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Donald Trump Presidency discussion thread III

Quin_Dub

This thread is for the continuing discussion of Donald Trumps's presidency in the US and any related matters.

Please ensure that you are familiar with the charter before posting.

Thanks.

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BabyCheeses

eagle eye wrote: »

Respect for the office of President is not political correctness.

In your own words

eagle eye wrote: »

I'm if the opinion that the world needed a Trump like world leader. A guy who doesn't give a hoot about political correctness, a guy who can just have a huff and tell you to f off at any time.

Do you think it is respectful to tell the president to **** off?

Professor Moriarty

pixelburp wrote: »

The obvious response to this would be to wonder what the odds were for Trump during the 2016 campaign. IIRC fivethirtyeight were one of the few current-affairs outlets giving him a decent chance of winning (1 in 3 I believe) when all others predicted Clinton to walk it - did the bookies say the same?

He was as low as 6/4 after the first presidential debate. Fluctuated out as far as 5/1 before the election. He was 25/1 when he first announced his bid to be the GOP candidate.

I think he's presently so low for a couple of reasons. He's the incumbent and almost certainly won't face a challenge within the GOP so this basically gives him a 50/50 chance (if he doesn't die/resign). Also, there is no defined opposition candidate so it's not yet possible to contrast and compare.

Pelvis

I reckon if Bernie runs again he'll win. I don't think age will be an issue.

Leroy42

i see the reviews from the summit is less than impressed.

Ask why Trump hadn't got NK to agree to Denuke in the agreement he said they simply ran out of time!

So Trump, and let none of us forget that he styled himself as the greatest deal maker in the world, seems to have given in on most things that NK wanted and got very little in return.

now normally I would be on the side of those that say that its a start, its better than before. But that is trying to omit the fact that Trump himself says he is the deal maker.

Yet, in as much as we can tell, it really seems that Trump achieved very little concrete in terms of new commitments from NK. The best that can be said is that although he agreed to both stopping military exercises in the region and pulling out US troops, that both will take ages to actually take effect and weren't that important anyway.

LuckyLloyd

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

He was as low as 6/4 after the first presidential debate. Fluctuated out as far as 5/1 before the election. He was 25/1 when he first announced his bid to be the GOP candidate.

I think he's presently so low for a couple of reasons. He's the incumbent and almost certainly won't face a challenge within the GOP so this basically gives him a 50/50 chance (if he doesn't die/resign). Also, there is no defined opposition candidate so it's not yet possible to contrast and compare.

I don't believe he will win a second election, and I believe that - for the reasons you articulate above - the current prices are reflective of contextual issues outside of a true assessment of his chances to win in a direct POTUS campaign.

StringerBell

Pelvis wrote: »

I reckon if Bernie runs again he'll win. I don't think age will be an issue.

Be amazed if Bernie won an actual presidency campaign.

He is far too lefty for too much of the country to win imo.

Professor Moriarty

Leroy42 wrote: »

i see the reviews from the summit is less than impressed.

Ask why Trump hadn't got NK to agree to Denuke in the agreement he said they simply ran out of time!

So Trump, and let none of us forget that he styled himself as the greatest deal maker in the world, seems to have given in on most things that NK wanted and got very little in return.

now normally I would be on the side of those that say that its a start, its better than before. But that is trying to omit the fact that Trump himself says he is the deal maker.

Yet, in as much as we can tell, it really seems that Trump achieved very little concrete in terms of new commitments from NK. The best that can be said is that although he agreed to both stopping military exercises in the region and pulling out US troops, that both will take ages to actually take effect and weren't that important anyway.

He was magnificent at the press conference afterwards:

On being asked if he trusted Kim:
“I may be wrong, I mean I may stand before you in six months and say, ‘Hey I was wrong.’ I don’t know that I’ll ever admit that, but I’ll find some kind of an excuse.”

On being asked about how NK might develop its economy:
“As an example they’ve got great beaches… I explained, you could have the best hotels in the world right there. Think of it from a real estate perspective.”

On being asked about 100000 prisoners being held in NK gulags:
“They are one of the great winners today. That large group of people that you are talking about. I think they will be one of the great winners as a group."

On being asked about notes from the meeting for verification:
“I don't have to verify because I have one of the great memories of all time,”

Professor Moriarty

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I don't believe he will win a second election, and I believe that - for the reasons you articulate above - the current prices are reflective of contextual issues outside of a true assessment of his chances to win in a direct POTUS campaign.

Personally, I think he'll be forced to resign. He has far too much baggage.

markodaly

Leroy42 wrote: »

I think your post answers your own point. The trajectory is pretty clear at this point. Trump is the outcome, not the cause.

This 100%

If people think that 2020 will be a normal campaign, they are sorely mistaken. Trump and the Democratic nominee will both be isolationist in a sense and if Trump is not there, so will the GOP nominee.

There is no going back to the days of Clinton, Bush, Obama. Those days are over.

Again people are falling for the oldest trick in the book, they cannot tell the bark from the trees.

Trump is the symptom, not the cause.

Podge_irl

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Guess who is the bookies' hot favourite to be elected POTUS in 2020.

He will remain the "hot favourite" until such time as a democratic candidate secures the nomination. It means literally nothing at this point in time. 7/4 isn't even particularly good odds. If you want to see how the bookies rate his chances of a second win you should be looking at their odds for a democrat win, not individual candidates.

robinph

Leroy42 wrote: »

Ask why Trump hadn't got NK to agree to Denuke in the agreement he said they simply ran out of time!

That was the whole bloody point of interacting with NK and having the meeting. You don't run out of time to negotiate the denuclearisation, you just keep going with the negotiations as there is no time limit.

Now you might give up because you reach an impasse for the moment and have to come back again another time to try to thrash things out again, but running out of time is not an acceptable reason for stopping the talking.

Corkblowin

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

He was magnificent at the press conference afterwards:

On being asked about notes from the meeting for verification:
“I don't have to verify because I have one of the great memories of all time,”

That will be a good quote to have if/when he's questioned by Mueller

ancapailldorcha

No more video dumps please. Post deleted.

everlast75

Leroy42 wrote: »

i see the reviews from the summit is less than impressed.

Ask why Trump hadn't got NK to agree to Denuke in the agreement he said they simply ran out of time!

So Trump, and let none of us forget that he styled himself as the greatest deal maker in the world, seems to have given in on most things that NK wanted and got very little in return.

now normally I would be on the side of those that say that its a start, its better than before. But that is trying to omit the fact that Trump himself says he is the deal maker.

Yet, in as much as we can tell, it really seems that Trump achieved very little concrete in terms of new commitments from NK. The best that can be said is that although he agreed to both stopping military exercises in the region and pulling out US troops, that both will take ages to actually take effect and weren't that important anyway.

The scary part of this is... in Trump's tiny mind, as far as he is concerned, the North Korea problem is solved! It's done - it was easy to him. Now, let's move on people. When do i get my Nobel prize?

He probably thinks he solved the Israel problem by moving the embassy too

listermint

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

He was magnificent at the press conference afterwards:

On being asked if he trusted Kim:
“I may be wrong, I mean I may stand before you in six months and say, ‘Hey I was wrong.’ I don’t know that I’ll ever admit that, but I’ll find some kind of an excuse.”

On being asked about how NK might develop its economy:
“As an example they’ve got great beaches… I explained, you could have the best hotels in the world right there. Think of it from a real estate perspective.”

On being asked about 100000 prisoners being held in NK gulags:
“They are one of the great winners today. That large group of people that you are talking about. I think they will be one of the great winners as a group."

On being asked about notes from the meeting for verification:
“I don't have to verify because I have one of the great memories of all time,”

On this point

On being asked about how NK might develop its economy:
“As an example they’ve got great beaches… I explained, you could have the best hotels in the world right there. Think of it from a real estate perspective.”

He actually said theyve great beaches have you seen their beaches they're great you can see them when they are firing off their big rockets great beaches.

Which is far more funny.

VinLieger

listermint wrote: »

On this point

On being asked about how NK might develop its economy:
“As an example they’ve got great beaches… I explained, you could have the best hotels in the world right there. Think of it from a real estate perspective.”

He actually said theyve great beaches have you seen their beaches they're great you can see them when they are firing off their big rockets great beaches.

Which is far more funny.

Who wants to bet money theres russian developers who already have plans for numerous hotels on said beaches that will have trumps name all over them?

Walter Bishop

StringerBell wrote: »

Be amazed if Bernie won an actual presidency campaign.

He is far too lefty for too much of the country to win imo.

Love the way Bernie is written off as some un-electable Marxist.

One of Bernie's big ideas in the run up to 2016 was to install a 50% tax rate on income over $10 million. For this he was derided as a socialist, a loony left winger etc.

Meanwhile in Ireland we pay 50% on income over about €35,000. Only in the US would wanting that tax rate on income over 10 million have you discredited as the second coming of Lenin.

Christy42

Walter Bishop wrote: »

StringerBell wrote: »

Be amazed if Bernie won an actual presidency campaign.

He is far too lefty for too much of the country to win imo.

Love the way Bernie is written off as some un-electable Marxist.

One of Bernie's big ideas in the run up to 2016 was to install a 50% tax rate on income over $10 million. For this he was derided as a socialist, a loony left winger etc.

Meanwhile in Ireland we pay 50% on income over about €35,000. Only in the US would wanting that tax rate on income over 10 million have you discredited as the second coming of Lenin.

Over there he is. Bernie never had the GOP run serious campaigns against him on those grounds and they will. Then in 2021 people will say it is all the democrats fault and they should have run someone more electable than a communist. Having said that it would be the same for many candidates. The hit squad will be assembled and both candidates will be incredibly unpopular because that is the only way for the GOP to win. They have to drove up hatred of the Dem candidate as they can't really discuss their own.

Realistically I think the Dems need as boring a candidate as possible. The GOP will run over time trying to attack them and distract from their own chaos.

Walter Bishop

The Democratic candidate will be derided as a communist who *gasp* doesn't want to cut taxes, line the pockets of the wealthy or have all poor people executed, no matter who they are.

mcmoustache

ABC is reporting that Cohen's lawyers are leaving the case and suggesting that he may be about to cooperate with prosecutors.

As attorneys for Michael Cohen rush to meet Judge Kimba Wood’s Friday deadline to complete a privilege review of over 3.7 million documents seized in the April 9 raids of Cohen’s New York properties and law office, a source representing this matter has disclosed to ABC News that the law firm handling the case for Cohen is not expected to represent him going forward.

Cohen, now with no legal representation, is likely to cooperate with federal prosecutors in New York, sources said. This development, which is believed to be imminent, will likely hit the White House, family members, staffers and counsels hard.

It's worth noting that these reports aren't confirmed as yet so pinch of salt and all that. We should know whether the first part is true by Friday at the latest but I've no idea about when we'll know about any cooperation with prosecutors. It's still possible that his legal team is leaving but that Cohen has no intention of cooperating.

All that said, Cohen is in some serious jeopardy. The FBI got their hands on a crazy amount of evidence a few months ago after raids on his properties and office. If he's faced with decades behind bars, flipping would be his only realistic option to either avoid doing time or at least get a softer sentence. And if he does that, he has a lot of information to share on Trump's Russian ties and the 2016 election.

EDIT:According to someone on twitter quoting the WSJ which I can't see, Cohen is looking for a New York based lawyer with SDNY experience. I don't know what that means in terms of the possibility of him cooperating with prosecutors.

For Forks Sake

Walter Bishop wrote: »

Love the way Bernie is written off as some un-electable Marxist.

One of Bernie's big ideas in the run up to 2016 was to install a 50% tax rate on income over $10 million. For this he was derided as a socialist, a loony left winger etc.

Meanwhile in Ireland we pay 50% on income over about €35,000. Only in the US would wanting that tax rate on income over 10 million have you discredited as the second coming of Lenin.

Yeah but what Americans call leftists/liberals would be somewhere to the right of the bloody Tories by European standards

Phonehead

So it appears that this meeting would make a local GAA AGM look like a professional convention.

1) Absolutely zero notes, tapes or anything maintained to document what was said or agreed.
2) Trump showed Kim a 2 minute amateur hour video on his iPad which projected what life would be like after denuclearization. LOL and they used a production companies logo who had zero input into the video. Said company was quick to heavily criticize “The whole enterprise reeks of amateurism and comes off as an attempt to check the box on a harebrained idea that presumably originated in the oval office.”

How anyone can defend such basic stupidity from a President and his team is beyond me. What an absolute waste of time this whole thing was.

jobbridge4life

Phonehead wrote: »

So it appears that this meeting would make a local GAA AGM look like a professional convention.

1) Absolutely zero notes, tapes or anything maintained to document what was said or agreed.
2) Trump showed Kim a 2 minute amateur hour video on his iPad which projected what life would be like after denuclearization. LOL and they used a production companies logo who had zero input into the video. Said company was quick to heavily criticize “The whole enterprise reeks of amateurism and comes off as an attempt to check the box on a harebrained idea that presumably originated in the oval office.”

How anyone can defend such basic stupidity from a President and his team is beyond me. What an absolute waste of time this whole thing was.

Defend it? There are posters here who are calling for the Nobel Peace Prize... and tragically they aren't alone in this madness.

It is a cult.

mcmoustache

mcmoustache wrote: »

...stuff about Cohen's legal team leaving etc in previous post...

CNN is reporting that he has another lawyer. Once it's known who this is, we'll have a better idea about his intentions re cooperation.

Some lawyers specialise in defending their clients and others specialise in plea deals. If this lawyer is known for handling plea deals, then it'll be obvious what's going on here. A similar fate befell Rick Gates when he swapped out his defence team for a plea lawyer.

I guess we'll know soon enough.

mcmoustache

jobbridge4life wrote: »

Defend it? There are posters here who are calling for the Nobel Peace Prize... and tragically they aren't alone in this madness.

It is a cult.

It absolutely is. Everything Trump does is awesome as far as they're concerned and they agree with everything he says even when he changes his mind. All opposition against Trump is unfair and he should be respected like a deity. It's a personality cult, the likes of which you'd only see in so called shíthole countries.

2 Scoops

Ranting and raving about a foreign leader everyday for the past 18 months is normal "opposition" is it? I'd say it's you lot who have the personality disorder.

Beechwoodspark

everlast75 wrote: »

The scary part of this is... in Trump's tiny mind, as far as he is concerned, the North Korea problem is solved! It's done - it was easy to him. Now, let's move on people. When do i get my Nobel prize?

He probably thinks he solved the Israel problem by moving the embassy too

Trump is too feckless and lazy to bother his hole actually putting serious effort into these huge issues.

Instead he wants the photo op and gimmicks-broadcast live on fox. That’s job done as far as he’s concerned.

Phonehead

2 Scoops wrote: »

Ranting and raving about a foreign leader everyday for the past 18 months is normal "opposition" is it? I'd say it's you lot who have the personality disorder.

Discussing the actions of the President of the USA in a thread dedicated to his Presidency in a Politics forum

But the fact that you have to attack the posters and not defend him, this tells me that you can't actually defend what is being discussed.

jobbridge4life

2 Scoops wrote: »

Ranting and raving about a foreign leader everyday for the past 18 months is normal "opposition" is it? I'd say it's you lot who have the personality disorder.

Criticism of the leader is a mental illness now?

Is there no end to the indoctrination?

alchemist33

2 Scoops wrote: »

Ranting and raving about a foreign leader everyday for the past 18 months is normal "opposition" is it? I'd say it's you lot who have the personality disorder.

I'd say you don't know what a personality disorder