El_Duderino 09 wrote: » I believe you when you admit you didn’t follow.
El_Duderino 09 wrote: » You’re crying sexist attack on men, I tried to find a generalisable standard for the attack, you didn’t understand why.
Maxpfizer wrote: » How is it not an attack to try and join when you know the action of "trying to join" will result in the disbanding of the group? "Oh, I wasn't attacking them, I was just getting them shut down". It seems like a lot of unnecessary nitpicking to me. OK, don't call it an attack on the group. Call it a deliberate attempt to shut down the group. It's almost like the "women can't be sexist" argument. Sure, we can be prejudiced against someone based on their gender and treat them differently or badly based on gender but we aren't sexist. Without the mental gymnastics it was an attack. With the mental gymnastics it was an attempt to get the group shut down. What's the difference again?
El_Duderino 09 wrote: » You’re omitting the other option, to disband or accept the new members. They chose to disband and re establish as a private club. Problem solved. They got to comply with the rules and keep the choir Male only AND men get to feel they were attacked for being men as Silverharp demonstrated above. They get to have their cake and eat it. Only difference is they have to find somewhere else to practice. Sweet deal in the end.
silverharp wrote: » [ why is it a sweet deal?, I assume they have lost their standard gigs throughout the year. So now they are without facilities or will have to pay higher fees to stay in the group and find a new audience. Sounds really bad for them
El_Duderino 09 wrote: » You’re making a lot of stretching assumptions there. But let’s grant you the persecution you want. They have 60 years of history and connections. It’s not like they’re a brand new club starting from scratch. They just re established and changed one word in the name. It’s not perfect but it’s not the doomsday scenario you’re looking for. Strange that the article was so friendly to the choir but it didn’t mention the problems you imagined.
silverharp wrote: » El_Duderino 09 wrote: » You’re making a lot of stretching assumptions there. But let’s grant you the persecution you want. They have 60 years of history and connections. It’s not like they’re a brand new club starting from scratch. They just re established and changed one word in the name. It’s not perfect but it’s not the doomsday scenario you’re looking for. Strange that the article was so friendly to the choir but it didn’t mention the problems you imagined. my wife is in a choir, so I am all too familiar with the financial and administrative side of running one.
NI24 wrote: » Buttonftw, debate can't happen in a thread where 99% of the posters agree with each other-- that's a circle jerk, not a debate. And I'm surprised you're angry with the mods when they didn't ban you after your obvious personal attack. Kind of biting the hands that feed you no?
Calhoun wrote: » Indeed it is a circle jerk to an extent but so is the ladies lounge. However i have seen the mods in this forum post and they dont go with the group think by any means. There are certain users who have a certain political view point is from a more feminist perspective and they do rile people up at times, i think they are best ignored.
NI24 wrote: » I have seen the mods in this forum as well and not only do they engage in groupthink, they lead the circlejerk. I'm not sure why you brought up the Ladies Lounge as I believe it is against forum rules to do so and irrelevant at that, but anyone claiming this thread is a debate is delusional. A discussion, maybe, but debate? BAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Calhoun wrote: » NI24 wrote: » Buttonftw, debate can't happen in a thread where 99% of the posters agree with each other-- that's a circle jerk, not a debate. And I'm surprised you're angry with the mods when they didn't ban you after your obvious personal attack. Kind of biting the hands that feed you no? Indeed it is a circle jerk to an extent but so is the ladies lounge. However i have seen the mods in this forum post and they dont go with the group think by any means. There are certain users who have a certain political view point is from a more feminist perspective and they do rile people up at times, i think they are best ignored.
The columnist find it strange he is ‘not allowed to say something good about men’
iptba wrote: » I wasn't sure which thread to post this in:https://twitter.com/DavQuinn/status/983325263336493056 This was discussed on to NewsTalk programs this week as discussed in this Irish Times article today:https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/tv-radio-web/men-are-from-mars-women-are-from-venus-but-what-planet-is-david-quinn-from-1.3459634
"Developing future leaders for higher education Aurora is our women-only leadership development programme. It is a unique partnership initiative bringing together leadership experts and higher education institutions to take positive action to address the under-representation of women in leadership positions in the sector. Over the past four years 3477 women from over 139 institutions across the UK and Ireland have participated. We seek to further support women and their institutions to enable leadership potential, and further embed strong networks across the sector to share best practice, insights and experiences."
Man threatens to bill wife for putting up her ‘disruptive’ mother
NUI Galway wins recognition for gender equality NUI Galway and Maynooth University show ‘solid foundation’ in tackling gender bias
In recent years, NUI Galway has introduced gender quotas for promotion schemes, along with inclusivity and unconscious bias training programmes for managers and staff.
The Minister with responsibility for higher education, Mary Mitchell O’Connor, said achieving gender equality was a key priority. [..] “Gender discrimination, either in pay or promotion, will only disappear when work places mirror real life and reflect the fact that women make up 51 per cent of the population,” she said.
iptba wrote: » This would necessarily represent true equality given how many women stay out of the workforce for significant periods (i.e. years sometimes decades, not months) or only work part-time.
Mens' rights NGO to contest Karnataka elections IANS | Mumbai Last Updated at May 5, 2018 20:05 IST The Save Indian Family Foundation mens' rights group has put up up a candidate in the ensuing Karnataka assembly elections to highlight the plight of men in Indian society, an activist said here on Saturday. As politicians of all major parties ignore many of the issues faced by ordinary men and some even indulge in male-bashing and sexism against men, the SIFF is also urging men activists to contest in elections as independents to ensure that both men and women are treated equally by the government and the legal systems.
Stonedpilot wrote: » There was a 'Alpha Male PUA' group in Dublin. They were more interested in getting off with anything in a Dublin nightclub not really personal empowerment. Look at the reaction to this thread, men empowerment group gets shunned down or ridiculed. Shows how far the cultural marxist feminist brainwashing has gone. When clinical pyschologist like Dr Jordan Peterson tell us men get depressed when they have their masculinity removed we need to address this pronto. I'd welcome a mens empowerment network, would take a lot of men out of depression in my view.
El_Duderino 09 wrote: » Well that's nonsense. Male empowerment is all around you if you don't do your best to ignore it. I'm going to watch the Leinster Vs Munster match on Saturday. Great men on display being role models in terms of their professionalism and dedication to excellence. Marxist feminist detractors absent. I had a chat with my line manager yesterday about career progression, Marxist feminist detractors absent. I turn on the TV and I'll see men and women running the government. You'd have to be blind to not see the male empowerment all around you. What would your male empowerment group do exactly?
Stonedpilot wrote: » It's a sad state of affairs when you see rugby players as rolemodels. Great athletes but 30 guys running around after a ball, wearing outfits smeared in corporate logos for a crooked bank surrounded by advertising for mobile phones, gaming consoles, lotions and countless other stuff people don't need only for a halftime break to sell even more advertising. These men are athletes playing a game, it's entertainmnet nothing more nothing less it means nothing absolutely nothing. Nice to look at don't get me wrong but anyone emotionally involved in rugby is lacking in other important things. It's a game, like looking at a movie for an hour and half. Chewing gum for the mind if you will. Big butch dudes chasing a ball that's your idea of masculinity?. WOW. Really telling how askew and warped people's views of masculinity have become. I recommend reading Dr Jordan Peterson or David Deida to discover masculinity is more that overpaid muscleheads running around like headless chickens after a ball. That is such an incredible insult to men.
El_Duderino 09 wrote: » Lol. Someone didn’t make the senior cup team. I didn’t say rugby players encapsulate masculinity. What I did say was that their professionalism, dedication to excellence are admiral. But to answer your question about masculinity and rugby players more directly, I think it’s fairly well established that physical prowess, courage, dedication to teammates and endurance are some of the elements of masculinity. (They’re probably some of the elements of good adults of any gender tbh). How would the prophet Peterson define masculinity? Does he condescendingly refer to athletes as meatheads etc or is that how you refer to other men? Derogatory rant about rugby aside, what would your male empowerment group do exactly?
Stonedpilot wrote: » No seriously if I had a mens group it would focus on Developing goals Focusing on being self assured Developing mental resilience Helping each other with problems Ensuring men arent discriminated against in workplaces etc. (goes on alot more than you think)
Stonedpilot wrote: » The elements point you bring up those elements can be applied to actual relevant things in life not stupid meaningless team sports. I grew out of that at 20. Wonderful to keep in shape for oneself win things etc , doing it for the "fans" is absurd and illogocial. I bet you are one of the fans who says "we won" when your team wins. What position you play eh?. LOL.
Stonedpilot wrote: » Its quite sad to see men so far removed from their own masculinity they have to identify with a stranger on a pitch playing nothing more than a ball game. Its sad. A stranger they never meet and a stranger who spends his time running around like a headless chicken or on his arse with 10 other men on top of him. How alpha and masculine eh!.
iptba wrote: » I follow lots of sports and have some teams I support. I don't think it is that connected with men's issues nor is it something that contradicts an interest in men's issues. I suppose it comes down to imagining yourself doing the activity and getting a thrill from it (I always preferred playing though). Some people seem to get a similar thrill from dancing but I don't; I think it's because it doesn't particularly appeal to me to be making moves for no particular reason other than to pose. With sports, there is a reason for doing things.
El_Duderino 09 wrote: » Sounds sensible. Now all that's left do do is assume you could never establish such a group for men. Then you can blame the imaginary feminists for thwarting your imaginary group and Bob's your uncle. Yes those elements are great when applied to real life, which is why people who demonstrate those qualities are role models for those qualities. And no, I don't say 'we' unless I was involved myself. I don't expect that to change your view at all. Jeez your issue with rugby seems to go beyond this topic. Meatheads, headless chickens, 10 other men in top of him. Let's assume you're anger towards rugby players had been registered. So how does Peterson define masculinity then?
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