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Go-Ahead Dublin City Routes - Updates and Discussion

Stephen15

So since the last thread on this got closed and dosen't appear to be reopening any time soon. Heres a new one for you.

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Dr Brown

devnull wrote: »

It is not privatisation as nothing is being sold.

It's the first steps towards privatization.

marno21

Dr Brown wrote: »

It's the first steps towards privatization.

Dublin Bus were free to tender for this were they not?

If they can't compete that's their problem.

Qrt

marno21 wrote: »

Dublin Bus were free to tender for this were they not?

If they can't compete that's their problem.

Dublin Bus, like most of the transport services in this country, seem quite underfunded. Whereas Go-Ahead have millions and millions of capital behind them.

L1011

Qrt wrote: »

Dublin Bus, like most of the transport services in this country, seem quite underfunded. Whereas Go-Ahead have millions and millions of capital behind them.

Capital doesn't affect your cost base in an era of low interest - and DBs occasional losses/debts are zero interest anyway, to their own (profitable) parent. The tender was judged mostly on costs, partially on customer service - something Dublin Bus are definitely not known for.

Stephen15

I wonder what will happen to the Go-Ahead routes once these bus connects plans begin to be implemented. I assume they'll be reassigned other new routes.

Qrt

L1011 wrote: »

Capital doesn't affect your cost base in an era of low interest - and DBs occasional losses/debts are zero interest anyway, to their own (profitable) parent. The tender was judged mostly on costs, partially on customer service - something Dublin Bus are definitely not known for.

Funnily enough, I've never had a bad Dublin Bus customer service experience. They almost always reply to a firm tweet, and they even refunded my leap card once I sent them screenshots. Transdev are horrendous, the Luas account will v seldom reply.

Stephen15

What do you want by customer service I understand things like complaints which need to be dealt promptly and to a satisfactory resolution both parties. However I do think that bus drivers should not be given customer service in the same way as people working in private businesses.

I don't really care personally if the bus driver is grumpy and has a big long face as long as the bus gets me where I need to be going safely and on time.

howiya

Qrt wrote: »

Funnily enough, I've never had a bad Dublin Bus customer service experience. They almost always reply to a firm tweet, and they even refunded my leap card once I sent them screenshots. Transdev are horrendous, the Luas account will v seldom reply.

I think people here are misunderstanding customer service. A fundamental part of customer service is actually providing the service. It isn't whether or not the bus driver was grumpy or they replied to your tweet.

If you had to send them a firm tweet in the first place you have had a bad Dublin Bus customer service experience.

Qrt

howiya wrote: »

I think people here are misunderstanding customer service. A fundamental part of customer service is actually providing the service. It isn't whether or not the bus driver was grumpy or they replied to your tweet.

If you had to send them a firm tweet in the first place you have had a bad Dublin Bus customer service experience.

I'm at the end of the most congested bus route (as in the longest as per busconnects analysis) so the buses get caught up and don't arrive when they're supposed to. I always notice because they bring in older buses from other routes in the area. It's just the traffic.

markpb

Dr Brown wrote: »

It's the first steps towards privatization.

The state has been tendering for private companies to operate services for decades. Most of the traffic lights you'll see today are privately installed and maintained. Luas has been privately operated for almost 15 years years. DCC outsource some of their cleaning and security Jobs. Most hospitals outsource cleaning and other support services. Electric Ireland rely heavily on private companies for technology (and probably lots more).

It's all around you but you don't see it. What makes you think this particular tender is the start of privatisation?

ESB International makes a pile of cash operating in other countries, supplying services to their governments. To citizens of those countries, that's privatisation too. Are you against that as well?

Drifter50

devnull wrote: »

Go Ahead have released an update on their progress - key points highlighted below.
https://www.go-aheaddublin.ie/newsroom-2/go-ahead-ireland-enjoys-surge-recruitment-depot-nears-completion/

Go Ahead have seen approx 1,300 applicants for employment in the company.

Go-Ahead Ireland has signed an agreement with SIPTU to provide GAI with sole recognition for its employees

It's also been confirmed that Go-Ahead Ireland will begin to operate the 24 routes from September 2018 and complete the process by January 2019.

Good move by Go Ahead. This will be a bloody nose for Dermot and his NBRU mates, bet they have nothing good to say..........

AlekSmart

howiya wrote: »

I think people here are misunderstanding customer service. A fundamental part of customer service is actually providing the service. It isn't whether or not the bus driver was grumpy or they replied to your tweet.

If you had to send them a firm tweet in the first place you have had a bad Dublin Bus customer service experience.

This is the element which lost Bus Atha Cliath the 1st BMO contract.

However,that does not,of itself,guarantee that subsequent tender rounds will automatically go the same way...lessons learned and all of that ....;)

howiya

Qrt wrote: »

I'm at the end of the most congested bus route (as in the longest as per busconnects analysis) so the buses get caught up and don't arrive when they're supposed to. I always notice because they bring in older buses from other routes in the area. It's just the traffic.

Then you can’t say you’ve never had a bad customer service experience. Sounds like you’ve had plenty.

Qrt

howiya wrote: »

Then you can’t say you’ve never had a bad customer service experience. Sounds like you’ve had plenty.

I have, but it's rarely been due to any fault by Dublin Bus. Any company would have the same issues doing the route.

howiya

Qrt wrote: »

I have, but it's rarely been due to any fault by Dublin Bus. Any company would have the same issues doing the route.

That’s some change from your initial post when you said you’ve never had a bad customer service experience.

Qrt

howiya wrote: »

That’s some change from your initial post when you said you’ve never had a bad customer service experience.

I took customer service as the likes of getting information, refunds etc.

howiya

Qrt wrote: »

I took customer service as the likes of getting information, refunds etc.

And not the actual service??

Let’s stay with the information part. You’re tweeting DB because the information isn’t readily available on their app or website. Wouldn’t it be a better experience if the information was already there?

On any given day a number of tweets from DB will say a service did not operate for operational reasons. Can Dublin Bus not publish and update a list of services they are unable to operate each day?

Three customers were told on Twitter their bus service didn’t operate this morning due to a staffing issue.

Then look at their twitter first thing on a Monday morning. They are replying to people who tweeted them after 7pm on Saturday night wondering if the person got their bus. No twitter coverage on a Sunday.

These things are in the control of the company.

end of the road

Drifter50 wrote: »

Good move by Go Ahead. This will be a bloody nose for Dermot and his NBRU mates, bet they have nothing good to say..........

nope, not any bloody nose for dermot and co at all. some companies have always picked 1 specific union to represent staff at first, with other unions gaining entry eventually if enough members of those other unions join. so nothing to see here. and if siptu need to call a strike they will do so.

Peregrine

end of the road wrote: »

nope, not any bloody nose for dermot and co at all. some companies have always picked 1 specific union to represent staff at first, with other unions gaining entry eventually if enough members of those other unions join. so nothing to see here. and if siptu need to call a strike they will do so.

Jesus. A mere mention of a union and you're already threatening a strike. As if that's the main purpose of unions. Not resolving members' issues or anything, just strike. It's not "SIPTU will also engage with management and look after the welfare of its members", it's "SIPTU will strike too". What a mindset.

And you wonder why nobody likes unions.

Stephen Gawking

soundman45 wrote: »

It's good the have recognised a trade union from the beginning. Starting rate is just that and if there is a decent rate of increase for staff it shouldn't be a problem to retain drivers. So many dublin bus employees want to see this fail and are happy to post negative comments here but the reality will be the NTA and Go Ahead will not let this happen if anything I would say bus operator's with contacts coming up for renewal will be at risk of being taken over by Go Ahead.

Yeah be sure that worked out well for transdev didn't it. How siptu can claim to represent staff in Dublin bus & staff in go ahead is beyond logic. Surely there's a potential conflict of interest here...

end of the road

Peregrine wrote: »

Jesus. A mere mention of a union and you're already threatening a strike. As if that's the main purpose of unions. Not resolving members' issues or anything, just strike. It's not "SIPTU will also engage with management and look after the welfare of its members", it's "SIPTU will strike too". What a mindset.

how am i threatening to strike. a strike can only be called via a ballot. a ballot to strike isn't going to be called because someone mentioned the word union on a website.

Peregrine wrote: »

And you wonder why nobody likes unions.

i don't, i know exactly why it is in most cases. it's those people's loss however.

markpb

Stephen Gawking wrote: »

How siptu can claim to represent staff in Dublin bus & staff in go ahead is beyond logic. Surely there's a potential conflict of interest here...

Is there?

Stephen Gawking

markpb wrote: »

Is there?

In my view there's potential for one, we've seen when the luas dispute resulted in a pay rise then the train drivers wanted a pay rise. So if Dublin bus drivers get a raise will go ahead want one?

marno21

Qrt wrote: »

Dublin Bus, like most of the transport services in this country, seem quite underfunded. Whereas Go-Ahead have millions and millions of capital behind them.

If Go Ahead implemented CIE practices they wouldn't be long going bust.

Whenever booking flights with Ryanair I hestitate to think how much I would be paying for my flight if state owned Aer Lingus were the only show in town.

Creative83

Dr Brown wrote: »

That's yellow pack wages

What are 'yellow pack' wages :rolleyes:

[Deleted User]

We all know bus eireann and Dublin bus drivers are well paid and fair play to them nobody is think has a problem with that. The fact is go ahead will be an attractive job to a lot of drivers that work for private companies often on zero hour contracts and basically on call to take whatever job comes in with no work/life balance. Just last week I spoke with a driver who had worked 83 yes 83 hours the previous week and drivers like these will be delighted to take on a job with structured hours and a decent rate of pay and conditions and anyone who sneers at them for doing so is just being nasty.

Drifter50

end of the road wrote: »

nope, not any bloody nose for dermot and co at all. some companies have always picked 1 specific union to represent staff at first, with other unions gaining entry eventually if enough members of those other unions join. so nothing to see here. and if siptu need to call a strike they will do so.

Can`t agree with that. A closed shop with 1 union binds all the workers to the individual shop stewards and the union reps whether they like it or not. So if you don`t like SIPTU or have an issue with them you`re basically knackered

Stephen15

soundman45 wrote: »

We all know bus eireann and Dublin bus drivers are well paid and fair play to them nobody is think has a problem with that. The fact is go ahead will be an attractive job to a lot of drivers that work for private companies often on zero hour contracts and basically on call to take whatever job comes in with no work/life balance. Just last week I spoke with a driver who had worked 83 yes 83 hours the previous week and drivers like these will be delighted to take on a job with structured hours and a decent rate of pay and conditions and anyone who sneers at them for doing so is just being nasty.

But those drivers could have moved to DB or BE instead GA who are paying less

Qrt

soundman45 wrote: »

We all know bus eireann and Dublin bus drivers are well paid and fair play to them nobody is think has a problem with that. The fact is go ahead will be an attractive job to a lot of drivers that work for private companies often on zero hour contracts and basically on call to take whatever job comes in with no work/life balance. Just last week I spoke with a driver who had worked 83 yes 83 hours the previous week and drivers like these will be delighted to take on a job with structured hours and a decent rate of pay and conditions and anyone who sneers at them for doing so is just being nasty.

Is that...legal?

Stephen15 wrote: »

But those drivers could have moved to DB or BE instead GA who are paying less

There are many reasons why a person might choice one company over the other.

First of all, there maybe more drivers looking to move then DB/BE are looking to take on.

Also someone might not like the "culture" at DB/BE, might not like the whole marked in culture and having to work crappy schedules for years if not decades. The schedules being offered by GA might be "better" or at least more dependable.

Given that it is a new company that is obviously hungry to grow, some enthusiastic individuals might feel they will have a better opportunity to grow and quickly move up the ladder in a new, growing company like this, then a mature company where people have already been in the position for a long time.

Of course if GA can't get enough drivers at the wage they are offering, they will have to up what they are offering.