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Belfast rape trial - all 4 found not guilty Mod Note post one

Sam Quentin

Strange.. I'm kinda relieved it's all over.

http://www.thejournal.ie/belfast-rape-trial-verdict-3928309-Mar2018/

Mod Note Keep this relevant to this thread and don't bring up others. ie the eighth amendment thread.

MOD NOTE By the way don't post anything from members on the jury that's appearing online.

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Comments

hill16bhoy

Mokuba wrote: »

And the people who think that are stupid.

The case was likely only brought to court BECAUSE of their status. No chance they were ever going to be convicted based on the prosecutions evidence and testimonies.

So, it's a disgrace that Aodhan O'Riordain may have implied that the defendants' status played a part in them being deemed not guilty.

But it's fine to say that they were only charged because of their status?

What happened to the narrative about respecting the integrity of the judicial process?

Oh, the irony.

Heres Johnny

I'll state my viewpoint here.
I'm a recently retired rugby player. Played all my life. Im now quite well off (but by no means wealthy or privileged) male and im white.

Had **** loads of one night stands and messy situations through being drunk, both me and the female. Regretted a fair few and I'm sure many of the women did too. Woke up some mornings didn't know where I was or who was snoring beside me. I'm sure the feeling was reciprocated too. Had a few give out to me for never contacting them again and call me a dick but that's about it.

The thoughts that one of them could then make an allegation against me saying they didn't consent quite frankly scares the ****e out of me. Don't think there was ever any verbal consent either made by me or to me. But we just got one with things. Took 2 to tango.

I don't hate women in any way. Some of my great workmates are women.
I now coach a women's rugby team. When I was self employed in financial services my best custom came from Women, they really had their heads screwed on with financial planning. So I'm fond of the fairer sex in many many ways. I enjoy their company and I enjoy their point of view. I am in no way misogynist.
But some are just absolute nuts. I've seen some cause serious trouble for men with allegations and lies before.

I can't stand women using their perceived vulnerability because of being physically weaker and defenceless against men to go on these crusades. And I really can't stand women who hate men as a gender and constantly bang their drum and rattle out the same boring tune. Hate individual men that have wronged you by all means but go away with the stereotyping. They are evil, vindictive and dangerous. There's a movement going on and its not good. It's a mob. It's a witch hunt and men are in the firing line.

Rape is wrong, one of the vileist most despicable things a man could do to a woman but in my opinion this woman was no more raped than I was when going home drunk with a woman.

#metoo
#ibelieveher

And such other rubbish.

New hashtag

#ihatewomenwhohatemen

RuMan

Heres Johnny wrote: »

I'll state my viewpoint here.
I'm a recently retired rugby player. Played all my life. Im now quite well off (but by no means wealthy or privileged) male and im white.

Had **** loads of one night stands and messy situations through being drunk, both me and the female. Regretted a fair few and I'm sure many of the women did too. Woke up some mornings didn't know where I was or who was snoring beside me. I'm sure the feeling was reciprocated too. Had a few give out to me for never contacting them again and call me a dick but that's about it.

The thoughts that one of them could then make an allegation against me saying they didn't consent quite frankly scares the ****e out of me. Don't think there was ever any verbal consent either made by me or to me. But we just got one with things. Took 2 to tango.

I don't hate women in any way. Some of my great workmates are women.
I now coach a women's rugby team. When I was self employed in financial services my best custom came from Women, they really had their heads screwed on with financial planning. So I'm fond of the fairer sex in many many ways. I enjoy their company and I enjoy their point of view. I am in no way misogynist.
But some are just absolute nuts. I've seen some cause serious trouble for men with allegations and lies before.

I can't stand women using their perceived vulnerability because of being physically weaker and defenceless against men to go on these crusades. And I really can't stand women who hate men as a gender and constantly bang their drum and rattle out the same boring tune. Hate individual men that have wronged you by all means but go away with the stereotyping. They are evil, vindictive and dangerous. There's a movement going on and its not good. It's a mob. It's a witch hunt and men are in the firing line.

Rape is wrong, one of the vileist most despicable things a man could do to a woman but in my opinion this woman was no more raped than I was when going home drunk with a woman.

#metoo
#ibelieveher

And such other rubbish.

New hashtag

#ihatewomenwhohatemen

Great post

jmayo

Mrs Shuttleworth wrote: »

Then he's saying what others are privately thinking.

Didn't you say you went to Trinity ?
Ever hear of the concepts of slander and libel ?

Andrew Beef

The jury took less than three hours to acquit the guys; they are innocent. This “I believe her” sh1te is nothing more than a witchhunt. If there’s gonna be a witchhunt, it should be after the girl. The lives of these men have been ruined by false allegations.

Strazdas

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Should he not be allowed to defend his name and reputation?

He’s innocent - he should not have to stay silent and let people defame him.

The trial has only just ended and he was found not guilty. I'm not sure how good an idea it is to immediately commence legal action against someone else to prove that he is not guilty. Many would say he would be better off keeping his head down.

Stheno

Heres Johnny wrote: »

I'll state my viewpoint here.
I'm a recently retired rugby player. Played all my life. Im now quite well off (but by no means wealthy or privileged) male and im white.

Had **** loads of one night stands and messy situations through being drunk, both me and the female. Regretted a fair few and I'm sure many of the women did too. Woke up some mornings didn't know where I was or who was snoring beside me. I'm sure the feeling was reciprocated too. Had a few give out to me for never contacting them again and call me a dick

Jamie?????

Is that you? And does Sheena know of your bad boy days?

AudreyHepburn

Strazdas wrote: »

The trial has only just ended and he was found not guilty. I'm not sure how good an idea it is to immediately commence legal action against someone else to prove that he is not guilty. Many would say he would be better off keeping his head down.

But why shouldn’t he? I’ve yet to see a convincing explanation.

GreeBo

Mrs Shuttleworth wrote: »

And what's wrong with that? The jury didn't find enough to evidence to secure a conviction. Doesn't mean he has to agree.

I think the defendants in this case are ugly, brutish and boring. Is that "defamatory", or as the British are so fond of prosecuting, "hate speech"?

No, because that's not defamatory, implying someone is a rapist in public is. Simples.

Maybe you should research the meaning of the term before arguing about it?

Sidebaro wrote: »

I'm assuming it was his fame, social status and upbringing.

Sorry I'm confused. So he is privileged because he became a successful, famous sportsman?

I think people are losing the run of what privilege actually means. It's not a silver bullet point you can use when you can't actually build a supporting argument for yourself.

citytillidie

over 90 pages of going around in circles.

The woman made a complaint to the police, passed on to the PPS, went to court.

I jury of peers sat and listened to the evidence presented for 9 weeks, more than what we the general public know and found there was not enough evidence to find the 4 men guilty.

Protests are just a carry on from the #MeToo and #TimesUp since they really did not hit Ireland. It is one way to alienate half the population by telling them they are all rapists

Uncharted

Stheno wrote: »

Jamie?????

Is that you? And does Sheena know of your bad boy days?

Couldn't be him.... he only invests in 'bright ideas'.

He said so himself on the radio

Heres Johnny

Stheno wrote: »

Heres Johnny wrote: »

I'll state my viewpoint here.
I'm a recently retired rugby player. Played all my life. Im now quite well off (but by no means wealthy or privileged) male and im white.

Had **** loads of one night stands and messy situations through being drunk, both me and the female. Regretted a fair few and I'm sure many of the women did too. Woke up some mornings didn't know where I was or who was snoring beside me. I'm sure the feeling was reciprocated too. Had a few give out to me for never contacting them again and call me a dick

Jamie?????

Is that you? And does Sheena know of your bad boy days?

Busted!! But no thats not me

Fann Linn

Strazdas wrote: »

The trial has only just ended and he was found not guilty. I'm not sure how good an idea it is to immediately commence legal action against someone else to prove that he is not guilty. Many would say he would be better off keeping his head down.

He was found 'not guilty' why should he hide?

dark crystal

Andrew Beef wrote: »

The jury took less than three hours to acquit the guys; they are innocent. This “I believe her” sh1te is nothing more than a witchhunt. If there’s gonna be a witchhunt, it should be after the girl. The lives of these men have been ruined by false allegations.

When was she found guilty of providing false allegations?

GreeBo

hill16bhoy wrote: »

You don't have to have been on trial to be defamed.

The jury did not find that the allegations were false.

Therefore anybody who knowingly publishes a statement that complainant made knowingly false allegations is making a knowingly false statement in order to damage her reputation.

They didn't find anything about her allegations other than they couldn't be proven. It's not knowingingly false to accuse hey of lying, there has been no trial to ascertain that.

Strazdas

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

But why shouldn’t he? I’ve yet to see a convincing explanation.

He might be not guilty of rape but he doesn't exactly come out of this case looking like a hero - those disgusting WhatsApp messages, the fact that that night and the trial was undoubtedly traumatic for the young woman etc.

Suing someone for libel is entirely optional, there is no requirement for him to do this and he could leave it be if he wanted.

Uncharted

Heres Johnny wrote: »

Busted!! But no thats not me

John Fogarty.......?

Mokuba

Strazdas wrote: »

He might be not guilty of rape but he doesn't exactly come out of this case looking like a hero - those disgusting WhatsApp messages, the fact that that night and the trial was undoubtedly traumatic for the young woman etc.

Suing someone for libel is entirely optional, there is no requirement for him to do this and he could leave it be if he wanted.

The trial was traumatic for the young woman? Hello? What about the 4 lads? Who even as innocent men cannot move on with their lives.

And as for the WhatsApp. Paddy Jackson barely said a thing on it. Show me exactly what he said. There is one of the offensive quotes which can be attributed to him. Just one.

Laois_Man

Strazdas wrote: »

He might be not guilty of rape but he doesn't exactly come out of this case looking like a hero - those disgusting WhatsApp messages, the fact that that night and the trial was undoubtedly traumatic for the young woman etc.

Suing someone for libel is entirely optional, there is no requirement for him to do this and he could leave it be if he wanted.

A lawsuit against senator senator Aodhan O Riordain will never see a court room I reckon!

They just want to shut everyone up!

Mrs Shuttleworth

Heres Johnny wrote: »

I'll state my viewpoint here.
I'm a recently retired rugby player. Played all my life. Im now quite well off (but by no means wealthy or privileged) male and im white.

Had **** loads of one night stands and messy situations through being drunk, both me and the female. Regretted a fair few and I'm sure many of the women did too. Woke up some mornings didn't know where I was or who was snoring beside me. I'm sure the feeling was reciprocated too. Had a few give out to me for never contacting them again and call me a dick but that's about it.

The thoughts that one of them could then make an allegation against me saying they didn't consent quite frankly scares the ****e out of me. Don't think there was ever any verbal consent either made by me or to me. But we just got one with things. Took 2 to tango.

I don't hate women in any way. Some of my great workmates are women.
I now coach a women's rugby team. When I was self employed in financial services my best custom came from Women, they really had their heads screwed on with financial planning. So I'm fond of the fairer sex in many many ways. I enjoy their company and I enjoy their point of view. I am in no way misogynist.
But some are just absolute nuts. I've seen some cause serious trouble for men with allegations and lies before.

I can't stand women using their perceived vulnerability because of being physically weaker and defenceless against men to go on these crusades. And I really can't stand women who hate men as a gender and constantly bang their drum and rattle out the same boring tune. Hate individual men that have wronged you by all means but go away with the stereotyping. They are evil, vindictive and dangerous. There's a movement going on and its not good. It's a mob. It's a witch hunt and men are in the firing line.

Rape is wrong, one of the vileist most despicable things a man could do to a woman but in my opinion this woman was no more raped than I was when going home drunk with a woman.

#metoo
#ibelieveher

And such other rubbish.

New hashtag

#ihatewomenwhohatemen

I don't hate women.

Of course I don't.

I don't call them back on more than one occasion after banging them, though, and I don't think about consent.

I'm scared, now I think about it.

Actually, I do hate women.

[Deleted User]

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

He insinuated that they raped a woman and got away with it because they were well connected.

Not sure how more defamatory someone can be.

I saw his tweet and if I'm not mistaken, he didn't name anyone but did refer to them "collectively"- wondering if (a) that is really defamation on the basis of not naming someone and (b) could all the relevant parties also issue a lawsuit?

If I said all Boards.ie Mods are X (derogatory term), besides a permaban, does than mean all or any Boards.ie mods could take a case against me?

(I'm asking because I don't know- not arguing with you). :-)

Fann Linn

I'd say some of those NI soccer players who were in the same club on the same night probably feel they 'dodged a bullet'.

Sofiztikated

GreeBo wrote: »

Has your vagina ever cut someone's penis?
Are you sure? Have you had it checked by a professional?

No, but it's definitely possible that an awkward thrust with my wife can injure. And through thoroughly consentual sex.

Hoboo

Fann Linn wrote: »

I'd say some of those NI soccer players who were in the same club on the same night probably feel they 'dodged a bullet'.

Dodged a nuke morelike.

iamwhoiam

Im Randy Newman wrote: »

This whole thing about their 'offensive' msgs? Get over it, people say these things all time.

Maybe we should examine a few of the puritans on here, see how squeaky clean they really are.

People find different things offensive and are perfectly entitled to think the messages were disgusting . And perfectly entitled to say so without being knocked down with a " get over it "
I found the language in the messages disgusting , so does my husband , my son and my daughter . And so do my friends and my family . Maybe we just have different standards to you how we speak about others but such is life .

AudreyHepburn

Strazdas wrote: »

He might be not guilty of rape but he doesn't exactly come out of this case looking like a hero - those disgusting WhatsApp messages, the fact that that night and the trial was undoubtedly traumatic for the young woman etc.

Suing someone for libel is entirely optional, there is no requirement for him to do this and he could leave it be if he wanted.

You’re showing your true colors now.

He comes out of it looking innocent and that’s all the matters. The texts, while unsavory, are just texts sent after one drunken night. They do not speak to his character as a whole.

Have you never sent a regrettable text?

And I’m sure it was just as traumatic for the four men having their names dragged through the mud for something they didn’t do.

I’ll ask again - give me one rational reason, free of emotion and assumptions that he’s guilty, why he shouldn’t defend himself.

[Deleted User]

Think it's about time I unfollow this thread..

tritium

Phoebas wrote: »

Using the legal system to give a 'good slap' to people you don't like probably isn't a great idea.

And yet that’s essentially what the #ibelieveher crowd are complaining didn’t happen

Strazdas

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

You’re showing your true colors now.

He comes out of it looking innocent and that’s all the matters. The texts, while unsavory, are just texts sent after one drunken night. They do not speak to his character as a whole.

Have you never sent a regrettable text?

And I’m sure it was just as traumatic for the four men having their names dragged through the mud for something they didn’t do.

I’ll ask again - give me one rational reason, free of emotion and assumptions that he’s guilty, why he shouldn’t defend himself.

He has just been found not guilty after a nine week criminal trial, that clears his name right there.

Getting involved in a legal spat with a minor public representative over a tweet the latter sent and a huge amount of people probably never even saw might not be the wisest course of action.

Mokuba

Again really would love if someone could point out the WhatsApp messages that were sent by Paddy Jackson himself.

Because a lot is being attributed to him that he did not write.

11.17am Jackson: “There was a lot of spit roast last night.”

That is the only thing Jackson has said, in response to a question about spit roast.