Donald Trump Presidency discussion thread III

Harika wrote: »

Let's go back to the winning like trump did with North Korea. Who remembers when he said that 200 remains of us soldiers are on the way back home after the meeting?
https://www.military.com/daily-news/2018/06/21/trump-says-north-korea-has-returned-remains-mia-troops-it-true.html

Matthis then had to clarify that this is not the case but they are negotiating.

Today this stopped now to

https://mobile.twitter.com/jimsciutto/status/1017421762383044608

North Korea got everything they wanted and trump nothing in return. Edit that didn't stop trump fans to claim families were in tears over having their loved ones back.

So, Trump made a load of concessions and got nothing in return? The master negotiator? I'm shocked I tell you. Nobody could have predicted this. He told us that he makes the best deals and solved the proliferation problem.

Could we get a poorly formatted response to this?

WinnyThePoo wrote: »

American politics by nature is sadly very tribal. Doesn't matter if you don't like Trump, you must be Clinton supporter. Doesn't matter if your not a fan of Neo-Nazis , you must be an antifa supporter.

Trump is cult of personality .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult_of_personality

'Adrian Teodor Popan defines cult of personality as a "quantitatively exaggerated and qualitatively extravagant public demonstration of praise of the leader". He also identifies three causal "necessary, but not sufficient, structural conditions, and a path dependent chain of events which, together, lead to the cult formation: a particular combination of patrimonialism and clientelism, lack of dissidence, and systematic falsification pervading the society’s culture."'

Also its always a good time to listen to living color.

It's fascinating seeing it in action. There are some posters here who's opinions were very similar to mine in terms of social welfare, taxation, Islam, travelers, bogus asylum seekers, crime and punishment, third wave feminism, the far left, the far progressives and a host of other areas. By Irish standards, I lean to the right in a lot of areas but since I'm not religious, there are other areas where I lean left such as with gay rights, women's rights and other areas where I'm unaffected by the behaviour of others (equal rights - I'm against quotas).

When Trump came along, these posters bought Trump hook, line and sinker. When Trump got the nomination, I saw him as a dumbass populist preying on people's base instincts. He was offering simplistic solutions to complex problems. He couldn't make any coherent point beyond silly sound bites. I couldn't believe that people who's opinion I respected were falling for this. Trump's shtick isn't new or original.

Whatever about his policies, whatever about his Russian connections, whatever about him messing up the international order that's brought us so much prosperity, Trump is so evidently a conman and one would think that people can see through this. The mental gymnastics required to defend him are insane.

The worst part of this though has been the dishonesty that his supporters have employed. It's as if they know what I know but put it aside for the "greater good" whatever the hell that is. Maybe there's an element of trolling akin to Sartres "The Antisemites". I'm not sure.

Whatever is going on, a lot on the right are all in on this as though you can't lean right and think Trump is a fraud. It's like they don't understand that you can lean right and dislike a lying cnut who can't string a sentence together and acts like a petulant child and behaves like a Russian stooge. I decide on things on their own merit. These people are just partaking in groupthink. It's a personality cult.

Harika

Let's go back to the winning like trump did with North Korea. Who remembers when he said that 200 remains of us soldiers are on the way back home after the meeting?
https://www.military.com/daily-news/2018/06/21/trump-says-north-korea-has-returned-remains-mia-troops-it-true.html

Matthis then had to clarify that this is not the case but they are negotiating.

Today this stopped now to

https://mobile.twitter.com/jimsciutto/status/1017421762383044608

North Korea got everything they wanted and trump nothing in return. Edit that didn't stop trump fans to claim families were in tears over having their loved ones back.

WinnyThePoo

mcmoustache wrote: »

I'm not too fussed about about isis comparisons with vehicular manslaughter or attacks on civilians. I was referring to your use of "your side" as though people were Clinton/Obama supporters.

American politics by nature is sadly very tribal. Doesn't matter if you don't like Trump, you must be Clinton supporter. Doesn't matter if your not a fan of Neo-Nazis , you must be an antifa supporter.

Trump is cult of personality .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult_of_personality

'Adrian Teodor Popan defines cult of personality as a "quantitatively exaggerated and qualitatively extravagant public demonstration of praise of the leader". He also identifies three causal "necessary, but not sufficient, structural conditions, and a path dependent chain of events which, together, lead to the cult formation: a particular combination of patrimonialism and clientelism, lack of dissidence, and systematic falsification pervading the society’s culture."'

Also its always a good time to listen to living color.

Here's the info relating to wikileaks and Stone communicating with the Russian military:

https://twitter.com/pwnallthethings/status/1017812769884819456

https://twitter.com/pwnallthethings/status/1017811008721743873

https://twitter.com/pwnallthethings/status/1017809890520289280

https://twitter.com/pwnallthethings/status/1017809694189146113

I'm just curious, Trumpers, but where are ye putting the goalposts now? We're far beyond "nothingburger" at this point.

2 Scoops wrote: »

I know words, I have the best words. Like you use the word projection I can use the word exaggeration.

I'm fine with people criticizing him or disliking him, comparing normal people to ISIS mentality/behavior is where the exaggeration part comes in.

I'm not too fussed about about isis comparisons with vehicular manslaughter or attacks on civilians. I was referring to your use of "your side" as though people were Clinton/Obama supporters.

Thargor

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Here's Piers Morgan struggling with that concept

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD7Ol0gz11k

StringerBell wrote: »

Must say, I really enjoy when Morgan is shown up to be the complete nitwit he is

This was beautiful:

Beechwoodspark

Thought Lammy’s Speech was excellent

Midlife

Danzy wrote: »

Will he win in 2020 is the question and he'll have a very good chance.

You can hate him, love him or not care but that is the starting presumption.

Anything is possible of course but holding out for something is a bit like Whitewater and Benghazi talk around the Clintons.

He may if he can keep the con up for long ennough or the effect of his not going into details on anything doesn't hit home.

In 20 years though we'll be talking about one of the biggest failures of a presidency in history.

you can gloatmark this

jobbridge4life

Danzy wrote: »

The Tea Party and "The Resistance" are largely the same mentality and manner.

As for the term "The Resistance", how f'ing far up their own hole must one be to have coined that phrase. It is largely a media thing but how out of touch must they be.

'I'm the only one' Trump. I'm old enough to remember when people would decry Obama for being messianic.

It is also telling that you write Tea Party without quotation marks, as though that was an established fact...

What's telling is how the WH have responded to the indictments. Focusing purely on what isn't there, rather than saying well done to the investigators for unearthing this attack on the nation and focusing on what is in there and what steps they are going to take on the back of that. The need to latch on to each release that doesn't indict the president as a victory and a complete exoneration regardless of how careful the DOJ are with their wording ie, in this particular indictment.

It's just complete paranoia and defensive crap and it is delinquent in the sworn duty to protect the united states.

I can't get my head around it, ok sure you wanna stick with the no collusion. I get that, but what they do does nothing to help their cause or protect America. Isn't that supposed to be the number one priority for all these patriots?

Enzokk

I think the lasting legacy of Trump will be how all of his promises to the US voters will turn out to have been a lies. He said he would protect US jobs, yet his tariffs has done the exact opposite. He said he would drain the swamp, yet he appointed the likes of Scott Pruitt who wasted taxpayer money on himself and his cronies.

He also said he would look after the middle classes and his tax regime would hurt him personally, yet magically it is the very rich that benefit from said taxes. And the big one, he would put the American people first, yet he colluded with Russia and is actively pursuing his own interests and it seems the interests of Russia ahead of the US.

jobbridge4life

2 Scoops wrote: »

And here we go with the angry mob mentality/deflection excuse when someone calls out how radical this thread is, predictable really.

Another standard and dull tactic from the right... when a majority of people (not unlike the majority of Americans who voted for POTUS's opponent) disagree and are vocal about it they are demeaned as a 'mob'.

Particularly hilarious and hypocritical when one considers the right wing have for decades labelled themselves the 'moral majority'.

Midlife

2 Scoops wrote: »

I've seen some radical stuff written here but this argument just goes beyond any of that, and now multiple posters are trying to justify it

Your side lost the election, stop comparing people who've done nothing wrong to terrorists

Sorry, it was my post.

Just to clear it up, I meant STUPID. People who argue for whatever Donald Trump says all the time in face of irrefutable evidence are STUPID.

It's faith based rather than evidence based.

Danzy wrote: »

In fairness to Pat Kenny, he always researches his topics. Morgan was coasting.

Don't mind Pat generally, particularly on the radio. Was never a big fan of the late late but find his radio show pretty good when I get to listen.

StringerBell wrote: »

He didn't realise she was a communist till the end of the interview to be fair to him, a master of preparation.

In fairness to Pat Kenny, he always researches his topics. Morgan was coasting.

He didn't realise she was a communist till the end of the interview to be fair to him, a master of preparation.

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Here's Piers Morgan struggling with that concept

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD7Ol0gz11k

He did just that, didn't he.
#
He was a bit slow off the mark on calling her out on supporting the most murderous ideology of the last century.

He did look like he got slapped around the chops though, which was nice.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD7Ol0gz11k

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Here's Piers Morgan struggling with that concept

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD7Ol0gz11k

Must say, I really enjoy when Morgan is shown up to be the complete nitwit he is

Captain Obvious

mcmoustache wrote: »

It's projection. They assume that if you don't like Trump, you must feel as strongly about Clinton or Obama as they feel about Trump. Neither Clinton nor Obama had the same kind of sycophantic support that they give to Trump.

Here's Piers Morgan struggling with that concept

BabyCheeses

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Great to see sky news showing up the ignorant loud mouth protestors in their true form today, an absolute disgraceful way to treat the US president regardless of who they are.

Nice to see Donald making some good progress on trade talks

Maybe you could tell us some of those details for the trade talks.

StringerBell wrote: »

Some of his evangelical base(which is what I said) are far from normal people and I say it again are not that far removed from ISIS, not in action as you very well know (but give them time ) semi joking, ideologically they are not far apart. Two sides of a coin. The extreme element's of any side tend to be more alike than they would like to acknowledge.

Are there normal people who support Trump? For sure, are there lunatics? Obviously.

Evangelicals are a nutty bunch as it is without even getting into the ridiculous mental gymnastics they do to justify supporting Trump with all his flaws.

You can include many of his opponents in that comparison as well.

Enzokk

2 Scoops wrote: »

I know words, I have the best words. Like you use the word projection I can use the word exaggeration.

I'm fine with people criticizing him or disliking him, comparing normal people to ISIS mentality/behavior is where the exaggeration part comes in.

I don't see a problem with that. The same is true of Jeremy Corbyn supporters in the UK. They somehow believe he will blaze a new trail in Brexit negotiations that will get a great deal for the UK. They also ignore any faults he has. Some of his supporters act like they are in a cult and refuse to engage their brains. Like ISIS supporters and like some Trump supporters.

Even when confronted with the evidence, concrete evidence, facts that cannot be disputed some of his supporters will double down and insist that he is not lying. I think the comparison to ISIS supporters who would have left their lives in the EU and go to Syria/Iraq to join the Caliphate would also double down to themselves that they are doing the right thing.

Donald Trump's Lies Are True, American Voter Tells James O'Brien

In any case, with the latest indictments it is unthinkable that Trump will go ahead with his meeting with Putin. To think he wants to have the meeting in secret as well should give you not just pause, but send the alarm bells ringing so loudly in your head that you will not be able to sleep. The wealthiest nation in the world was conned by the biggest conman out there. That people still cannot see this is just a reflection of how stupid humans are.

2 Scoops wrote: »

I know words, I have the best words. Like you use the word projection I can use the word exaggeration.

I'm fine with people criticizing him or disliking him, comparing normal people to ISIS mentality/behavior is where the exaggeration part comes in.

Some of his evangelical base(which is what I said) are far from normal people and I say it again are not that far removed from ISIS, not in action as you very well know (but give them time

) semi joking, ideologically they are not far apart. Two sides of a coin. The extreme element's of any side tend to be more alike than they would like to acknowledge.

Are there normal people who support Trump? For sure, are there lunatics? Obviously.

Evangelicals are a nutty bunch as it is without even getting into the ridiculous mental gymnastics they do to justify supporting Trump with all his flaws.

2 Scoops

mcmoustache wrote: »

It's projection. They assume that if you don't like Trump, you must feel as strongly about Clinton or Obama as they feel about Trump. Neither Clinton nor Obama had the same kind of sycophantic support that they give to Trump.

I know words, I have the best words. Like you use the word projection I can use the word exaggeration.

I'm fine with people criticizing him or disliking him, comparing normal people to ISIS mentality/behavior is where the exaggeration part comes in.

smurgen wrote: »

Could be both.either way i think his time is running out.

Will he win in 2020 is the question and he'll have a very good chance.

You can hate him, love him or not care but that is the starting presumption.

Anything is possible of course but holding out for something is a bit like Whitewater and Benghazi talk around the Clintons.