary on their part. But utterly in contravention of their code of practice.

These sh1tebag "peaceful protestors" are already identifying members of this Garda Public Order unit on social media, even posting where they eat their lunch on their break from work.

What next? Protest outside the homes of the Gardai?

Protest outside where their children go to school?

The government and the new Garda commissioner need to grow a pair and protect our front line services from these parasites.

end of the road

bubblypop wrote: »

Why though?
Why do you think people need to show their face?

for the protection of the protesters. we can't have masked unidentifiable hoodies roming around with the backing of hard to identify gardai. it's not how a democratic state works.

the_syco wrote: »

Everyone involved was masked to prevent future intimidation by the crusties.

The crusties are demanding that everyones identities are released, so that the crusties can harass them.

their reasons for being masked aren't valid. if wearing the balaclava, the gardai involved are required to wear a helmet on top of the balaclava as the equipment as a whole works to protect them from either dangerous substances or other. the equipment isn't for protecting identity. the hoodies on the other hand had no valid reason to be masked given they were there as part of a legitimate act of law enforcement. i don't care why exactly the protesters may want to know their identity, i care that by hiding their identity there is the potential that should an incident have happened via these individuals, it could be impossible to bring a prosecution against them.

davo10 wrote: »

Are all the houses on that street boarded up? No.

If 30 people were occupying a house next door illegally, I would hope the gardai and the owner would turf them out on their holes.

There's your answer.

Nope, that's not the question I asked.

end of the road

Captain Obvious wrote: »

I thought the main issue was housing for the homeless.

it is, but hoodies with no identity being given backing by the gardai is also a main issue.

Captain Obvious wrote: »

In what way would it have enhanced protection? It certainly wouldn't have given them any protection.

it would have insured that had the hoodies done anything they shouldn't, they would be identifiable for prosecution. i'm not bothered about the hoodies protection, because as they are there acting in an enforcement capacity, they should be identifiable.

Captain Obvious wrote: »

As has been pointed out, the scene commander can tell them what to wear. What difference do you think it would have made for them to be wearing their helmets?

it would have made a huge difference, because the helmet and balaclava together is apparently the required gear, and by wearing it we could be genuinely confident that they may have felt there was a genuine potential threat.

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Nonsense. The same people will always find some ridiculous claim to level at Gardaí with zero evidence.

then the gardai have nothing to worry about. as there is no evidence for the allegations made against them by protesters, then the allegations would be found to be untrue.

tayto lover

Deleted User wrote: »

Louth County Council have admitted that they're financially broke, though, and don't have anything left in their housing budget.

From what I'm told most of them only need a lick of paint and the gas/electricity re-connected. A couple of weeks rent would cover it.

Turner

end of the road wrote: »

i don't care why exactly the protesters may want to know their identity

They are in the process of identifying members of the public urder unit working that day on an anonymous facebook account. Even posting where one member eats his lunch.

One garda has been followed already this year and sprayed with acid while travelling home.

So I can see and care why these Gardai would want to hide their identity.

BBFAN wrote: »

Nope, that's not the question I asked.

Are your questions relevant to this thread considering that all the houses are not boarded up and the 30 people next door were doing so in spite of a court order?

I know this is AH, but if you are trying to make a point, at least make it relevant to the theme of the thread.

tayto lover

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Not saying this against you personally, but they're always 'poor unfortunates' when they die in doorways.

So long as they have the misfortune to have breath in their lungs, they're often considered scum, junkies, bums, and so on.

What exactly is the difference between the average person on the homeless list, and the rough sleeper, except that the latter typically refuses to take an offer of accommodation?

I have worked with these people in the past. In my opinion many are addicts or in recovery and a high percentage have mental health issues.
Even if housed they would need help from several agencies and follow up. Regardless of that nobody should suffer exclusion for being sick. My wife helps in a Soup Kitchen and she says the numbers are on the increase so the problem has to be addressed.

weldoninhio

BBFAN wrote: »

Nope, that's not the question I asked.

If all the houses on my street were properly boarded up, why would I care? Peace and quiet.

If 30 people moved in next door, again why would I care. Once they kept quiet I couldn’t care less how many or how few people live there.

davo10 wrote: »

Are your questions relevant to this thread considering that all the houses are not boarded up and the 30 people next door were doing so in spite of a court order?

I know this is AH, but if you are trying to make a point, at least make it relevant to the theme of the thread.

My questions are very relevant, you're simply trying to avoid answering them.

I don't know what you don't understand about the point I'm trying to make.

The point is those who argue that property owners have the right to do whatever they want with their property are wrong and if it was the property next door to you then you'd quickly change your point of view.

gctest50

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Not saying this against you personally, but they're always 'poor unfortunates' when they die in doorways.
............

like the Apollo house chef ?

[utl]https://www.thesun.ie/news/1489621/homeless-man-found-dead-in-dublin-city-centre-was-convicted-paedophile-who-wilfully-passed-hiv-to-a-woman/[/url]

fxotoole

Samsong wrote: »

It's time to get rid of bloated public sector pensions and put the money towards the country and its infrastructure

No. It’s really not.

tayto lover wrote: »

I have worked with these people in the past. In my opinion many are addicts or in recovery and a high percentage have mental health issues.

This isn't a competition, but for what it's worth, i've also worked with homeless services. Plenty of people in the community have addiction issues and mental health problems; in my experience, what separates the homeless from everybody else, is an absence of personal and family support.

McMurphy

Turner wrote: »

They are in the process of identifying members of the public urder unit working that day on an anonymous facebook account. Even posting where one member eats his lunch.

Curious as to how they're identifying them, seeing as they were masked?

One garda has been followed already this year and sprayed with acid while travelling home.

So I can see and care why these Gardai would want to hide their identity.

If this is true, it's a thundering disgrace no two ways about it. Is there any link to the story available so i could read a bit more about it?

As said countless times on the thread already, the optics of the other nights shenanigans weren't good, one would have thought that someone from the higher echelons of the force might have used a bit more discretion, what with how some of the Garda/local communities relationships were strained during the water meter rows, and then the Paul Murphy/attempted stitch up in court thing.

They certainly could do with looking about changing their PR strategies.

http://www.thejournal.ie/garda-acid-attack-followed-4150780-Jul2018/

BBFAN wrote: »

My questions are very relevant, you're simply trying to avoid answering them.

I don't know what you don't understand about the point I'm trying to make.

The point is those who argue that property owners have the right to do whatever they want with their property are wrong and if it was the property next door to you then you'd quickly change your point of view.

Can you please link to the law that states that a property owner has to redevelop an empty property and make it habitable?

Property owners have a right to do whatever they want to do with their property as long as it is legal.

mynamejeff

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

Curious as to how they're identifying them, seeing as they were masked?

If this is true, it's a thundering disgrace no two ways about it. Is there any link to the story available so i could read a bit more about it?

As said countless times on the thread already, the optics of the other nights shenanigans weren't good, one would have thought that someone from the higher echelons of the force might have used a bit more discretion, what with how some of the Garda/local communities relationships were strained during the water meter rows, and then the Paul Murphy/attempted stitch up in court thing.

They certainly could do with looking about changing their PR strategies.

tayto lover

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

This isn't a competition, but for what it's worth, i've also worked with homeless services. Plenty of people in the community have addiction issues and mental health problems; in my experience, what separates the homeless from everybody else, is an absence of personal and family support.

Exactly, hence my mention of follow-up services even when eventually housed.

davo10 wrote: »

Can you please link to the law that states that a property owner has to redevelop an empty property and make it habitable?

Property owners have a right to do whatever they want to do with their property as long as it is legal.

Can you please answer the question?

tayto lover wrote: »

Exactly, hence my mention of follow-up services even when eventually housed.

Yep, my biggest bugbear with a lot of the social-media movements in support of housing, is that they seem to believe homelessness will be solved by having one roof for every member of the homeless population.

Anybody who's ever had anything to do with a homeless person must roll their eyes at that notion.