_Dara_ wrote: » That’s stats for the UK. A different country. Who knows why there are more surgical abortions there. Abortion under 12 weeks can be carried out using the pills. It’s much less invasive that way. Why would anyone decide on a surgical abortion over that? Seriously like? “Nah, that’s too easy, gimme a surgical abortion!”.
end of the road wrote: » harassment is already a crime. i support anyone's right to protest regardless of whether i agree with them or not. in the past i would have believed in restricting the protesting by groups i disagree with but the years have thought me that such is not a good idea and can only end badly.
end of the road wrote: » they really aren't required and would be a waste of time money and resources that can be used elsewhere to actual effect. as i said the people who would protest outside these facilities feel that strongly about the issue that not even prison would stop them. anything that restricts the right to protest is in my view dangerous to democracy and has the ability to be extended beyond abortion facilities and to effect us all. if you want the protests gone, then in my view shutting the facilities and changing to a gp and hospital lead service is the best option.
pitifulgod wrote: » In the UK, zones were setup because it amounted to intimidation of women using Marie Stopes.
pitifulgod wrote: » Also, the ICBR doing similar outside of our maternity hospitals was designed to upset, in a same buildng where women would be dealing with miscarriages as well as a pregnancies. It's disgraceful and intimidating.
Fighting Tao wrote: » Jeez. We may as well sack all Gardaí with that thinking. They are a waste of time, money and resources. Why would they ever be needed to protect people?
Outlaw Pete wrote: » Seen a lot of posts like the above, both before and after the vote, and it's just simply untrue. Well then you got him to vote Yes by giving him false information. Abortions at 12 weeks and under in this country will NOT all be pill based. That is not the way it has been in the UK, France or Holland and there is zero reason to think that the abortions methods used here will be any different to elsewhere. In 2016 (in the UK) 28% of abortions between 3 - 9 weeks were surgical and 84% of them between weeks 10 - 12: Not that I feel it matters a whole lot how a baby in the womb reaches their demise (the end result is the same after all). However, the reason I feel it very much matters that it was incorrectly stated over and over again throughout the campaign is because voters (as evidenced by the user quoted) based their decision on it. Telling people that 'Ah sure, it's just two pills and a heavy period' as many prochoice campaigners did, including Clare Daly, helped support the false narrative that a developing baby at between 10 - 12 weeks is just a 'clump of cells'. Bit harder to convince someone of that nonsense when you give them the truth and not just the truth with regards to likely abortive methods which will be used here but the full truth on what a late first trimester abortion can often entail.
end of the road wrote: » i'm aware of that, however my personal view is that they will make no difference and may even be quietly dropped long term. being frank i'd also wonder if the reason for their introduction was more about loss of business rather then intimidation which is surely already covered by uk law? would these clinics pay council tax or business rates or how does that work?
end of the road wrote: » shutting the facilities and changing to a gp and hospital lead service is the best option.
Overheal wrote: » Hogwash. As we all know from reading the last few pages of this thread your grandmother was a brainwashed university liberal who just wanted to fit in with the progressive agenda because she can’t think for herself :rolleyes:
Loafing Oaf wrote: » Or how about not opening abortion clinics in the first place and going with a GP-led service? I wonder is there any chance the government would go down that road...
Shurimgreat wrote: » Certainly not as simple as two pills and a heavy period.www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/abortion/the-abortion-pill/what-can-i-expect-if-i-take-abortion-pillhttps://www.bpas.org/abortion-care/abortion-treatments/the-abortion-pill/abortion-pill-up-to-10-weeks/
Shurimgreat wrote: » A question here. If a young girl or woman is raped and they don't find out they are pregnant until after the 12 week limit what happens then? It would be rare but possible. The girl or woman might also be undecided what to do. We know some women don't report rape even though everyone should be encoraged to report it asap. Will there be provision after the 12 week limit for rape victims? And if so doesn't this sort of invalidate the 12 week limit?
Shurimgreat wrote: » A question here. If a young girl or woman is raped and they don't find out they are pregnant until after the 12 week limit what happens then? It would be rare but possible. The girl or woman might also be undecided what to do. We know some women don't report rape even though everyone should be encoraged to report it asap.Will there be provision after the 12 week limit for rape victims? And if so doesn't this sort of invalidate the 12 week limit?
Elisabeth Wrong Stork wrote: » The pills are a less good option after ten weeks as far as I recall. The abortion pills would also be contraindicated for some medical conditions, surgery would be needed sometimes in ectopic cases (I'm not sure if they're included in Pete's figures). Selective abortions, where there's more than one foetus and you're only getting rid of one, obviously have to be performed surgically. Some women will also opt for a surgical abortion because they'd prefer it. It's quicker, they might not trust the pills to work, and I'm googling studies now and for women who've had a medical abortion previously, the bleeding and pain was too bad for them to want to do it again. The ratio of medical abortions to surgical abortions has been climbing continuously for years in the UK, and they're doing all they can to make sure that continues.
Sheep breeder wrote: » I think you need to get a good pair of glasses and read the post.
DubInMeath wrote: » From the first link you posted For most people, the cramping and bleeding usually starts 1-4 hours after taking the misoprostol. It’s normal to see large blood clots (up to the size of a lemon) or clumps of tissue when the abortion is happening. It’s kind of like having a really heavy, crampy period,and the process is very similar to an early miscarriage
Timberrrrrrrr wrote: » I certainly hope there will be.
Elisabeth Wrong Stork wrote: » People who think describing something as "like a very heavy period" is belittling or trivialising should just wear a big sign saying "I know nothing about women's bodies". The phrase "like a very heavy period" is enough to put the absolute fear of god into me!
retro:electro wrote: » If she wants to keep it she can keep it. If her mental health is affected she may be offered a termination on those grounds.
Shurimgreat wrote: » Grand. So how do they prove they were raped?
Elisabeth Wrong Stork wrote: People who think describing something as "like a very heavy period" is belittling or trivialising should just wear a big sign saying "I know nothing about women's bodies". The phrase "like a very heavy period" is enough to put the absolute fear of god into me!
Shurimgreat wrote: » Sounds very like the current UK model to me ie the mental health grounds. I''m not demeaning mental health but we know its been misused to a degree in the UK case.
Fighting Tao wrote: » Shouldn't you have had this conversation before the referendum?
![Photo of [Deleted User]](https://wf.vanillicon.com/v2/f07ee44b0b39bbb635066da4046d9475.svg)
