kylith wrote: » Or, y'know, don't go dropping the hand or groping her without invitation.
Sweetemotion wrote: » Luckily for the John there was CCTV footage.
ash23 wrote: » He will get a slap on the wrist if found guilty. But at least it will show society that this kind of behaviour is not at all acceptable and not just harmless flirtation
ceadaoin. wrote: » it's pretty dire behaviour that should stop really
ash23 wrote: » Them spending time talking, dancing or even flirting with someone doesn't give an open door to that kind of physical contact.
sbsquarepants wrote: » it's just not acceptable to go shoving your hands wherever you feel like. John Leslie is a naughty boy. .
Mason Loose Dust wrote: » But here there is a clear difference between what people have learned is acceptable and what is now deemed acceptable.
Lady Spangles wrote: » Perhaps not, but it's about damn time we started to teach boys that that is NOT okay. They need to start keeping their hands to themselves unless they get explicit consent. .
Lady Spangles wrote: » Basically, what you're whining about, is women standing up to you and not allowing you to have your way on a whim.
jimgoose wrote: » This is about someone putting their hand inside someone else's trousers in a nightclub ...Well here is the news - you can't do that.
Lady Spangles wrote: » Of course. But, whether you want to acknowledge it or not, it's boys and men who have the greater sense of entitlement when it comes to groping and sexual assault. They're also far more likely to turn violent and abusive when rejected.
optogirl wrote: » Most people - male or female - know that grabbing anyone by the crotch is not on, Nor is pinching a colleagues bum - I wouldn't fuppin DREAM of doing either because it's a violation of that person no matter how much 'craic' you think you are having. .
jimgoose wrote: » No-one who hasn't had a brainectomy should need to be told that putting your hand inside someone's clothes and touching them like that is The Wrong Thing(TM). Capiche?
sbsquarepants wrote: » Some people just have no respect for other people. I can't stand that blokey, touchy, feely, grabby shít. I've been in nightclubs over the years The obvious course of action is to keep your damn hands to yourself - is that really too much to ask?
bubblypop wrote: » I don't believe people should touch you if you don't wish them too, just tell them the next time
Glass fused light wrote: » If someone puts hands or other body parts on you without your permission it's assault. I don't get the weird idea that it's wrong to check that a partner is ok with what is happening by using words. If the person can't do that, then prehaps they need to question if they should be doing what they are doing with the person they are doing it with.
Olsky wrote: » She said: “They were dancing and I could see he had his hand on her lower back which I felt was inappropriate, I would have felt uncomfortable if it was me. Questioned if the position of his hand is appropriate for a ballroom dance style hold, she said: “I don’t think it is appropriate for hands to be placed on lower backs. “ I didn’t think that dancing with this person, the way he had his hand on her, I didn’t think it was appropriate.”
Olsky wrote: » Well at least this thread has allowed us to get the femaie perspective on interactions in nightclubs. It has been very informative.
Pac1Man wrote: » Every one of these threads awakens the same crowd from their slumber who obviously have an axe to grind because of something that happened in their past, disregarding any innocent verdict as simply a lack of evidence. It wouldn't be reflective of the balanced majority.
Pac1Man wrote: » It's not the greatest study to be honest. Every one of these threads awakens the same crowd from their slumber who obviously have an axe to grind because of something that happened in their past, disregarding any innocent verdict as simply a lack of evidence. It wouldn't be reflective of the balanced majority.
Olsky wrote: » Do you mean...the #metoo Feminazis?
Conservatory wrote: » kylith wrote: » Or, y'know, don't go dropping the hand or groping her without invitation. Have you ever given somebody an invitation to touch your bum. I’m with the wife about ten years and never once did she ask to be groped.
kylith wrote: » Another person who can’t tell the difference between the actions of someone you know and trust and the actions of a stranger...
Olsky wrote: » I think that one of the saddest "accomplishments" of #metoo is that they have largely succeeded in ending touch between people in our society. I remember being in work environments not so long ago and people were hugging and touching one another all the time. Now granted there were always those with phobias about human contact and that was respected but in general there was touch. And another thing. It wasn't really sexual. It was just touch between people. That is now largely gone. People are terrified of the potential consequences of touching someone and a lot of people have no human touch in their lives and I think that's very sad.
One eyed Jack wrote: » It hasn't done any such thing, and claims that it has are simply giving it credibility and legitimacy it doesn't deserve, as it hasn't achieved anything like your claims.
Outlaw Pete wrote: » Sorry, Jack, have to disagree with you there, have had numerous friends over the past while tell me that they have become super vigilant around women they don't know, to make damn sure they don't so much as make the slightest contact with them which could be misconstrued or twisted. Even Bill Burr said at his gig recently that he walked into a waitress a few months ago and accidentally touched her behind and he immediately started over apologizing.
One eyed Jack wrote: » I've no doubt there are some people who are hypersensitive to these sorts of things that they do indeed become paranoid to the point where it's debilitating, but I don't agree that it had the influence on society or people in general that the OP claims it has had. .
Olsky wrote: » Really. I think the movements influence has been pernicious and pervasive. And this trial. Centered on a man touching a woman in a night club is very much part of that agenda
Olsky wrote: » Oh. Like for example you are in a nightclub and a woman that you had been chatting to earlier approaches you and asks if you would like to have a dance with her?
Outlaw Pete wrote: » It's not para-fcuking-noia, Jack. We have women like Rosemary McCabe retrospectively saying she was raped, women saying men that walked by them briefly in a train station, penetrated them. I linked you to a case from a Dublin club where there was scant evidence that a guy groped a woman but yet he was charged with it. You think men who are more mindful now, in light of certain nonsense cases coming to court are paranoid? That's just an easy out in fairness.
Outlaw Pete wrote: » So, these cases are only reported cause they are rare? Yeah, nothing to do with the fact that Leslie is/was a celeb. Truth is, if he was a nobody, it wouldn't have made the papers. We most likely only hear of a fraction of such cases, in the same way most rape trials go unreported, unless there is a celeb involved.
Course I highly doubt you'd say a woman being more vigilant around strange men at night was being paranoid. Men doing so though, just irrational fools.
Olsky wrote: » glass fused light wrote: If someone puts hands or other body parts on you without your permission it's assault. I don't get the weird idea that it's wrong to check that a partner is ok with what is happening by using words. If the person can't do that, then prehaps they need to question if they should be doing what they are doing with the person they are doing it with. Well at least this thread has allowed us to get the femaie perspective on interactions in nightclubs. It has been very informative.
glass fused light wrote: If someone puts hands or other body parts on you without your permission it's assault. I don't get the weird idea that it's wrong to check that a partner is ok with what is happening by using words. If the person can't do that, then prehaps they need to question if they should be doing what they are doing with the person they are doing it with.
nullzero wrote: » I have been groped by women, do I consider it sexual assault? No, because it isn't. It isn't right that somebody should grope you but it isn't in the category of sexual assault and to say it is dilutes the meaning on the term. If someone puts hands or other body parts on you without your permission it's assault. If the person gropes you ie uses hands or other body parts on you without your permission to make indecent contact for their sexual gratification it's legally sexual assault. You may not consider that it as sexual assault but legally it is. Most people who are charged with serious sexual assaults don't start off by jumping on someone who has to fight them off. It would normally start with not respecting that the other person has a right not to be touched. I don't get the weird idea that it's wrong to check that a partner is ok with what is happening by using words. If the person can't do that, then prehaps they need to question if they should be doing what they are doing with the person they are doing it with.
nullzero wrote: » I have been groped by women, do I consider it sexual assault? No, because it isn't. It isn't right that somebody should grope you but it isn't in the category of sexual assault and to say it is dilutes the meaning on the term.
Olsky wrote: » In my opinion the puritanism and sexual repression demanded by the #metoo movement has begun to exceed anything achieved by the catholic church at the height of their powers or the victorian puritans centuries ago. Having largely succeeded in getting rid of any flirting or physical contact "in the workplace" they have now turned their attention to "inappropriate" touching in nightclubs. Any like any orthodoxy people are terrified of challenging it. Read the court report on the trial below and give your opinion. John Leslie, a former Blue Peter presenter has gone on trial accused of putting his hand down a woman’s trousers and touching her buttocks as they danced in a nightclub in Edinburgh in June 2017.
wakka12 wrote: » :eek: I think it would be sad reflection on society if somebody goes to jail for putting their hand on somebodys lower back while dancing
