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Child Item

3rd child or not

LegacyUser

Would like some opinions on this situation, I am married 10 years and have 2 children that are aged 8 and 6.

After the 6 year old was born we had 3 years of a rough patch as they were a disaster sleeping at night. We tried everything and went down all the usual avenues but nothing worked, child was just a bad sleeper and that was it.

A good night they would be up 6-7 times, think the worst was about 16. This had a huge impact on our quality of life and my wife even gave up her job as she could not cope with sleepless nights. Anyhow eventually they grew out of this and started sleeping much better after starting school.

Now we had always said we would have 3 kids. During the really bad period we had a miscarriage, then my wife had an unrelated health scare, that was all sorted and we had
2 more miscarriages since, last one about 18 months ago. After all the miscarries she needed hospital intervention, but on the last one there was a complication and she lost an awful lot of blood, they struggled to get it under control and she nearly died. She was in hospital for 10 days and then had to go back every 2 weeks for 6 months for checkups.

Once that was sorted the on the last Consultant visit she asked about trying again. The consultant said that considering the history we could try again but if that if she was in our position we should consider the family we have already and not go through all the worry and risk again.

I had to say I was happy to hear this as I was really going off the idea myself after the last experience and the fact that we now would have a big gap between a new baby and the next child. But my wife does not agree and is adamant she wants another child.

So for the past year or so we have rowing about this, its a horrible situation cause there is no compromise possible, someone will get what they want and the other wont.

I'm fearful I will resent a child if we have one, I'm fearful I might be left with 3 children on my own. We hardly ever have sex now as I want to use contraception. We have money issues also as she has still not gone back to work and says she wont until after 3rd child.

Am I being selfish here or should i just give in? Things have got so bad lately that I think the relationship could end if I dont. Thank you for reading.

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orthsquel

OP, firstly I'm sorry for your loss with the miscarriages, it must have been awful for both of you.

Why is having three children important to her? Is this stemming from something she has always wanted, which you shared, and is there a chance that in light of the miscarriages she feels she ought to have a third child out of negative feelings after having miscarried? Has she attended miscarriage counselling?

I don't think it's selfish to re-consider having a third child if there are serious concerns for your wife in a pregnancy, and any risks to her life.
Feeling forced to have another child is not right though, it should be a joint decision that both parties want. I think the root of is why another child is so important to her that she is willing to take a risk especially if it is entirely recommended by her consultant might be important to take on board.

Paddy Cow

I'm really sorry to hear about all the misfortune you and your wife have suffered. I completely understand why you don't want another child or even to try for one. You are right in that no one wins in this situation. There are no bad guys here. You have very real concerns for not wanting a third child, while your wife is probably yearning for a baby.

LegacyUser

It's ok to not want to have more children, it really is. Genuinely think people should be discouraged from picking the 'perfect' size for their family before they actually have a child, so that the reality of parenting and the reality of your life, health, finances, how well you cope with no sleep, how well you deal with no time for introspection, how well you deal with your new role in life sinks in. I feel sorry for your wife, the biological urge to have children is so strong, and though I have no personal experience with this, anecdotally I have seen that miscarriage can make you even more determined to have a baby and very, very tied up emotionally in that.

Ok, so maybe it is a bit 'selfish' for you to prioritise your strong feeling that you do not want to have another child over your wife's desire to have a baby but selfish isn't immediately wrong. You have 2 children already who need you and will likely be happier themselves if you aren't broken down by a lack of sleep and if they don't have to worry about their mother ending up in hospital. You have a wife who could die if she got pregnant. You have genuine issues with money because of your current family situation. Neither of you is coming out of this a winner but you're not wrong to have your own wishes about your family size. Would your wife maybe attend counselling with you? Not so you can talk her around to your way of thinking but just so you can both speak about how you're feeling in a calm, neutral environment

Paddy Cow

There is a mad emoji :mad: at the top of my last post and I apologise for that. I tried to delete it becomes across as insensitive and that was not my intent. I don't even know how that was posted.

zoobizoo

We had our first 6 months ago and having gone through six months of either not getting enough sleep or sleeping in separate rooms, plus the thoughts of my wife going through another nine months pregnancy and the fear that there might be something wrong with another one due to our age i said "No.... one will be fine"

I guess the point is that I don't want to risk what we have and to possibly change our lives drastcially.

In your case your wife seems to be thinking totally illogically.

Have you asked her why she wants a third child?

What benefit it would bring to your current family and how the lack of sleep etc would affect you guys plus the possibility of dying?

And for what?

If I was you I'd get a vasectomy, If you can bare the deceipt.

Then you can say "if it happens it happens "

Montgolfier

Sorry to hear your situation, I'm in a similar situation with the ages of my kids and my wife recently had a missed miscarriage. There was no danger to my wife like in your case.
I worry about the age gap or if I can go through it all again. It puts me under more pressure financially but I guess that's neither here nor there as they will always be provided for. Sometimes I put extra pressure on myself thinking of their future and college etc. but then again if I had 10 kids you wouldn't be thinking like that. (Let the best horse jump the ditch

)

Could your wife fear returning to work more? Its a daunting life change I would imagine. It might be worth talking to a councillor.

FurBabyMomma

I am currently pregnant on my third child. We always said we'd have 3. But my brain has decided it wants four kids and I honestly cannot get the idea out of my head. I'm fixated on it and I don't know where it came from.

My husband doesn't want a fourth child. My pregnancies are stressful and this one has had possible complications that increase with further pregnancies. I also gave up work after our second child and financially a fourth would be extremely difficult. Plus we'd be getting on a bit by the time no. 4 was on the scene. Logically I know that a fourth child is just not a sensible decision and I'm planning on getting my tubes tied. Emotionally, I know it will be very difficult and I will grieve for this baby that has only existed in my head.

It sounds like your wife needs counselling. I have all these thoughts in my head without ever having gone through the pain and loss that is miscarriage. I'm sure you're grieving too, would you consider counselling also? I'd make it clear that counselling is not an attempt to force either of you into a decision, but to help you both work through the feelings and emotions that have probably been compartmentalised while you deal with small kids, but are obviously still affecting you. Good luck and I hope you can both move forward.

LegacyUser

Get a vasectomy. Problem solved

dudara

Xcgvv wrote: »

Get a vasectomy. Problem solved

Without his wife’s knowledge? If she ever found out, that could damage their relationship irreparably.

Also, vasectomies can naturally reverse themselves, it’s rare but not unheard of.

Teyla Emmagan

A guy I work with only wanted one child, but his wife pushed and pushed. And they had twins. And now the marriage is ruined and they hate and resent each other and he hates his life.

Do I would give thanks for the two brilliant kids you already have and leave it at that. No one should be pressured into having another child.

Do you think your wife would benefit from some counselling? She might be fixated after the miscarriages or something. Maybe it would help.

LegacyUser

dudara wrote: »

Without his wife’s knowledge? If she ever found out, that could damage their relationship irreparably.

Also, vasectomies can naturally reverse themselves, it’s rare but not unheard of.

In this case, yes. Someone needs to make a rational& sensible decision for the greater good-which is keeping wife alive& having a mother for their 2 living children as they grow up.
OP has made his stance clear already, so there's no lying involved . His marriage will fall apart regardless if he doesn't at least *appear to back down. A relationship without sex rarely survives.
OPs wife nearly DIED after her most recent miscarriage,& a medical consultant has advised them against a further pregnancy. If she won't see reason, OP must take action.

heretothere

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

A guy I work with only wanted one child, but his wife pushed and pushed. And they had twins. And now the marriage is ruined and they hate and resent each other and he hates his life.

After they had the 1st child? Not really her fault if she had twins.

Op I think you need to be really honest with your wife and tell her what your fears and worries are about having a 3rd child.

I don't have children but I wouldn't be too worried about a big age gap my OH is 9 years younger than the next one and they all get on great

nikkibikki

zoobizoo wrote:

If I was you I'd get a vasectomy, If you can bare the deceipt.

That'll be one way to end a marriage anyway.....

As a woman, I can see where your wife is coming from. The desire to bear a child is one like no other. We've 3 and the youngest is 5. All one gender. I'd love a 4th but I don't think I am well enough.

3 suggestions I have. First one is relationship counselling. And/or seperate counselling.

Second one is to talk to your wife about your fears for her health and her life.

Third is to put a decision about another baby on the back burner for 6 months while you work on improving your relationship for the sake of yourselves and your 2existing children.

The Princess Bride

Guest99 wrote: »

The consultant said that considering the history we could try again but if that if she was in our position we should consider the family we have already and not go through all the worry and risk again.

I had to say I was happy to hear this as I was really going off the idea myself after the last experience and the fact that we now would have a big gap between a new baby and the next child. But my wife does not agree ...

That is a very significant gyny history.
The consultant would not advise you as above unless she knew what she was talking about.
They advise, going on their experience, and what they see in medical notes and based on examining their patients.

I've worked in healthcare for 3+decades now.
In 100% of cases where people went against medical advice, the end result was a disaster.
But at that stage it's too late to turn back the clock.

This isn't as simple as whether or not to have a 3rd child because you want one.
It's contemplating a 6th pregnancy when 3 previous ones were losses and one almost cost your wife her life.

I'd echo the other posters who recommend counselling.
Best wishes to you both.

LirW

We have two, the youngest is now 16 months and we had the talk if there's even the possibility of a third. Now something that almost no man understands is the urge of having a (or another) child. This is a deep inner craving, it possesses you, it drives you insane and you can't think of anything else. If the body has a clock ticking it ticks and it drives you nuts and you throw every rational advice overboard because nothing is as strong as the urge of having a baby.
This might be the case for your wife and in this case she probably needs counselling.

Please do not go off and just get a vasectomy without having the talk with your wife, you might destroy your marriage with this.

We decided that no way in hell we'd go for another one. I have a pretty significant gynecological issue that makes it difficult to get pregnant, to carry a pregnancy and I had a treatment not too long ago that gives me a higher chance of delivering prematurely. There's literally no reason for us to want another, ours are getting older and the older one is at an age where he can do quite a bit himself and we quite enjoy that.
I'm also really sorry about the misfortune you had to experience with your miscarriages. Like the previous poster said, in this case it's even more important to take medical advice into consideration.

pc7

Sorry you guys have had such a hard run lately. Could you make a pros and cons list? If the risk of the two kids you have in black and white being left without a mother might sink in the ? Great suggestions above about counseling, it’s been a big loss having 3 miscarriages.
We’ve two smallies and it’s tough but getting easier, in all honesty I couldn’t have another but hubby on same page. I can’t imagine how hard it is that you aren’t. Best of luck op hope it works out for you all.

Harika

I know the discussion too well. We are in the same boat and in short there are two opposites coming together where I also don’t know how to fix it.

First you are arguing with your brain, so you look at the money side of things or short the facts.

Then she is arguing from her heart so her feelings, and the desire to have another child. Lirw above described how strong the urge to have another child can be.

Like yourself, we are suffering from the same: Her urge of having a third, wants me to use contraception to be safe, she resents it, I feel that so our sex life suffers, what makes our relationship suffer. While not completely solved it is dormant for now, after talking it through, and when the youngest is one year old I will bring up the vasectomy again and will talk with her through the questions that you find on the internet e.g. https://www.babygaga.com/15-things-to-ask-before-deciding-if-you-want-another-baby/ Have an open discussion with her about those points and especially your fear ending up as single parent after the latest health scare and the remark of the consultant.

And as written above don’t get a vasectomy without her consent that just can end bad.

While not recommended. A friend used the sledge hammer approach by telling his wife, she can have another child, just not with him. That settled it but as said, not recommended and you don’t sound like the guy who would do that.
So both get on one page, before you make the decision for or against a child. Be strong and don’t cave in to make her happy while you are unhappy with it. And be aware that one of the answers for the money related problems could be “But what if we win in Lotto?”

TheBoyConor

She is not thinking straight. She is being hugely careless and disrespectful to your wishes and to your family. She needs to be called out on it.

You need to lay down the facts that she needs to understand
- the real possibility of her miscarrying, dying and leaving the 2 kids without a mother. - that's selfish in the extreme.
- that she will strain the family finaces and limit the attention and resources that can be used for the other 2 kids.
- that she is bullying you into appeasing her. - if genders were reversed and a guy was pressuring a woman into having a baby then there would be uproar.

I see two options for you here op:
1. tell her that you don't want a baby and that you are not changing your mind for the reasons above. Tell her she can have a baby if she wants but she will have to get either another willing partner or a sperm donor and that you will have no involvement whatsoever with anything to do with this pregnancy or a the baby should it go full term. You'll have to reconsider whether the marriage can continue or not based on this.
2. if you want to keep the peace and preserve the marriage you could go off and get the snip on the QT and then later be like, "sure lets see what happens" and then after "aww shoot, no baby, well I guess it wasn't meant to be, maybe it's damage from all your miscarriages" or something.

zapper55

Oh god don't follow the advice in the last post, it's horrifically insensitive.

ahnow

This is insensitive, bordering on ridiculous.

TheBoyConor wrote: »

She is not thinking straight. She is being hugely careless and disrespectful to your wishes and to your family. She needs to be called out on it.

You need to lay down the facts that she needs to understand
- the real possibility of her miscarrying, dying and leaving the 2 kids without a mother. - that's selfish in the extreme.
- that she will strain the family finaces and limit the attention and resources that can be used for the other 2 kids.
- that she is bullying you into appeasing her. - if genders were reversed and a guy was pressuring a woman into having a baby then there would be uproar.

I see two options for you here op:
1. tell her that you don't want a baby and that you are not changing your mind for the reasons above. Tell her she can have a baby if she wants but she will have to get either another willing partner or a sperm donor and that you will have no involvement whatsoever with anything to do with this pregnancy or a the baby should it go full term. You'll have to reconsider whether the marriage can continue or not based on this.
2. if you want to keep the peace and preserve the marriage you could go off and get the snip on the QT and then later be like, "sure lets see what happens" and then after "aww shoot, no baby, well I guess it wasn't meant to be, maybe it's damage from all your miscarriages" or something.

Paddy Cow

TheBoyConor wrote: »

She is not thinking straight. She is being hugely careless and disrespectful to your wishes and to your family. She needs to be called out on it.

You need to lay down the facts that she needs to understand
- the real possibility of her miscarrying, dying and leaving the 2 kids without a mother. - that's selfish in the extreme.
- that she will strain the family finaces and limit the attention and resources that can be used for the other 2 kids.
- that she is bullying you into appeasing her. - if genders were reversed and a guy was pressuring a woman into having a baby then there would be uproar.

I see two options for you here op:
1. tell her that you don't want a baby and that you are not changing your mind for the reasons above. Tell her she can have a baby if she wants but she will have to get either another willing partner or a sperm donor and that you will have no involvement whatsoever with anything to do with this pregnancy or a the baby should it go full term. You'll have to reconsider whether the marriage can continue or not based on this.
2. if you want to keep the peace and preserve the marriage you could go off and get the snip on the QT and then later be like, "sure lets see what happens" and then after "aww shoot, no baby, well I guess it wasn't meant to be, maybe it's damage from all your miscarriages" or something.

WTF :eek: Get a vasectomy and then blame future "infertility" on her miscarriages? That is the worst "advice" ever.

Sephiroth_dude

TheBoyConor wrote: »

2. if you want to keep the peace and preserve the marriage you could go off and get the snip on the QT and then later be like, "sure lets see what happens" and then after "aww shoot, no baby, well I guess it wasn't meant to be, maybe it's damage from all your miscarriages" or something.

Jesus christ, you're just full of great advice today aren't ya :rolleyes:.

TheBoyConor

tbh, it had been suggested by two other posters on the thread already before I brought up the idea.

And this is not a novel way of dealing with this issue. I remember seeing a thread from a few years back along the same lines.

If one partner is adamant they want a baby and the other is adamant they don't want one, there is a big problem. There is no compromise possible - you can't have half a baby. With the undisclosed vasectomy basically both sides are satisfied to a degree - the guy doesn't end up burdened by another child and the woman has the opportunity (from her POV at least) to try for a baby but having it just not meant to be and she could make her peace knowing that at least she tried. It's not something that has never happened I'm sure.

nikkibikki

TheBoyConor wrote:

I see two options for you here op: 1. tell her that you don't want a baby and that you are not changing your mind for the reasons above. Tell her she can have a baby if she wants but she will have to get either another willing partner or a sperm donor and that you will have no involvement whatsoever with anything to do with this pregnancy or a the baby should it go full term. You'll have to reconsider whether the marriage can continue or not based on this. 2. if you want to keep the peace and preserve the marriage you could go off and get the snip on the QT and then later be like, "sure lets see what happens" and then after "aww shoot, no baby, well I guess it wasn't meant to be, maybe it's damage from all your miscarriages" or something.

1: She's wife! He actually cares about her and loves her!
2: Deception to this degree would be a huge deal breaker and one sure way to end a marriage. Carrying that secret wouldn't be great for the mental health either. How insensitive and uncaring would you have to be to put your wife through all that and then blame her body?? I don't think the OP would do this.

FurBabyMomma

Was waiting for someone to roll on in with the 'if the genders were reversed' hypothetical. It's always sooooo helpful ðŸ˜

LegacyUser

TheBoyConor wrote: »

tbh, it had been suggested by two other posters on the thread already before I brought up the idea.

The others just suggested getting the snip on QT not to mentally torture the wife by blaming the lack of pregnancy on her health issues!

TheBoyConor

Right well there's no need to say it's because of her issues, you could just be saying it's not meant to be, or whatever.

ahnow

Reading some of your “advice” on boards these days is amazing. You come across as a complete idiot with absolutely no conscience or consideration for other people.

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Right well there's no need to say it's because of her issues, you could just be saying it's not meant to be, or whatever.

TheBoyConor

That's fine. That's your opinion. An opinion which is also reported. Thanks.

Paddy Cow

TheBoyConor wrote: »

tbh, it had been suggested by two other posters on the thread already before I brought up the idea.

And this is not a novel way of dealing with this issue. I remember seeing a thread from a few years back along the same lines.

If one partner is adamant they want a baby and the other is adamant they don't want one, there is a big problem. There is no compromise possible - you can't have half a baby. With the undisclosed vasectomy basically both sides are satisfied to a degree - the guy doesn't end up burdened by another child and the woman has the opportunity (from her POV at least) to try for a baby but having it just not meant to be and she could make her peace knowing that at least she tried. It's not something that has never happened I'm sure.

It was also shot down by everyone else as a really bad idea. Plus the others didn't suggest compounding the deception by blaming the wife's previous miscarriages when no baby is conceived. What you suggested is actually the sickest advice I've read on PI and I've come across some clankers.