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My unemployed story

Ajsoprano

I see a lot of dole bashing and if I get let go Id work in McDonald’s type posts. A lot of “they are always in the bookies” threads. So this is how the government of today has sorted out the “dole scrounger”.

I was a plumber in my early 30s making more money than doctors and accountants. All the overtime I wanted. Then things got bad and I was getting a few weeks on a few weeks off a few weeks up north then pretty much nothing.
Employers started only offering into the hand work where you had to get social welfare to make up your wage. I refused to avail of this.
I remember them changing how long your stamps lasted you until they started to harass you.
One day I was called to a meeting with a woman in the welfare office I brought my son in a buggy I thought it was just to drop in forms and the like. She moaned at me for bringing children to a meeting them tore shreds off me when I tried explain work was tight. She sent me to a private company under the jobbridge umbrella because I wasn’t getting the finger out.
First I had to do a course called steps which was a psychology type motivation course which I enjoyed and gave me a bit of confidence back.

I applied for all sorts of jobs but was told I was over qualified or I’d be back plumbing as soon as they trained me.
I went to intreo (New fas) and asked about the gas course for working on boilers. I was told I was the private companies now and intreo couldn’t deal with me.
The private company found me a placement in a car park in Dublin with an Astro and a dancing class beside a really rough flat complex. All these parents used the dancing school. There was no markings in the car park , my job was to be a yellow line. When a car parked where there was an imaginary yellow line on that day I had to tell them to move. I got non stop abuse nearly every day for a year. I also had to turn on and off the lights for the Astro in winter. I’m not one that worries too much about my mental health but looking back now I dreaded going to it and struggled sleeping on work nights. I asked for a safe pass and was told they were sorting one.
I complained about it and was told they have another opening for me in an even worse part of Dublin cleaning a green space and putting out chairs for meetings in a community centre. As far as I remember there was 3 months left on my placement and they wanted me to start this new one all over again so I stuck out the car park.
As soon as the car park job finished I emailed about the safe pass but they didn’t reply anymore.
I got s letter a week later to go to skillsteam another jobbridge type private company.
I had two meetings with them where they told me they’d only pay for my safe pass if I had a letter saying I had a job if I have a safe pass. The gas course was laughed out the door again. In meetings they kept pushing that they had retail jobs but I think this was a threat I don’t think they really had them.
Building of hotels picked up and I got a job. I got my own safe pass that Saturday and started on the Monday. I got a number of phone calls from skillsteam trying to find out my new job details so they could claim a few quid of taxpayers money for getting me off the register I never gave them to them but I’m sure they have ways around that.

I’m back working and paying between 1-200 euro a week tax no thanks to these kick the unemployed schemes.

There are people in my area that have never worked a day in their life that these schemes don’t bother. Who they will bother is you if you lose your job or your kids if they come out of school jobless.

Private companies shouldn’t be anywhere near the social welfare system and it sickens me that my tax goes to private companies to kick jobless people when they are down, humiliate them by standing them in a car park in front of friends and neighbours and parents from my kids activities.

Most people end up out of work at some stage in their life.

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Ajsoprano

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

This is getting farcical.
We are privatising the social welfare in order to teach young adults time keeping skills.

After 15 or so years of school they need to do a years work cleaning toilets because they haven’t got time keeping skills and the government should pick up the tab not the company benefitting.

Surely we should be privatizing the schools if this was the case. It’s probably the next plan from Leo,

You say people were losing their jobs and yet the government was subsiding free labour. Of course people were losing their jobs the government was subsidizing free labour.

I get that you are so far to the right you probably don’t even have a left but come on take a deep breath and think about it.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

mvt

You do know we just went through a huge bust right.

Desperate times require desperate measures...like job bridge.

It worked for some & also was abused by others.

You as an apprentice would have worked at a reduced rate right?

Work in construction for a lot longer than you & went through a few hairy years as well. Also didnt want to leave since Id already spent a lot of years abroad.

Had to go through some of the process you did but not those private companies which can't have been nice

However we are both back working & contributing to society until the next bust which will happen in construction so there might still be time to see the world

Maybe try & save & do that gas burner course yourself.I know that can't be easy with kids & i presume a mortgage which must have been hard to pay whilst un/underemplyed.

Really,what I'm long-windedly trying to say is that there is only so much any government can do for us.

Best of luck

Ajsoprano

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

The internship scheme didn’t cause the meltdown. It did contribute to job losses and increased spending.
These schemes are still getting set up now. Piddling away money to private companies for nothing in return.

[Deleted User]

Ajsoprano who do you think the social contract between the individual and the state is or should be.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

[Deleted User]

Ajsoprano wrote: »

The internship scheme didn’t cause the meltdown. It did contribute to job losses and increased spending.
These schemes are still getting set up now. Piddling away money to private companies for nothing in return.

You really have it in for private companies. Maybe we should get rid of them all. Put EVERYTHING into public ownership? That’d solve all our problems. No entrepreneurs. After all, we don’t need their ideas, money or businesses.

mvt

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Yes, because that's exactly the same thing as the government throwing money at an ineffective business :rolleyes:

In all fairness any business that gets the government to pay for an employee for nine momths could hardly be called ineffective :pac:

more seriously on the list of companies that the government throw money at I think the likes of DB & BE & IR might spring to mind

[Deleted User]

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

I don't think anyone is claiming that JobBridge caused our financial crash, given their respective timings. But there is a real question about why scarce Government money was spent on subsidising resources for private businesses over that period.

http://www.youth.ie/sites/youth.ie/files/NYCI-JobBridge-Summary-na.pdf

This report shows more than 35k people went through the scheme, with 2/3rds of them being over 25, so I'm not sure why we would be subsidising businesses to 'train' 30-somethings and 40-somethings how to get to work on time. Let's not pretend that it was limited to 'apprenticeship' type situations. The Dept Justice (yes, a Government department) took qualified solicitors on the JobBridge scheme. This is just exploitation of job seekers in a desperate economic bind.

Minimum wage is fairly minimal, so where an employer has a job, let them at least pay minimum wage, and give the employee the respect and decency of a real job.

Honestly, a multi-million euro Government spend needs more than a 'probably' to justify this kind of spend. Isn't it funny how those who are normally first to decry 'Government interference' in the market are ready to snap the hand off Government where there is a little subsidy on the table?

RDM_83 again

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I don't think anyone is claiming that JobBridge caused our financial crash, given their respective timings. But there is a real question about why scarce Government money was spent on subsidising resources for private businesses over that period.

http://www.youth.ie/sites/youth.ie/files/NYCI-JobBridge-Summary-na.pdf

This report shows more than 35k people went through the scheme, with 2/3rds of them being over 25, so I'm not sure why we would be subsidising businesses to 'train' 30-somethings and 40-somethings how to get to work on time. Let's not pretend that it was limited to 'apprenticeship' type situations. The Dept Justice (yes, a Government department) took qualified solicitors on the JobBridge scheme. This is just exploitation of job seekers in a desperate economic bind.

Minimum wage is fairly minimal, so where an employer has a job, let them at least pay minimum wage, and give the employee the respect and decency of a real job.

Honestly, a multi-million euro Government spend needs more than a 'probably' to justify this kind of spend. Isn't it funny how those who are normally first to decry 'Government interference' in the market are ready to snap the hand off Government where there is a little subsidy on the table?

This!
Also permabear doesn't things like jobsbridge go completely against you personal beliefs in terms of the role of government and the free market.
Considering your normal views which I don't agree with but respect I genuinely can't get how you support the jobsbridge scheme while holding broadly libertarian views.

[Deleted User]

Sending a qualified plumber to a jobridge in a carpark was a waste of everyone time. It should have been confined to those who never had paid employment or who had a degree and could not accesses paid employment and it should have been directed at young people, its main aim was to stop individuals falling into long-term unemployment something which is very difficult to get out of. It was not a terrible idea but it needed to have a narrow focus.

The is no jobridge now.

Ajsoprano

mariaalice wrote: »

Sending a qualified plumber to a jobridge in a carpark was a waste of everyone time. It should have been confined to those who never had paid employment or who had a degree and could not accesses paid employment and it should have been directed at young people, its main aim was to stop individuals falling into long-term unemployment something which is very difficult to get out of. It was not a terrible idea but it needed to have a narrow focus.

The is no jobridge now.

There is no job ridge now but there are lots of other private companies doing the same sort of stuff.
There was an idea that people on the dole should work in the community. Charity work and the likes but it wasn’t any way managed. It’s like community service turn up sign in get paid. This is how I ended up in a car park. The scheme had no other purpose than to punish me for being out of work.

Avatar MIA

Ajsoprano wrote: »

The scheme had no other purpose than to punish me for being out of work.

I just realised that this is all very simple. It comes down to whether you're a half glass full or Half empty kind of person.

BTW, why didn't you paint yellow lines in the car park - How long were you there?

[Deleted User]

mariaalice wrote: »

Sending a qualified plumber to a jobridge in a carpark was a waste of everyone time. It should have been confined to those who never had paid employment or who had a degree and could not accesses paid employment and it should have been directed at young people, its main aim was to stop individuals falling into long-term unemployment something which is very difficult to get out of. It was not a terrible idea but it needed to have a narrow focus.

The is no jobridge now.

One wasn’t forced on to a JobBridge placement. One had to apply for the position.
However, like CE Schemes, one had to look for one that might be of benefit. ie training or experience to be gained. Going in with an open mind was a huge plus. Feeling one was too good for the positions was a barrier to learning from the experience, leading to disillusionment and bitterness. After all, what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger.

JupiterKid

Good post OP. Not everyone out of work is a "welfare sponger" or "dole scrounger" or wherever pejorative term those on here are all too quick to come out with.

I was out of full time work for a good few years due to a personal crisis which triggered bad mental health and addiction issues and although I did have the support of my family and got back on my feet, I was very grateful to have welfare (disability allowance & medical card) supports available.

They say the true measure of a given society is how it treats its most vulnerable.

Avatar MIA

JupiterKid wrote: »

Not everyone out of work is a "welfare sponger" or "dole scrounger" or wherever pejorative term those on here are all too quick to come out with.

I don't think anyone on this thread or even on boards.ie has ever said otherwise. We have good welfare in this country. Probably not the very best in the world (until we find oil or such), but up there.

splinter65

JupiterKid wrote: »

Good post OP. Not everyone out of work is a "welfare sponger" or "dole scrounger" or wherever pejorative term those on here are all too quick to come out with.

I was out of full time work for a good few years due to a personal crisis which triggered bad mental health and addiction issues and although I did have the support of my family and got back on my feet, I was very grateful to have welfare (disability allowance & medical card) supports available.

They say the true measure of a given society is how it treats its most vulnerable.

Being unfit for work due to poor health and getting, quite properly, DA is one thing but wanting to pick and choose which jobs you will and will not take when you’ve been on JSA for a while in a period of low unemployment is entirely different.
My 20 year old student daughter with no experience and only available at the weekend has her pick of waitressing jobs at minimum wage and more . What’s wrong with waitressing? If it’s minimum wage and you’ve got kids you can get FIS too.
There are a hardcore of JSA recipients who think that they are entitled to get it until the job they think is right for them comes along, and if that job never comes up well, so be it.
Socialism is a dangerous disease. It’s great until you run out of someone else’s money and then no one has anything.
If the OP can give me an example of a country where socialism has been successful then I will give way to him.

[Deleted User]

splinter65 wrote: »

Being unfit for work due to poor health and getting, quite properly, DA is one thing but wanting to pick and choose which jobs you will and will not take when you’ve been on JSA for a while in a period of low unemployment is entirely different.
My 20 year old student daughter with no experience and only available at the weekend has her pick of waitressing jobs at minimum wage and more . What’s wrong with waitressing? If it’s minimum wage and you’ve got kids you can get FIS too.
There are a hardcore of JSA recipients who think that they are entitled to get it until the job they think is right for them comes along, and if that job never comes up well, so be it.
Socialism is a dangerous disease. It’s great until you run out of someone else’s money and then no one has anything.
If the OP can give me an example of a country where socialism has been successful then I will give way to him.

While not agreeing with the OP I cant see what his post has to do with socilism.

Ajsoprano

mariaalice wrote: »

While not agreeing with the OP I cant see what his post has to do with socilism.

I think if you oppose these schemes you just don’t want to work, unless you work then you are a socialist.

splinter65

Ajsoprano wrote: »

I think if you oppose these schemes you just don’t want to work, unless you work then you are a socialist.

If you think, as you obviously do, that the wealth should be distributed evenly throughout the population and are and advocate of equality of outcome as opposed to equality of opportunity (which we already have) then you are an advocate of socialism.
You appear to resent the fact that some people who have jobs ( including and in fact particularly those employed by the state) get paid more then you, or more then those who don’t have jobs at all.
Correct me there if I’m wrong?

Ajsoprano

splinter65 wrote: »

If you think, as you obviously do, that the wealth should be distributed evenly throughout the population and are and advocate of equality of outcome as opposed to equality of opportunity (which we already have) then you are an advocate of socialism.
You appear to resent the fact that some people who have jobs ( including and in fact particularly those employed by the state) get paid more then you, or more then those who don’t have jobs at all.
Correct me there if I’m wrong?

I do ok. My house is paid for. I’m on a decent wage. I can afford a couple of holidays a year. I’m not some student languishing in a hovel reading Karl Marx and complaining about Donald trump.

The only way socialism could work is if it was honest and if the whole world was one country.

We could have a compromise where the sick and needy were helped rather than kicked though.

I’d like good training courses for the unemployed in jobs where we have shortages of skills.

What I don’t like is a private company getting paid a fortune from the state for offering nothing but box ticking and course refusal meetings.

[Deleted User]

Ajsoprano wrote: »

What I don’t like is a private company getting paid a fortune from the state for offering nothing but box ticking and course refusal meetings.

You keep on about this. Are you saying that they don’t get people back to work? That not one single person has left the live register thanks to them? (Reports claim 18% found jobs through them)

Ajsoprano

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You keep on about this. Are you saying that they don’t get people back to work? That not one single person has left the live register thanks to them? (Reports claim 18% found jobs through them)

Nope. 18 per cent found a job. The fact they were going to meeting once every two weeks or standing in a car park had nothing to do with it.

We had full employment before the crash. Everybody didn’t just decide not working was handy. All these people are going back to work now.

I honestly can’t stress enough how little these companies do.

Ajsoprano

Looks like somebody called gladcon who has zero posts went through the thread and thanked everything pro jobbridge.

Don’t be shy gladcon.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

[Deleted User]

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

We already have a department that are supposed to be doing this anyway. Why waste money paying for the same service twice?

True. But they weren’t doing a great job. 18% is a decent start.

Avatar MIA

Deleted User wrote: »

True. But they weren’t doing a great job. 18% is a decent start.

18% is a whole lot better than zero. And who knows how many will later get jobs because of their increased experience. Glass half full OP.

Avatar MIA

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Of course it's better than zero but zero is a pointless comparison unless you're assuming zero people unemployed and not on jobpath found work over the same period. Which of course is a ridiciulous assumption.

To be on jobpath you need to be unemployed for 12 months, so they already had 12 months on their tod to get work. 18% is a very good return on that basis.

Avatar MIA

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

I finished work in September and got put on jobpath in October. Prior to that I had been working for over a year up until the previous December so that's just not true.

Okay, mainly those for over 12 months unemployed. It's likely as more and more people became employed they reduced the eligibility.

https://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/JobPath.aspx

Naos

punisher5112 wrote: »

I'm a little lost here... Are you qualified in plumbing¿

They are crying out for plumbers and it could net you a nice sum out on your own also.

Would you not go back at it???

Did you and the other four who thanked you (anewme, Fr_Dougal, LaChatteGitane, musiknonstop) read his full post?