dashcamdanny wrote: » The wages are considerably less for the ground workers .. Irish residents. Now doing a job they could have been doing for Dublin Bus with better T & Cs and wages. Dublin Bus has got alot better in recent years in quailty of service and still has work to do. But paying people less is not the way to fix it.
XPS_Zero wrote: » It's not full privatization though, we've tried that in the UK we know it was a disaster, we also know total state monopoly with unchecked union power dominating the entire network and holding the public to ransom is a disaster. This is a happy medium, one can disagree but I think it's a happy medium. We do it with other things too, our hospitals and schools and Unis are not all nationalized they are technically independent entities, often legally charities, with state funding (even the ones erroneously called "private" which are really fee paying). Plenty of countries that are known as big lefty socialist places do it with their healthcare system, private hospitals with public funding or a mix with manditory insurance (not a model I'd advocate I prefer single payer but still it happens) The system we had before the NTA was an utter embarrasement, and to think the govt of the day didn't even trust it's own rail company to run Metro and Luas so had to invent a new one out of whole cloth, that alone was a devestating indictment of the previous system. The NTA are not perfect, I can see them sitting in a board room removed from the realities of the service IE would work with and know about, which is why they need to talk to each other all the time and plan together, but they are better than what we have before. ffsake even under the much vaunted Luas model we still have them whinging about their f----g lunch!!!!
MJohnston wrote: » No, apologies, looks like you're right: At a guess, someone has input the data incorrectly. Wonder if that's showing up on RTPI screens too though!
Tarabuses wrote: » The planner is still showing Sandymount for 175 buses heading towards City West however the RTPI screen in Dundrum shows Kingswood. The screen in UCD doesn't show 175 times at all but has an information line saying that the 175 is now in operation!
Qrt wrote: » Kingswood?? They ought to change that, considering it's a completely different Kingswood to that of the luas stop.
MJohnston wrote: » I'm sorry, but what has that got to do with your original point that people apparently need to see an Irish company run bus services over a foreign one? You think foreign companies are more likely to push for lower wages than Irish companies? I see absolutely zero evidence of that being true.
dashcamdanny wrote: » We already have a state owned company already doing it! With 1000s of people employed. Getting a decent wage. How can you see no evidence? Please consider the future... And how our sneaky politicians have always operated. Privatising State assets is not in the public interest as past events has clearly showed. New owners are driven by the need to increase shareholder returns. Full stop. A driver in Go-ahead has a work his/her way upto 32k after a few years. With terrible T&Cs In Dublin that means a family income support from welfare for a man/woman trying to provide for their family. If they tender and win again, that means many DB drivers will have to transfer or be redundant, and have a crazy drop in wages after one year.
dashcamdanny wrote: » We already have a state owned company already doing it! With 1000s of people employed. Getting a decent wage. How can you see no evidence? Please consider the future... And how our sneaky politicians have always operated. Privatising State assets is not in the public interest as past events has clearly showed. New owners are driven by the need to increase shareholder returns. Full stop. A driver in Go-ahead has a work his/her way upto 32k after a few years. With terrible T&Cs In Dublin that means a family income support from welfare for a man/woman trying to provide for their family. If they tender and win again, that means many DB drivers will have to transfer or be redundant, and have a crazy drop in wages after one year. This has me and many others very very worried . Im bloody terrified to be honest. I am well aware there are many, (especially here) that have a big problem with Dublin Bus for some reason or other, but the company is turning around with regard service, especially with the new blood coming in all the time. FG selling us off and providing a watered down version of privatisation which will send large amounts of tax payers money to the rich and less to the guy working. In this case, a foreign companies shareholders. And will ultimately effect the service
_Kaiser_ wrote: » It still seems nuts to me that Dublin Bus are disposing of what are apparently still perfectly serviceable vehicles (the AV's) that are still in daily use elsewhere, and replacing them with inferior rubbish (IMO anyway) at taxpayer expense.
dfx- wrote: » There's hundreds of them, possibly thousands in the UK. I've a wide selection of 18 year old buses to get home each day. The DB buses are all in better state and have bench seats too.
devnull wrote: » Show someone who hasn't used a bus for a while an AV and the inside of it and they'll think of all the negative perceptions of the past and stick with their car, because quite frankly it looks similar to what it did 20 years ago inside. What newer buses are doing is showing people who would never use a bus that things have changed and they have personal space, Wifi, USB sockets, brighter interiors, passenger information etc. And getting people to shift from cars is vital to stop gridlock in our city. Appreciate that there are a group of people who feel different, but generally these are people who are using the bus or have to use the bus, or are enthusiasts, I know many I work with who have switched because the modernising of interiors. It's true there are ALX400s still around in the UK, but I don't see any ex DB vehicles in the UK that work anything like the stressful duties that they would have done under DB.
devnull wrote: » Personally I believe the quality of service offered to the public is more important than anything else, I note that the poster making the point about privatisation seemed to be more concerned with the welfare of the staff, rather than the public of which the service is set up to serve. The public must always come first in any public service.
Stephen15 wrote: » Not true if any current DB workers did have to switch over they would be entitled to a TUPE agreement whereby they will be entitled to the same T+Cs and pension as they are already getting. Happens all the time in London Ile give a hypothetical example if Joe Bloggs drove the number 20 bus which is operated by Metroline and supposing Metroline lost the tender for that route to Arriva then Joe Bloggs would continue driving the number 20 bus with the same pay terms and conditions and pension he would get from Metroline. The same would apply if DB employees had to switch over to Go-Ahead or any other private operator. This is something you are entitled to under European law.http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/contracts_of_employment/transfer_of_business.html
punisher5112 wrote: » They only keep current employment conditions for 1 year. They would then fall under a new contract with the new employer
punisher5112 wrote: » They only keep current employment conditions for 1 year. They would then fall under a new contract with the new employer. It is the start of low low wages and it's a joke to be honest.
SINGAPORE: From Wednesday (Jun 1), bus captains that join SBS Transit will be able to earn a gross monthly salary of up to S$3,460 within their first year, more than 15 per cent higher than before. In a joint news release on Wednesday, SBS Transit and the the National Transport Workers Union (NTWU) said Singaporeans and Singapore Permanent Residents (PR) that join as bus captains will start at a monthly basic salary of S$1,950, which is S$175 more than the current S$1,775 starting salary. They will also receive a sign-on bonus of S$3,000.
This comes on the heels of similar pay hikes by Singapore's two other public bus operators as competition for local bus captains intensifies. SBS Transit increased its starting salary from S$1,775 to S$1,950 in June while UK-based bus operator Go-Ahead increased its starting salary from the S$1,865 it announced in February to S$1,950 in July.
The public transport operator also announced a slew of other enhancements to its staff benefits, which will take effect between Sep 1 to Jan 1, 2017. It will be raising the number of days of annual leave for SMRT Buses employees to up to 21 days, which is seven days more than currently offered, depending on their years of service. This is in addition to two days of eldercare leave. All staff will be given free travel on all public bus and train networks throughout the year. The company will also roll out an enhanced flexible benefits scheme - E-FLEX - for all of its Singaporean and PR bus captains. Under the scheme, bus captains will receive credits of between S$350 and S$1,050, depending on their years of service, which they can use to buy portable medical insurance through the Integrated Shield Plans and enjoy better medical coverage and ward eligibility if hospitalised. With this new scheme, along with their existing MediShield Life and insurance riders provided by SMRT, Singaporean and PR staff will enjoy full hospitalisation coverage with no deductibles or co-payment for B2 wards at restructured hospitals.
SINGAPORE: Public bus operator Tower Transit Singapore said on Monday (Jul 10) it will raise the salaries of its bus drivers and other staff by 3.7 per cent – bumping up the basic pay for its new bus drivers to more than S$2,000 for the first time. The annual wage increment will benefit more than 800 staff in Singapore, the UK-headquartered transport operator said.
AlekSmart wrote: » The is,however,provision for the alteration of such terms,by way of collective bargaining,or by the new employer being able to prove that the maintenance of such Conditions is counter to the Companies ability to function.
GM228 wrote: » That is something specific to the UK and not the rest of the EU when dealing with changing T&Cs. It can be applied for economic, technical or organisational reasons and is known as the "ETO Defence", strictly speaking it is not in compliance with the TUPE Directive (2001/23/EC), that was never the intended use of the defence although the UK courts and EAT have upheld such defences. In Ireland and the rest of the EU the ETO Defence applies only to dismissals which is in accordance with the Directive. A dismissal due to TUPE is automatically unfair unless the employer successfully raises the defence.
dashcamdanny wrote: » We already have a state owned company already doing it! With 1000s of people employed. Getting a decent wage.
dashcamdanny wrote: » How can you see no evidence? Please consider the future... And how our sneaky politicians have always operated. Privatising State assets is not in the public interest as past events has clearly showed. New owners are driven by the need to increase shareholder returns. Full stop.
dashcamdanny wrote: » A driver in Go-ahead has a work his/her way upto 32k after a few years. With terrible T&Cs
dashcamdanny wrote: » If they tender and win again, that means many DB drivers will have to transfer or be redundant, and have a crazy drop in wages after one year.
dashcamdanny wrote: » This has me and many others very very worried . Im bloody terrified to be honest.
dashcamdanny wrote: » I am well aware there are many, (especially here) that have a big problem with Dublin Bus for some reason or other, but the company is turning around with regard service, especially with the new blood coming in all the time.
dashcamdanny wrote: » FG selling us off and providing a watered down version of privatisation which will send large amounts of tax payers money to the rich and less to the guy working. In this case, a foreign companies shareholders.
dashcamdanny wrote: » And will ultimately effect the service
Yggr of Asgard wrote: » That is your opinion, mine as Shareholder of that company I am disputing that I as I think that they are not providing value for money and are paying a too high wage with inflexible working practices. But I'm not advocating of taking back that what negotiated.
Yggr of Asgard wrote: » And yet they received an overwhelming amount of applications and had no trouble finding people who want to work there.
Yggr of Asgard wrote: » Rightfully so and that needs to be appreciated but your fear is no different than the fear of anybody else in sectors where there is competition with the need for cost reductions and new work practices. We are not living in a system that guarantees work and some of us are used to that for all of their life, other just discover it now.
Yggr of Asgard wrote: » There have been improvements (thanks to TFI/NTA) with better buses, better infrastructure and also better drivers (at least on the route I use) but too often it's still the good old DB. Buses not showing or 3 in a row. And sometimes I even prefer DB over, for example, Swords Express, but we can not wait and starting to source the right provider is the right thing to do for our nations transport system.
Yggr of Asgard wrote: » And previously it sends it to the well paid and well-secured people working for DB.
Yggr of Asgard wrote: » And does it matter if the profits are going to an Irish Company or a foreign company? Giving that most likely the bus you drive has been partly financed by the EU this is kind of a strange point. EU give me money, but please ensure only Irish companies can reap the reward of your investment.
Yggr of Asgard wrote: » Hopefully for the better.
dublinman1990 wrote: » I saw one of GAI's single deck training buses out on the Blackrock bypass this afternoon. I presume that this bus was going out from Dun Laoghaire as I hadn't seen any other GA buses on my travels in Blackrock. There is a photograph on Flickr of a GA London Gemini in it's red livery doing some route training in Bray a few weeks ago.
punisher5112 wrote: I was told the union didn't sign off on it so deal is 1 year.
superg wrote: » If this is actually the case, whats the point of being in a union if their actions subject their members to worse protections than the law is supposed to provide?
devnull wrote: » Show someone who hasn't used a bus for a while an AV and the inside of it and they'll think of all the negative perceptions of the past and stick with their car, because quite frankly it looks similar to what it did 20 years ago inside. I know people have been attracted out of cars by the new vehicles because my friends and colleagues are some of the people who have done it. What newer buses are doing is showing people who would never use a bus that things have changed and they have personal space, Wifi, USB sockets, brighter interiors, passenger information etc. And getting people to shift from cars is vital to stop gridlock in our city. Appreciate that there are a group of people who feel different, but generally most of these are people who are using the bus, have to use the bus, or are enthusiasts, I know many I work with who have switched because the modernising of interiors because it makes them feel (rightly or wrongly) something changed. It's true there are ALX400s still around in the UK, but I don't see any ex DB vehicles in the UK that work anything like the stressful duties that they would have done under DB, where they have a very short time between runs and can be on the route for 12 hours a dat at least.
dfx- wrote: » wrongly. Newer buses at 400k a go. Heck of a price for a small sliver of anecdotal customers who 'feel different' about WiFi and USB charging.
