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Second Captains

ballsymchugh

Thought I'd update the OP with links and stuff for anyone who stumbles across this.

The former Off the Ball hosts have partnered with The Irish Times to do a series of weekly podcasts. They go online each Tuesday and cover a variety of sports, with a number of contributors including Sid Lowe, Richie Sadlier, Gerry Thornley and Shane Horgan.

They can be found:
On The Irish Times' site: http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/second-captains
On Soundcloud: https://soundcloud.com/secondcaptains-it-com
On iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/ie/podcast/second-captains-irish-times/id647893016?mt=2

Or if you prefer not to use iTunes for your podcasts, use this link in whatever app you use (Thanks to youcancallmeal): http://feeds.feedburner.com/secondcaptainsitcom

And here are their Twitter and Facebook accounts.

Cheers,
wnolan1992

so they're almost finished their gardening leave...

where will they end up?

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Raoul

Spare tickets are gone, sorry Scoobydoo! Glad to help out a couple of boardsies.

OldMrBrennan83

I got stuck going to an unexpected job today and couldn't shift the tickets. Ended up getting done and leaving Belfast at 4pm but not a hope of getting home and a bus into town before at least 7, so there's two empty seats there at least.

jaykay74

Was it any good ? Anyone there ?

dr.kenneth noisewater

Yeah it was really good. Neville very interesting guy, the lads hardly got to speak the last half hour. Didn't know where Ken was going with half the questions, seemed to get a bit flustered early on and lost his way then.

The Davestator

jaykay74 wrote: »

Was it any good ? Anyone there ?

I was there. Very good. Came on at 7 and spoke pretty much non stop until 8:30. Very insightful and funny at times.

Not as much 'banter' or laughs as other shows, more of a serious football chat. Himself and Ken disagreed a couple of times which was entertaining!

Beans_On

yeah was really good.

looking forward to hearing the pod to hear how the tension between him and Ken comes across.

dominatinMC

The Davestator wrote: »

I was there. Very good. Came on at 7 and spoke pretty much non stop until 8:30. Very insightful and funny at times.

Not as much 'banter' or laughs as other shows, more of a serious football chat. Himself and Ken disagreed a couple of times which was entertaining!

Sounds good, some of those OTB road shows are cringey with their level of "lads banter", stories, etc. That approach can be good in moderation, but it gets tedious really quickly IMO.

dulpit

Prediction: makes for a poor podcast. I've been to one of their live shows before, they are a different thing and generally don't translate well into a podcast. Ideally for the live shows they'd videotape them and issue as a video podcast, maybe in the future..

Onecoolcookie

Yeah Neville was very impressive, extremely knowledgeable. I'd agree with the posts above wasn't necessarily the best of craic but more in depth football discussion which was enjoyable all the same. The part about why he failed at Valencia was particularly interesting.

lawred2

dominatinMC wrote: »

Sounds good, some of those OTB road shows are cringey with their level of "lads banter", stories, etc. That approach can be good in moderation, but it gets tedious really quickly IMO.

Ger BANTZ Gilroy

He needs to grow up

Ciaran_B

dulpit wrote: »

Prediction: makes for a poor podcast. I've been to one of their live shows before, they are a different thing and generally don't translate well into a podcast. Ideally for the live shows they'd videotape them and issue as a video podcast, maybe in the future..

Live podcasts (Second Captains, Football Weekly whatever) always make for bad episodes. They're too conscious of the audience or something.

Salvation Tambourine

Just finished it, I enjoyed it a lot.

wardides

Thought Ken made a bit of an arse of himself at times with a couple of questions, but then Neville contradicted himself a couple of times which he let go. Was a good football chat, but as usual lately everything seems to be Jose/United led. To be expected I'd imagine.

dominatinMC

wardides wrote:

Thought Ken made a bit of an arse of himself at times with a couple of questions, but then Neville contradicted himself a couple of times which he let go. Was a good football chat, but as usual lately everything seems to be Jose/United led. To be expected I'd imagine.

I get the impression that Ken is a lot more comfortable/at ease with himself behind the microphone in a radio setting. He always came across as awkward on the TV shows as well.

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

Just listened to the Neville pod. Best thing SC have ever done. Ken met his match, Nevilles take on what's happening at United with Jose was unique. Just a top notch interview.

Pete Moss

Really enjoyed the Neville podcast, I was glued to it. He really came across as a genuine guy, straight up and honest about his Valencia stint. He walks a fine line of being a professional, but having the ability to take the piss out of himself too.

Ken seemed slightly unprepared with some of his questions and rambles. He's criticized JosÃ© and United for quite some time, so I was fully expecting him be a more direct and confident in his stance, but it didn't come across like that at all.

dastardly00

Just finished listening to the Neville podcast. Brilliant. Neville was great to listen to. Thank you Second Captains. Well worth the €5 plus VAT

Ol' Donie

Ken's on today's Arsecast if anyone wants more. Season preview

riemann

dulpit wrote: »

Prediction: makes for a poor podcast. I've been to one of their live shows before, they are a different thing and generally don't translate well into a podcast. Ideally for the live shows they'd videotape them and issue as a video podcast, maybe in the future..

All live podcasts sound terrible on podcast.

Shame but I'm not sure they're worth the hassle of going to. I've been to a few (not sc) and it was a good excuse for a few pints but that's about it.

OldMrBrennan83

riemann wrote: »

All live podcasts sound terrible on podcast.

Shame but I'm not sure they're worth the hassle of going to. I've been to a few (not sc) and it was a good excuse for a few pints but that's about it.

Was a woeful time really. When I got tickets I had just assumed it was something sensible like 8pm (they're basically shutting out anyone not working in the city). Sort of knew I was never making it for half 6 and it worked out that way.

Arghus

Poor oul Ken didn't stand a chance at times against Neville. That line about "there seems to be a bit of emotion creeping in..." I felt genuinely bad for him then!

Ken likes to monologue, so when he comes up against someone who doesn't necessarily agree with anything he has to say about football and isn't prepared to give him the time he wants to make his point he can struggle a bit.

Neville was impressive: knowledgeable and very articulate, but I also think he's a bit of a bully. It's not enough for him to just make his point or try see where the other guy might be coming from, he gets in a few laughs at their expense too. He did it a bit too when he sat down to chat with the guys from Arsenal Fan TV, though they were so borderline incoherent when talking to him it that it must have been genuinely hard not to take the piss a bit in that instance. As much as he's a good and informed talker there's something in that which isn't too appealing.

Though it was a good interview, even if it tarnished Ken's aura somewhat.

Brock Turnpike

Arghus wrote: »

Neville was impressive: knowledgeable and very articulate, but I also think he's a bit of a bully. It's not enough for him to just make his point or try see where the other guy might be coming from, he gets in a few laughs at their expense too.

I agree with this. He's very knowledgeable, but he has a "my opinion is right and I'm not even entertaining what you have to say" manner about him. Listen to him on live games and he'll make his mind up on an incident and then refuse to change his mind on it, even if a replay shows something that contradicts what he thinks.

Raoul

Arghus wrote: »

Poor oul Ken didn't stand a chance at times against Neville. That line about "there seems to be a bit of emotion creeping in..." I felt genuinely bad for him then!

Ken likes to monologue, so when he comes up against someone who doesn't necessarily agree with anything he has to say about football and isn't prepared to give him the time he wants to make his point he can struggle a bit.

Neville was impressive: knowledgeable and very articulate, but I also think he's a bit of a bully. It's not enough for him to just make his point or try see where the other guy might be coming from, he gets in a few laughs at their expense too. He did it a bit too when he sat down to chat with the guys from Arsenal Fan TV, though they were so borderline incoherent when talking to him it that it must have been genuinely hard not to take the piss a bit in that instance. As much as he's a good and informed talker there's something in that which isn't too appealing.

Though it was a good interview, even if it tarnished Ken's aura somewhat.

I think you are being unfairly harsh there on Ken and Neville. I thought Neville was trying to lighten it up a bit and the jokes he made were fairly light hearted "banter" type jokes.

Unlike Robbie Fowler last year who came out and basically laughed in Ken's face and said something like "wtf I can't understand you at all, what are you saying?".

I was disappointed Ken didn't stand up to Neville though when Neville talked about the 100 year plan and Ken was saying that Mourinho wasn't the right man for the Man U job. Ken was right and Neville made Ken's argument for him but then contradicted himself when Ken said Mourinho wasn't the right man. He really should have stood up to Neville in that instance.

buyer95

Great listening, definitely the best live podcast. No harm to hear Ken being called on some of the Jose criticism either (as much as I enjoy Ken I have grown weary of of this shtick a long time ago). When Ken tries to say that only people who don't know a lot about football would have considered Jose a good appointment, Neville absolutely destroys him. So much so that Eoin feels bad for Ken and jumps in with " one second, sorry Garry , gwan there Ken just make this point" to try and allow him to save face. Gary blows him out of it in fairness "Mourinho has won trophies at every club he has managed at. (Ken tries to jump in) Let me finish... FOR **** SAKE."

Fantastic entertainment lads

Arghus

Raoul wrote: »

I think you are being unfairly harsh there on Ken and Neville. I thought Neville was trying to lighten it up a bit and the jokes he made were fairly light hearted "banter" type jokes.

Unlike Robbie Fowler last year who came out and basically laughed in Ken's face and said something like "wtf I can't understand you at all, what are you saying?".

I was disappointed Ken didn't stand up to Neville though when Neville talked about the 100 year plan and Ken was saying that Mourinho wasn't the right man for the Man U job. Ken was right and Neville made Ken's argument for him but then contradicted himself when Ken said Mourinho wasn't the right man. He really should have stood up to Neville in that instance.

Ah, I'm not really being too down on Ken. I felt a bit sorry for him more than anything.

I do think he was a bit flustered by Neville though, which kind of explained, I think anyway, why he didn't challenge him more on the blatant contradictions Neville made about Mourinho being the right man for the job but also talking about how United's biggest mistake was not sticking to their ethos/style of play. That would have been an open goal for Ken in normal circumstances, he'd be in interrogating whoever would have made those two contradictory points. He was knocked off his stride a bit, you could hear it in his voice.

Look, I don't want to psychoanalyse the pod too much but - I think Neville is good at making his barbs look like banter, but there's an edge to them all the same, they're quietly merciless. I think he likes to control the conversation and I don't think he'd fancy someone joking at his expense. Even in the little exchanges with the audience he always had to get the final word. He's a competitor and doesn't like to give ground, even in the tiniest of things.

Not to bang on about too much, but to reference that Arsenal Fan TV interview he did. It was mainly pure hogwash, but when one of the lads, after an age, finally put a coherent point to him that went against something he'd said, rather than address the point he mocked the guy who made the point "ah you've studied communications in college!". It was "banter" I suppose but I thought it was very telling that his first instinct was to take the guy down a peg or two, before he dealt with what he had to say.

Still thought the interview was great.

Pete Moss

Arghus wrote:

Poor oul Ken didn't stand a chance at times against Neville. That line about "there seems to be a bit of emotion creeping in..." I felt genuinely bad for him then!

Arghus wrote:

Ken likes to monologue, so when he comes up against someone who doesn't necessarily agree with anything he has to say about football and isn't prepared to give him the time he wants to make his point he can struggle a bit.

Arghus wrote:

Neville was impressive: knowledgeable and very articulate, but I also think he's a bit of a bully. It's not enough for him to just make his point or try see where the other guy might be coming from, he gets in a few laughs at their expense too. He did it a bit too when he sat down to chat with the guys from Arsenal Fan TV, though they were so borderline incoherent when talking to him it that it must have been genuinely hard not to take the piss a bit in that instance. As much as he's a good and informed talker there's something in that which isn't too appealing.

Arghus wrote:

Though it was a good interview, even if it tarnished Ken's aura somewhat.

I disagree. To me, Neville is a few levels above Ken in terms of debating football, and there's no shame in that.

Neville has walked the walk, he knows all sides of the football industry: club politics, media, playing, coaching, managing, punditry, transfer dealings, etc. In the podcast, Ken's arguments were rather shapeless and, personally speaking, I was glad Neville called him on it, even if he did point it out several times.

Ken's monologue approach can be entertaining, but sometimes he loses his way resulting in his question or counterpoint becoming distorted. This occurred a few times during the live show.

In terms of Neville being a "bit of a bully", it could be argued that Ken is similar on SC when it comes to football. When called out, he defends his point against Eoin, Murph or whoever to the extreme. However, when he clashed with Neville, Ken folded somewhat and did not appear as stubborn or confident in his views as he has on the regular studio recordings. This may be due to the live environment of the recent show, or may be due to the caliber of guest he was debating.

Also, Neville did touch on the fact that many players make poor pundits due to their emotional sensitivity. He seems to come from the school where you can argue your point against someone to the fullest, but not fall-out with them on a personal level. In terms of taking the piss out Ken or whoever, well that's just the showbiz/entertainment element. They're all up on stage to deliver some light-hearted entertainment at the end of the day.

n!ghtmancometh

Did Ken interview Neville 1-1 pre-recorded, or live on stage? not arsed with the latter as hate live pods. No interest in Neville either really. Average player, average pundit, crap manager who's big talk was found out quickly.

Ol' Donie

n!ghtmancometh wrote: »

Did Ken interview Neville 1-1 pre-recorded, or live on stage? not arsed with the latter as hate live pods. No interest in Neville either really. Average player, average pundit, crap manager who's big talk was found out quickly.

Live on stage.

Everything else you said was covered.

Arghus

Pete Moss wrote: »

I disagree. To me, Neville is a few levels above Ken in terms of debating football, and there's no shame in that

I agree with you wholeheartedly in that respect. Neville does have greater knowledge than Ken and is a better debater on football.

Ken is fond alright at defending himself and his opinions against others on SC and elsewhere, but I don't think it's the same kind of thing as how I perceived Neville's attitude to be. I wouldn't call Ken a bully, he's opinionated and brash, but he's also willing to make himself look silly too. I never get the sense that he's trying to genuinely win every argument every time, just because he feels obligated too. I just sense an undercurrent of edge to Neville, even when he's ostensibly larking about. It's not a major issue, I just find it interesting and it helped make the interview fascinating in a way.

Dots1982

Nev does not mess about, I was challenged just listening to the show. Very very few pundits can speak for as long as he did and stay focused and on their toes and not slip into cliches.