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Child Item

Belfast rape trial - all 4 found not guilty Mod Note post one

Sam Quentin

Strange.. I'm kinda relieved it's all over.

http://www.thejournal.ie/belfast-rape-trial-verdict-3928309-Mar2018/

Mod Note Keep this relevant to this thread and don't bring up others. ie the eighth amendment thread.

MOD NOTE By the way don't post anything from members on the jury that's appearing online.

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Heres Johnny

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Shefwedfan wrote: »

topper75 wrote: »

Innocent of that charge yes. She pressed the panic button on fear of being discussed as a slut.

But who can welcome them back onto a field after those messages.

Just imagine it was your daughter they were referring to.

Are you serious?

Every lads group on Watsapp has the exact same BS in it....

Speak for yourself and your own mates buddy

I'm in about 5 groups. My rugby mates group, gaa mates group, work group, school mates and they're all the same. I'm also in one for a women's sports team I coach and I had to leave, that was just as bad.
WhatsApp boasting is no crime.

VinLieger

copeyhagen wrote: »

her names out on watsap already, that was quick.

This is going to get ugly real quick, I feel sorry for her for the deluge of **** she will undoubtedly be hit with, neither "side" of this will look good from the mess thats gonna happen in the coming days.

eviltwin

david75 wrote: »

Apparently the judge in the case has previous and oversaw a trial where a guy raped a 12 year old got her pregnant and somehow walked out free from the court.
He pretty much instructed this jury to find these lads innocent.

Personally I believe her.

I thought the judge was a woman

[Deleted User]

Berserker wrote: »

Wrong choice of phrase. They were acquitted of all charges.

Are you not innocent until proven guilty? The lads were not found guilty. Does that by proxy not make them innocent?

copeyhagen

david75 wrote: »

Apparently the judge in the case has previous and oversaw a trial where a guy raped a 12 year old got her pregnant and somehow walked out free from the court.
He pretty much instructed this jury to find these lads innocent.

Personally I believe her.

bull****. I have listened to the court updates every day and the judges recommendations for the past 3 days have been spot on for both sides.

sure the judge is a fookin woman also

PhlegmyMoses

seamus wrote: »

Wow, that was a quick turnaround for such an incredibly long case.

Justice is justice, if the jury who sat there and heard all of the evidence weren't convinced it was rape, then it probably wasn't.

There of course are people who had already decided the outcome of this case who won't be happy, but sure isn't there always.

One genuine issue which did come up in the conduct of the case was the disparity in the cross examination of the woman versus the men. She was basically grilled for the guts of a week on a short history of her adult life, whereas the defendants only questioned for half the time on their conduct on the night in question.

Whether this is something that can be rectified I don't know, but it certainly creates a huge barrier for anyone wanting to make a complaint of rape. You have to be prepared to open your entire life up to public scrutiny and prove that you're lily white, whereas the person you accuse just has to account for their behaviour that day/night.

The reason why there was a disparity is because her she was all of their evidence. Her story was it. Their texts were an irrelevance. The prosecution wouldn't have put her through that if they could have avoided it, but there was no other evidence, The defence had an eye witness that was a huge factor, so they don't need the men up there giving the prosecution a chance to tie them in knots.

just the nature of this particular case.

C__MC

Strong Strong words by Jackson's solicitor.

Blaming the PSNI for bringing the case forward on behalf of Jackson being a sportstar.

py2006

Mebuntu wrote: »

The woman (women) made their own decision to go back to the house willingly - for tea and biscuits? - I think not. Well done, the Jury.

Careful now Mr Hook!

VinLieger

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Astounded someone who should know better has said that. He can kiss goodbye to being elected again. Astonishing.

I look forward to greeting the next Labour candidate calling to my door with a screenshot of this

captbarnacles

retro:electro wrote: »

This kind of attitude is dangerous. This has nothing to do with “smug middle class” jersey boys “winning” over a woman. Justice is blind. It cares not for who you are or where you’re from. I’m astoudned at the amount of **** like this I’m reading lately. The social standing standing of those involved should be left at the door. All that matters is what happened that night between those involved. Shame on this fool

I'm not sure this has ever been true anywhere but if you mean should be, I agree.

howiya

david75 wrote: »

Apparently the judge in the case has previous and oversaw a trial where a guy raped a 12 year old got her pregnant and somehow walked out free from the court.
He pretty much instructed this jury to find these lads innocent.

Personally I believe her.

The judge was a woman not a he

wotswattage

I agree with the verdict in the trial, but I absolutely don't support the defendants behaviour. This concept seems to be lost on many of the #ibelieveher ers.

Also the attitude/behaviour in the WhatsApp group afterwards is commonplace amongst many many young Irish men, especially in any team sports.

Mr.H

erica74 wrote: »

Are you fucking serious?
You can't be serious - being falsely accused of rape is worse than rape? Do you mean, being falsely accused of rape is worse than being raped?

yes

Being labeled a rapist wrongly where it will follow you around for the rest of your life and everyone will call you a rapist and avoid you because your a rapist. When you are not one.

That is worse than being raped yes.

Being raped is a crime that while you may get some sort of (very minimal IMO) justice. Being falsely accused of rape brings no such justice.

The lads even she lied, cant look for justice because people will always say "there wasnt enough evidence to bring a prosecution".

C__MC

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

The reason why there was a disparity is because her she was all of their evidence. Her story was it. Their texts were an irrelevance. The prosecution wouldn't have put her through that if they could have avoided it, but there was no other evidence, The defence had an eye witness that was a huge factor, so they don't need the men up there giving the prosecution a chance to tie them in knots.

just the nature of this particular case.

The defense never used dara florence as a witness

py2006

C__MC wrote: »

Strong Strong words by Jackson's solicitor.

Blaming the PSNI for bringing the case forward on behalf of Jackson being a sportstar.

What did he say?

.......

This post has been deleted.

[Deleted User]

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Why? they are innocent.....

How would anyone think they would be able to punish someone for been innocent?

If guilty then yes they certainly would never be seen near a rugby shirt again and that would be 100% correct

Personally I would draw a distinction between “not guilty” and “innocent”

Gravelly

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Astounded someone who should know better has said that. He can kiss goodbye to being elected again. Astonishing.

Anyone who was stupid enough to vote for him in the past is unlikely to be put off by this little blip. Nobody who cares about anything other than virtue signalling would vote for him, so they'll probably see this as another reason to.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

Mebuntu wrote: »

The woman (women) made their own decision to go back to the house willingly - for tea and biscuits? - I think not. Well done, the Jury.

Dafuq?! posts like this will give me a heart attack one of these days

Supernintento Chalmers

david75 wrote: »

Apparently the judge in the case has previous and oversaw a trial where a guy raped a 12 year old got her pregnant and somehow walked out free from the court.
He pretty much instructed this jury to find these lads innocent.

Personally I believe her.

She instructed.

ebbsy

Whoever brought that case to court needs to answer questions as well.

Was never going to be a conviction.

Mr.H

eviltwin wrote: »

I understand what you mean. I'd rather it was two different interpretations than someone deliberately setting out to destroy the lives of four innocent men. But if she does believe she was raped she's going to feel awful and the inevitable backlash she will now face will be awful. Of course if she lied she deserves it.

Well the only benefit is anonymity. Hopefully her face wont be plastered over every single newspaper in the western world the way the lads where. Hopefully people will move on and let her get help if it is needed. Whether or not she lied or genuinely thought she was telling the truth.

But the lads have headlines from all over the world with the words rapist over their pictures

smodgley

IRFU Statement from indo

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/irfu-release-statement-following-rugby-rape-trial-not-guilty-verdicts-36752705.html

baylah17

david75 wrote: »

Apparently the judge in the case has previous and oversaw a trial where a guy raped a 12 year old got her pregnant and somehow walked out free from the court.
He pretty much instructed this jury to find these lads innocent.

Personally I believe her.

Bullsh it
The judge was a woman by the way

C__MC

Raul Mysterious Revenge wrote: »

Dafuq?! posts like this will give me a heart attack one of these days

The woman also knew nobody at that house party-

_Dara_

Kyta wrote: »

Can the lads take civil proceedings against her now for defamation of character? Their careers and lives are potentially ruined now.

This would be a dangerous road to go down. She might genuinely have believed she was raped. And sometimes a rape does occur but can’t be proven. (I’m not saying that’s the case here)

Isshelying

Aegir wrote: »

Personally I would draw a distinction between “not guilty” and “innocent”

So the verdict didnt go the way you wanted to you still need to imply those men are rapists and she is just an innocent victim.

If they had been found guilty would you be as quick to say that it didnt mean they actually did it?

Jimbob1977

In theory, they have been acquitted and should be eligible to resume their Ulster and Ireland careers immediately.

In practice, it will take some time to reintroduce them to rugby.

Mr.H

Sidebaro wrote: »

Can you think of any lasting effect of being raped?

Of course. Listen I am not downplaying being raped ffs.

I am saying that counselling and time can get you to live with being raped.

No amount of time or counselling can erase such an accusation

jay1988

facehugger99 wrote: »

Not enough evidence to find them guilty, but I suspect what went on that night was far beyond the bounds of chivalrous behavior. These lads reputations have been rightly ruined and careers ended I suspect.

Given the victim was a young woman, I suspect the internet's finest will form a Twitter hate mob.

God help her.

God help her?? She's just dragged four young men through court on a false rape charge! God love them more like, with the possibility of having their lives and careers being ruined.

And another thing, she wasn't "the victim" as no crime was committed.