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Belfast rape trial - all 4 found not guilty Mod Note post one

Sam Quentin

Strange.. I'm kinda relieved it's all over.

http://www.thejournal.ie/belfast-rape-trial-verdict-3928309-Mar2018/

Mod Note Keep this relevant to this thread and don't bring up others. ie the eighth amendment thread.

MOD NOTE By the way don't post anything from members on the jury that's appearing online.

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[Deleted User]

jm08 wrote:

Do you think its ok to speculate as to why she thinks this in a disparaging and disrespectful manner?

I do. I think she has shown enough sexist disdain towards men which would lead me to the conclusion that i do not respect her or her views. Respect is given where due.

I see no problem speculating but actually haven't seen any disparaging or disrespectful posts.

jm08

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You claimed it was 'better'.
It most certainly wasn't for many more than it is worse for now.

This is what I claimed:

Times has changed. Your generation were thought to respect everyone and the importance of family values. The accessibility of porn has changed all of that and normalised what was promiscious behaviour back in your day for men and women. Its not going to end well.

RuMan

Greysquirel09 wrote: »

Professional protesters most of them. They know nothing of the complainant or the defendant. Either one could have been lying through their teeth. An opportunity to get their mugs in the paper that's all. Probably the same idiots who protested outside the Dail when a homeless man was found dead, only to discover he was a paedophile afterwards. This women vs men carry on is ridiculous.

Indeed. No doubt there will be a handful protesting as 50k file into the Aviva to cheer on Jacko and the boys in due course.
Best to ignore these people in my experience.

sightband

jm08 wrote: »

This is what I claimed:

F*ck sake, if you are going to quote your own genius and put it in bold at least know the difference between ‘thought’ and ‘taught’. It might help with the aul credence side of things no?

FrancieBrady

jm08 wrote: »

This is what I claimed:

So is it better or worse now?

mfceiling

If anything women are getting treated better nowadays.
There's real conversation about the gender pay gap. More women are getting to the top of their game. Better support networks for new mothers.

I don't agree that the older generation had more respect for women. How many women were beaten by violent husbands and had nobody to call or seek advice from? Nowadays women are encouraged to speak out against this.

The youth today are taught to respect everyone...you can be gay, bi, trans, gender neutral/fluid and there is no judgement. My daughters have muslim friends, friends with divorced parents, friends with a gay father or lesbian mother....this would have been almost unheard of a generation ago.

jm08

sightband wrote: »

F*ck sake, if you are going to quote your own genius and put it in bold at least know the difference between ‘thought’ and ‘taught’. It might help with the aul credence side of things no?

And what is the point you are trying to make. Just because I made a spelling mistake my opinion is not worth anything?

FrancieBrady

mfceiling wrote: »

If anything women are getting treated better nowadays.
There's real conversation about the gender pay gap. More women are getting to the top of their game. Better support networks for new mothers.

I don't agree that the older generation had more respect for women. How many women were beaten by violent husbands and had nobody to call or seek advice from? Nowadays women are encouraged to speak out against this.

The youth today are taught to respect everyone...you can be gay, bi, trans, gender neutral/fluid and there is no judgement. My daughters have muslim friends, friends with divorced parents, friends with a gay father or lesbian mother....this would have been almost unheard of a generation ago.

I'm only in my 50's and I remember my mother having to be 'cleansed' in the church after some of my siblings were born, she also had to cover her head and sit in a different part of the church than the men.
What happened to her body was decided by men and the church.

Better for women? Me ar**.

sightband

mfceiling wrote: »

My daughters have muslim friends, friends with divorced parents, friends with a gay father or lesbian mother....this would have been almost unheard of a generation ago.

Do they really though? That’s a seriously diverse set of friends your daughters have. By the law of averages I’d say you were talking through your hoop.

jm08

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So is it better or worse now?

A lot of things are worse because you in particular and a lot of the posters here do not understand what respect is.

I'm pointing the finger particularly at you because you don't get what the issue is with the rugby players back playing rugby in Ireland again.

The problem is with the lack of respect and attitude to women treating them all like objects to be used and abused.

Now, they have apologised for that but some (including yourself) think the apology is insincere.

sightband

jm08 wrote: »

And what is the point you are trying to make. Just because I made a spelling mistake my opinion is not worth anything?

The point I made was directly after the error I pointed out which you so proudly had in bold writing, but your comprehension seems to be just as poor so here’s my point once again...your credibility/credence is shot to pieces as a result of how thick you come across with your abilities in articulating yourself.;)

FrancieBrady

jm08 wrote: »

A lot of things are worse because you in particular and a lot of the posters here do not understand what respect is.

I'm pointing the finger particularly at you because you don't get what the issue is with the rugby players back playing rugby in Ireland again.

The problem is with the lack of respect and attitude to women treating them all like objects to be used and abused.

Now, they have apologised for that but some (including yourself) think the apology is insincere.

I think the apology is designed to placate people like you and in that sense it is insincere.

I heard the men express their regrets DURING the trial. That was good enough for me because I do not moralise or tut tut about what people get up to in their bedrooms.
I also saw 'disrespect' to some women and not 'all women' as has been rammed down our throats by the shrill noise.

I am not one who thinks that people have to apologise to the whole country never mind to a baying mob looking for a pound of flesh. Any flesh at this stage.

jm08

sightband wrote: »

The point I made was directly after the error I pointed out which you so proudly had in bold writing, but your comprehension seems to be just as poor so here’s my point once again...your credibility/credence is shot to pieces as a result of how thick you come across with your abilities in articulating yourself.;)

That was a repeat of a post I had made earlier (with no highlighting

). I just highlighted the part of the post that was relevant to the question I was asked. The unhighlighted part was not relevant.

jm08

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I think the apology is designed to placate people like you and in that sense it is insincere.

I heard the men express their regrets DURING the trial. That was good enough for me because I do not moralise or tut tut about what people get up to in their bedrooms.
I also saw 'disrespect' to some women and not 'all women' as has been rammed down our throats by the shrill noise.

I am not one who thinks that people have to apologise to the whole country never mind to a baying mob looking for a pound of flesh. Any flesh at this stage.

It was very easy to miss the regret in the trial and certainly was overshadowed by the aggressive post trial statement by Paddy Jackson. Olding got it right.

Those lads were sending photos around their WhatsApp group of Dara Florence captioned 'Love Belfast Sluts'. Of all people for them to refer to as a slut

Thats a fairly big generalisation referring to a 'baying mob' there. Have a little think about that

FrancieBrady

sightband wrote: »

The point I made was directly after the error I pointed out which you so proudly had in bold writing, but your comprehension seems to be just as poor so here’s my point once again...your credibility/credence is shot to pieces as a result of how thick you come across with your abilities in articulating yourself.;)

^^ Consider revising with regard to correct punctuation.

Grammar/Spelling is no indication of articulation. I understood what he meant just as I understood what you meant.

joe40

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I think the apology is designed to placate people like you and in that sense it is insincere.

I heard the men express their regrets DURING the trial. That was good enough for me because I do not moralise or tut tut about what people get up to in their bedrooms.
I also saw 'disrespect' to some women and not 'all women' as has been rammed down our throats by the shrill noise.

I am not one who thinks that people have to apologise to the whole country never mind to a baying mob looking for a pound of flesh. Any flesh at this stage.

I know you disagree with the protestors and you have explained your reasons. But do you really believe anyone at all is moralising or "tut tuting" as you put it about people's sex lives.
That is just disingenuous. You may not agree with the protestors thats fine I don't agree with some aspects, but no one is moralising about sex, it is the consent part.
Using deflection or twisting points
would not convince a neutral in this debate.

FrancieBrady

jm08 wrote: »

It was very easy to miss the regret in the trial and certainly was overshadowed by the aggressive post trial statement by Paddy Jackson. Olding got it right.

Those lads were sending photos around their WhatsApp group of Dara Florence captioned 'Love Belfast Sluts'. Of all people for them to refer to as a slut

Thats a fairly big generalisation referring to a 'baying mob' there. Have a little think about that

The complainant was also referring to her as 'slutty'. It is a word which I really think has lost a lot of it's venom as an insult. It is used a lot more commonly about a lot more behaviour than of old.

I thought Jackson was angry rather than aggressive after the trial myself and I could fully empahtise with that even before I heard that the PSNI recommended no charges should be brought.

FrancieBrady

joe40 wrote: »

I know you disagree with the protestors and you have explained your reasons. But do you really believe anyone at all is moralising or "tut tuting" as you put it about people's sex lives.
That is just disingenuous. You may not agree with the protestors thats fine I don't agree with some aspects, but no one is moralising about sex, it is the consent part.
Using deflection or twisting points
would not convince a neutral in this debate.

I and nobody else has any right to think that the sex wasn't consensual. I am not sure why people cannot get that through their heads.
Present new evidence by all means to prove otherwise. But based on what we know it was consensual.

There has been loads of commentary about what went on in the bedroom.

RuMan

So will Joe go with 2 or 3 OH's for the rugby football WC? Thinking he'll go with Sexton and Jacko as specialists and take Carbery as a utility back

upandcumming

mfceiling wrote:

If anything women are getting treated better nowadays. There's real conversation about the gender pay gap.

And thankfully that conversation has led to more people realising that the gender pay gap isn't only a myth, but a lie.

Silentcorner

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The complainant was also referring to her as 'slutty'. It is a word which I really think has lost a lot of it's venom as an insult. It is used a lot more commonly about a lot more behaviour than of old.

I thought Jackson was angry rather than aggressive after the trial myself and I could fully empahtise with that even before I heard that the PSNI recommended no charges should be brought.

You should remember, it was an anonymous source that is claiming that, you'll note, there was no explanation for the charges put to Rory Harrisson by the PSNI, despite the fact the young lady made no complaint against him at all!!! Did the anonymous source have an explanation for that one??

It actually doesn't matter what Jackson or any of the other lads said, their reputations will never recover from this, which, is not right in my opinion, but they are now too victims of that barbaric system of how The North in particular trial rape cases!...they are not the only victims!

jackboy

99% of men and women have described someone as a slut at done stage. That word is just thrown around a lot. Reminds me of when I was skiing in France and a couple of the instructors informed me that Irish girls are known as the sluts of Europe. This shocked me mostly because a lot of Irish guys were describing French girls as the sluts of Europe.

It is a nasty word to use but it's generally just bull**** talk with nothing real to back it up. I have even heard that word used many many times in the workplace behind someones back.

jm08

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The complainant was also referring to her as 'slutty'. It is a word which I really think has lost a lot of it's venom as an insult. It is used a lot more commonly about a lot more behaviour than of old.

I thought Jackson was angry rather than aggressive after the trial myself and I could fully empathise with that even before I heard that the PSNI recommended no charges should be brought.

The dictionary defines Slut as 'a woman who has many casual sexual partners'. I doubt if the WhatsApp group referring to the girls being messy or untidy.

Its not relevant in this instance what the complainant thought of the three girls behaviour. What is relevant is that the WhatApp group sent around a photo of Dara and her two friends referring to them as Belfast sluts.Bearing in mind that Dara turned them all down, why are they calling her a slut when it is plainly obvious on that occasion she was anything but slutty. They could have shown a bit more respect.

I'd like to hear why the PSNI didn't recommend a prosecution. It could have been just on a technicality/difficulty proving rape. Perhaps we will find out more if the rest of the material is released this week.

FrancieBrady

jm08 wrote: »

The dictionary defines Slut as 'a woman who has many casual sexual partners'. I doubt if the WhatsApp group referring to the girls being messy or untidy.

Its not relevant in this instance what the complainant thought of the three girls behaviour. What is relevant is that the WhatApp group sent around a photo of Dara and her two friends referring to them as Belfast sluts.Bearing in mind that Dara turned them all down, why are they calling her a slut when it is plainly obvious on that occasion she was anything but slutty. They could have shown a bit more respect.

I'd like to hear why the PSNI didn't recommend a prosecution. It could have been just on a technicality/difficulty proving rape. Perhaps we will find out more if the rest of the material is released this week.

The word is commonly used. It isn't unusual in the slightest and as the lads had every intention of enjoying what the girls had to offer,(if they offered it) I even doubt it was meant in a disparaging way.
Young men looking for a sexual encounter are looking for like minded women.

facehugger99

mfceiling wrote: »

My daughters have muslim friends, friends with divorced parents, friends with a gay father or lesbian mother.....

My daughter graduated from astronaut school and she's only 7.

RuMan

facehugger99 wrote: »

My daughter graduated from astronaut school and she's only 7.

Do u think will Jacko be allowed continue his charitable work when he returns to the Ulster and Irish rugby football teams?
Surely we shouldnt punish the users of these terrific organisations.

Buford T. Justice XIX

RuMan wrote: »

So will Joe go with 2 or 3 OH's for the rugby football WC? Thinking he'll go with Sexton and Jacko as specialists and take Carbery as a utility back

Mod note: Take those to the rugby forum, please!

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=388

Thanks in advance,

Buford T. Justice

RuMan

jackboy wrote: »

99% of men and women have described someone as a slut at done stage. That word is just thrown around a lot. Reminds me of when I was skiing in France and a couple of the instructors informed me that Irish girls are known as the sluts of Europe. This shocked me mostly because a lot of Irish guys were describing French girls as the sluts of Europe.

It is a nasty word to use but it's generally just bull**** talk with nothing real to back it up. I have even heard that word used many many times in the workplace behind someones back.

Have heard English myself.
Stereotyping here but traditionally catholic countries have a reputation for being more modest.

FrancieBrady

RuMan wrote: »

Have heard English myself.
Stereotyping here but traditionally catholic countries have a reputation for being more modest.

And like to control what people do in their bedrooms.

To a large degree I think this is were the outrage is coming from.
Which outrage will now die away now and leave only the small mob of feminazis and Ibelieveher's.

RuMan

mfceiling wrote: »

If anything women are getting treated better nowadays.
There's real conversation about the gender pay gap. More women are getting to the top of their game. Better support networks for new mothers.

I don't agree that the older generation had more respect for women. How many women were beaten by violent husbands and had nobody to call or seek advice from? Nowadays women are encouraged to speak out against this.

The youth today are taught to respect everyone...you can be gay, bi, trans, gender neutral/fluid and there is no judgement. My daughters have muslim friends, friends with divorced parents, friends with a gay father or lesbian mother....this would have been almost unheard of a generation ago.

A gay father?
Was he not gay previously or has he adopted the child?
Maybe he got drunk one night