WhiteRoses wrote: » Andrew Beef wrote: » A 10 week old unborn child is not a “zygote”. If someone came to me for advice around a crisis pregnancy I would help them emotionally and financially, and I would urge them not to have an abortion. The paedophilia point is an analogy; things that are illegal for Irish people to do overseas basically. You still didn’t answer my question. Third time asking now. I’ll use your terminology, why is a 10 week old unborn child equal to me?
Andrew Beef wrote: » A 10 week old unborn child is not a “zygote”. If someone came to me for advice around a crisis pregnancy I would help them emotionally and financially, and I would urge them not to have an abortion. The paedophilia point is an analogy; things that are illegal for Irish people to do overseas basically.
mrkiscool2 wrote: » There are absolutely no links in that article. So, a claim made without evidence can then be dismissed without evidence. This claim is dismissed.
eviltwin wrote: » Andrew Beef wrote: » A 10 week old unborn child is not a “zygote”. If someone came to me for advice around a crisis pregnancy I would help them emotionally and financially, and I would urge them not to have an abortion. The paedophilia point is an analogy; things that are illegal for Irish people to do overseas basically. Well let me ask you something Andrew If a woman you loved, sister, daughter, friend, had an abortion, would you really be okay having her criminalised for that?
Andrew Beef wrote: » Yes, because the murder of an unborn child should be a crime, except in very limited circumstances. People who travel abroad to have abortions and people who purchase and use abortion pills should be arrested and charged with an offence.
Andrew Beef wrote: » Because all human life is equal; and you certainly aren’t entitled to end an unborn child’s life just because its birth wouldn’t suit you.
Bannasidhe wrote: » Pregnancy tests for all women before they can leave the country and again on their return. If a woman claims she has a miscarriage than a panel of experts will decide if she is lying. All mail addressed to woman must be opened in case there are abortion pills. All life being equal it's only right that women's movements are curtailed in case they commit murder of an insentient being.
blanch152 wrote: » Not all human life is equal. Why are soldiers expendable? Why aren't some very expensive medicines available on the medical card? Why can people be executed in the US, China and many other countries? Why don't we redistribute wealth to the third world to equalise life expectancy? Answer: Because not all human life is equal
Andrew Beef wrote: » If someone came to me for advice around a crisis pregnancy I would help them emotionally and financially, and I would urge them not to have an abortion. .
ForestFire wrote: » To you agree with war? Ireland is neutral by the way Do you agree with restricted medicine? Do you agree with the death the penalty. Also illegal in Ireland. To you agree with communisim? I would guess this is illegal in our constitution?
blanch152 wrote: » A late night posting that doesn't make any sense. A poster posted some nonsense that all human life is equal, I explained to him many situations where that was not the case. I will give you another example. Say your loved one falls into freezing water, would you jump in afterwards to save her? Would you run into a burning building to save a complete stranger? Not all human life is equal from all perspectives.
2wsxcde3 wrote: » I've no problem with... gay people.
ForestFire wrote: » Is after eleven late for you? I simply pointed out that your examples of unequal rights to life are in fact, mostly examples of equal rights to life in Ireland as we have laws against them Just like our current laws on the life of the unborn child.
pleas advice wrote: » See Shorter Oxford English Dictionary 397 (6th ed. 2007), which's first definition is "A fetus; an infant;...". See also ‘The Compact Edition of the Oxford English Dictionary: Complete Text Reproduced Micrographically’, Vol. I (Oxford University Press, Oxford 1971): 396, which defines it as: ‘The unborn or newly born human being; foetus, infant’.
splinter65 wrote: » I keep dropping in here to see what’s going on and I see this. No such thing as an unborn child....it’s no wonder the pro life side are winning ...carry on...
Edward M wrote: » From the OED. "Definition of pregnant in English: pregnant ADJECTIVE 1(of a woman or female animal) having a child or young developing in the uterus. ‘she was heavily pregnant with her second child’ ‘she was six months pregnant’".
ForestFire wrote: » So can I pull this statement out anytime someone tries to have a reasoned conversation? Oh and you must have missed this, while you were dismissing the use and meaning of words used.......the link The Oxford English Dictionary But what would they know about the use of words
ForestFire wrote: » Prostitution is illegal in Ireland, we don't need to check and test every man leaving the country for this? Especially those Amsterdam flights , so don't see why we would need to check every woman leaving.
WhiteRoses wrote: » No it isn’t. And you might want to have a word with the government, because they don’t even issue birth/death certificates for stillbirths before 24 weeks gestation. Even the government do not recognize it as a life lost. So would you be happy for your wife or daughter to have her health significantly compromised or even die for the sake of a 10 week gestation pregnancy? Because that’s what you are asking other people to do. Even if you don’t think I am, I know I’m more important than a zygote. I dispair that a small demographic of society believe me and other women to be so expendable, so insignificant as to equte our worth to that of a zygote.
uptherebels wrote: » You don't believe that years ago in conservative Catholic Ireland where suicide and unplanned pregnancies were sins that these things may have been under reported? As for someone who routinely ignores being asked to provide evidence of their claims, I feel this quote is appropriate
blanch152 wrote: » If a doctor refuses medical treatment (including the morning after pill) on conscience grounds for a woman in distress over a possible unplanned pregnancy and she later commits suicide, was the doctor in breach of their oath as a doctor?
2wsxcde3 wrote: » Some would argue that the doctor could just send the woman to another doctor. But that argument falls apart. Ashers bakery in Northern Ireland were not allowed tell a gay customer to just go to another bakery for their wedding cake. Once something becomes a "human right", people are forced to go against their conscious.
ohnonotgmail wrote: » Is that how you consider conjoined twins? as one hosting the other?
Joeytheparrot wrote: » You lashed in some bizarre statements about our marriages being experimental yesterday though. Not very convinced at all.
mrkiscool2 wrote: » Firstly, dictionary definition from 1971 isn't a citeable source. Definitions change. When I look up "child definiton", none of the definitions on the first page of results said fetus or infant. You can do the same, you'll get the same result. Really clutching at straws there. There isn't. A child isn't unborn. A child is a born human being. So, we are using non-medical dictionaries to define what pregnancy is now? . Pregnancy is a medical condition. So, unless you can find a definition in a medical journal that calls a fetus a child, that won't work well for you. The link had absolutely no links in it. It was a link to a anti-choice page which contained no links to cite what it was saying. And absolutely. If someone is saying "well, x study" or "Well, x is defined as" and can't prove that's the definition, then you can absolutely dismiss it. Can't believe I had to take my time to explain all that. Pain in my ass.
pilly wrote: » I'd be fully in favour of the fake womb idea but only after every living breathing child that already exists had at least the basics in this country like a place to call home.
Sweetemotion wrote: » Who do you think would benefit most from the fake womb idea, men or women?
mrkiscool2 wrote: » Firstly, dictionary definition from 1971 isn't a citeable source. Definitions change. When I look up "child definiton", none of the definitions on the first page of results said fetus or infant. You can do the same, you'll get the same result. Really clutching at straws there. So, we are using non-medical dictionaries to define what pregnancy is now? . Pregnancy is a medical condition. So, unless you can find a definition in a medical journal that calls a fetus a child, that won't work well for you.
JupiterKid wrote: » It’s funny, isn’t it? Teenage pregnancies here in Ireland have seen huge drops in recent years as proper sex education has finally made its way to all schools, despite fierce and bitter resistance from religious right wing types. In every country where sex education has been implemented and enhanced, teen pregnancy rates have dropped. Doesn’t tally with the so called “pro-life” brigade who rally against sex education and easily available contraception as it will turn virginal pure young girls into shameless hussies who will murder their unborn babies at the first opportunity. Utterly distorted, self-defeatist thinking.
