dense wrote: » I'm not sure whether you're being disingenuous or whether you just don't understand the question. I didn't ask you whether you think the world needs to go carbon neutral. I asked you to explain what affect Ireland will have on global warming by going carbon neutral. So for all the young or slightly more naive readers out there looking out for someone they can trust to tell them about Ireland's past affect on climate change and how a fossil fuel free Ireland will affect climate change in the future, here's your chance to give an honest answer. The more you avoid the question, or pretend to have been asked something else, the less credible you and the rest of those pushing the carbon neutral racket look.
Akrasia wrote: » Dense telling me I have no credibility is gas considering that you think NASA aren't trustworthy but Tony Heller aka Stephen Goddard is.
Akrasia wrote: » Ireland's contribution to global warming is greater than our proportion of the global population, therefore we have a greater obligation to act than the majority of the countries in the world, and as a member of the EU we have a much greater global influence than most other countries our size.
Doctor Jimbob wrote: » I assume the clever point you think you're making here is that Ireland is a small country and therefore reducing our emissions won't have any significant effect, right? Correct me if I'm wrong. The problem with that line of thinking is similar to people saying one vote won't make a difference. Of course it won't, by itself, but if everyone takes that attitude then nothing ever changes. Is there any actual reason you're against reducing emissions other than the socialist conspiracy stuff?
dense wrote: » The irony of you posting under an anonymous username scoffing at someone else posting under a username seems to have gone over your head.
But I believe NASA when they say they'd created a +0.5°C warming from adjustments for the US for the 20th century. [\quote] lol. You are such a liar. You can't say you believe someone when the only thing you believe about what they say is that they are dishonest. Your own trustworthiness goes when you can't explain what affect Ireland has had or can have on climate change. This is pure waffle; instead of scouring eco activists sites for moral cliches why not quantify the effect on climate change of this disproportionate global influence you have invented for Ireland? If you are going to make sweeping claims that Ireland has disproportionately globally influenced climate change you'll have to demonstrate that it is something other than a fuzzy idea you have read somewhere. Be scientific, use numbers and we'll have a look and see whether your previous faux pas of believing a 0.6% energy saving from the vacuum cleaner regulations was a "significant" energy saving was a one off or whether your idea of Ireland having a disproportionate global affect on global warming is more of the same hysterics. Ireland produce .11℅ of global co2 emissions but only have. 07% of the global population. The rest of your blathering is just a transparent effort to avoid answering my question. What are you afraid of dense?
Your own trustworthiness goes when you can't explain what affect Ireland has had or can have on climate change. This is pure waffle; instead of scouring eco activists sites for moral cliches why not quantify the effect on climate change of this disproportionate global influence you have invented for Ireland? If you are going to make sweeping claims that Ireland has disproportionately globally influenced climate change you'll have to demonstrate that it is something other than a fuzzy idea you have read somewhere. Be scientific, use numbers and we'll have a look and see whether your previous faux pas of believing a 0.6% energy saving from the vacuum cleaner regulations was a "significant" energy saving was a one off or whether your idea of Ireland having a disproportionate global affect on global warming is more of the same hysterics.
Akrasia wrote: » Ireland produce .11℅ of global co2 emissions but only have. 07% of the global population.
dense wrote: » I don't know who's mentoring you in how to debate, but they're not doing a very good job.
Dohnjoe wrote: » Again It's one person dogmatically circling the wagons on their personal beliefs with the rest of the participants "trying" to convince them of something they will never accept
Akrasia wrote: » I'm shocked that dense ignored my question. Here it is again 'OK then Dense. Let's try something different. What do you think caused climate change in the past before humans arrived?'
xckjoo wrote: » In case you missed it
Doctor Jimbob wrote: » You're great at demanding other people answer questions while ignoring those that people ask you.
“And Ireland cannot hide behind its small size and population. According to Ireland’s Environmental Protection Agency, Ireland has one of the highest levels of greenhouse gas emissions per person in the world.”
xckjoo wrote: » 'OK then Dense. Let's try something different. What do you think caused climate change in the past before humans arrived?'
Doctor Jimbob wrote: » Which of the oil companies do you work for dense?
dense wrote: » None. Which climate alarm clubs that can't explain their policies are you a member of Doctor Jimbob? If you're not a member of one of those outfits why are you blindly supporting their calls to transition us off of fossil fuels with no idea about whats going to supply the 155Twh of energy they supply if you're going to point blank refuse to explain what you think any of it will achieve? Apparently "Ireland is 'completely' off course to achieve climate change targets" but from the trite responses I'm getting here from those who are concerned by that, it appears that even if we were to meet the targets and subsequently stop using fossil fuels it is not going to have any affect on climate change, because no effect is being discussed, and none is being claimed.https://amp.independent.ie/business/farming/forestry-enviro/environment/ireland-completely-off-course-to-achieve-climate-change-targets-37153678.html If no one wants to make a claim that it will have an affect on climate change with an explanation as to how, we can therefore wrap this nonsense up by concluding that no one here or anywhere else is claiming or has ever claimed that any of these national measures regarding Ireland's emissions will affect global warming. Cue something about Akrasia deserving an answer to their through the looking glass question about what caused pre human climate change as a distraction from reality. They don't. Akrasia and the activists are leading you all up the river without a paddle with their nonsense and I think you're beginning to realise that.
dense wrote: » If no one wants to make a claim that it will have an affect on climate change with an explanation as to how, we can therefore wrap this nonsense up by concluding that no one here or anywhere else is claiming or has ever claimed that any of these national measures regarding Ireland's emissions will affect global warming.
Doctor Jimbob wrote: » None. I've stated several times I don't go all-in on the alarmist position, I just think it would be wise to be cautious with emissions. The rest of your post is just waffle twisting people's words to back up your position, so I'll just do what you've done with any questions you've been asked and ignore it.
Doctor Jimbob wrote: » Yep.
xckjoo wrote: » I must be psychic. Time to chuck in the job and join the circus :pac:
Akrasia wrote: » Dense demanding us attribute specific consequences to specific emissions is like an alcoholic demanding that a doctor explain specifically which bottle of cheap vodka gave him sirrhosis.
Vision That Ireland makes a rapid and just transition to a carbon free future.
dense wrote: » Please don't misrepresent what I have asked. People like myself and Dr. JimBob who are sceptical of alarmists are likely to become even more sceptical as a result of you doing it. I asked you to quantify Ireland's contribution to global warming The alarmists have already quantified the warming that they say is due to humans emitting CO2. They say that from an undefined "pre industrial" baseline, C02 emissions have caused a temperature rise of c 1°C. Drilling down further it is found that they also claim to be able to attribute specific responsibility for this rise in temperature to specific companies. Research undertaken by earth scientists suggests that "The climate crisis of the 21st century has been caused largely by just 90 companies, which between them produced nearly two-thirds of the greenhouse gas emissions generated since the dawning of the industrial age".https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2013/nov/20/90-companies-man-made-global-warming-emissions-climate-change As I have said earlier, not one alarmist NGO has ever explained what affect on global warming will occur if Ireland follows their demands to stop emitting C02. And not one alarmist has ever explained what they believe Ireland's contribution to global warming to be. Instead of scraping the bottom of the barrel and talking about cheap vodka and trying to reject the fact that the earth scientists can now attribute global warming to specific companies, leading to you now seeming to reject the suggestion that global warming is being caused by national emissions, why not simply demonstrate our national contribution to global warming and our potential to stop it? And if you believe Ireland has contributed to global warming please show your calculations which permit you to arrive at that conclusion. You're not being asked if you believe in the tooth fairy, you're being asked what share of global warming, if any, is attributable to Ireland. You have said Ireland's per capita emissions have disproportionately affected global warming. You are clearly making this up, and are fantasising if you cannot demonstrate this disproportionate affect on global warning that you are imagining. If that doesn't interest you (and it clearly doesn't), you could always try to explain where we're going to reliably get 155Twh of renewable energy from annually to substitute the fossil fuel energy that we currently use. It's all very well for the alarmists continually whining about our need to nationally transition off of fossil fuels, but they're going to need to outline what they think that's going to achieve in terms of global warming and offer intelligent solutions regarding what's going to replace them. The leftys are great at being alarmed, not so good at providing solutions.https://www.stopclimatechaos.ie/about/ Propaganda from the climate chaos alarmists, who also say they want to "engage" the public. Lots of vacuous bullshït there as there is from you too about Ireland's needing to accept its "fair share" of responsibility for causing climate change. And it's all trés cool hip and on trend as long as no one asks what share of global warming has been caused by Ireland. Cults and their followers don't like their policies being questioned, do they?
Akrasia wrote: » But if you insist in quantifying the heat ireland been responsible for, it's the equivalent heat of 2,921,882 Hiroshima nuclear bombs since 1998 (and rising)http://4hiroshimas.com/#Home
dense wrote: » It would be interesting to know why you think that Ireland's CO2 emissions have caused the equivalent heat of 2,921,882 Hiroshima nuclear bombs and what you think that translates to in terms of thousandths of a degree in a hypothetical 0.4°C degree of global warming scenario for that period, a period distinctly lacking any global warming. 2m of the total 2,000,000,000 Hiroshima bombs you were talking about is around 0.1% of them. I'll let you work out what 0.1% of any alleged temperature rise for the period equates to in degrees Celsius. Think along the lines of 0.0004 degrees for 0.4° warming. Statistical noise basically. Your initial figure could have been just plucked from thin air after all.
DanDan6592 wrote: » It'd be more interesting to know why you have yet to answer Akrasia's question: 'OK then Dense. Let's try something different. What do you think caused climate change in the past before humans arrived?'
