Nick Park wrote: Maybe you should read the thread title?
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Shoobs86 wrote: » I would not sacrifice myself for an unborn fetus. I simply would not. And I am terrified to think that this mentality still exists in this country. I am not here to breed the next generation - how dare you If God can forgive a murderer, an adulterer, a sinner as long as they repent then how dare you say that any woman whose life was saved by this medical procedure must explain herself to God. How dare you.
Shoobs86 wrote: » I don't believe that voting "No" in this referendum will cease abortion in this country. I also don't believe your position that amending the 8th Amendment will mean that there is a murder free-for-all - be sensible in your arguements, this is NOT an approval for murder in general. It is approval for the decriminalisation of a medical procedure to end a pregnancy before the 12 week mark. This procedure happens every day in all countries - this referendum will not stop it. I also have to point out, as the parent of a Down Syndrome child, that the testing for Down Syndrome cannot be done before 12 weeks, and therefore the risk of "abortion due to disability" is removed by this time limit.
Shoobs86 wrote: » This is completely irrational. Where are you coming up with "white apes"? What has that got to do with anything in this thread? This is why non-Christian people think that we are all nuts - you must be logical in your responses!
Shoobs86 wrote: » I think that this is the incorrect way to view the situation. As a Christian, yes, I uphold the moral and biblical law of thou shalt not kill. And therefore, I will not have an abortion by choice. However, I also currently run the risk of being killed by doctors during my pregnancy simply because there is no room in the law for them to terminate a pregnancy if I am at risk. Yes, the wording says it's ok if I am at risk - but we have seen evidence of doctors unwilling to do anything because they are afraid of being sued. I, personally, am already scared by this. As a Christian I also have to be honest with myself and realise that I have never walked in another's shoes; I cannot, and have no right to, interfere with someone else's choice - isn't that why God gave us Free Will? To sin, to repent, to be forgiven. I don't believe that voting "No" in this referendum will cease abortion in this country. I also don't believe your position that amending the 8th Amendment will mean that there is a murder free-for-all - be sensible in your arguements, this is NOT an approval for murder in general. It is approval for the decriminalisation of a medical procedure to end a pregnancy before the 12 week mark. This procedure happens every day in all countries - this referendum will not stop it. I also have to point out, as the parent of a Down Syndrome child, that the testing for Down Syndrome cannot be done before 12 weeks, and therefore the risk of "abortion due to disability" is removed by this time limit. When I weigh this all up morally, I cannot in good faith believe that I have the "high ground" above other people when I am not God - God has given people Free Will and it is not my place to judge under any circumstance. I can keep MY morals intact by not having an abortion, and by supporting proper Adoption services, but I cannot judge those who will have an abortion either way - no matter what the result of the referendum.
Shoobs86 wrote: This is completely irrational. Where are you coming up with "white apes"? What has that got to do with anything in this thread?
Shoobs86 wrote: This is why non-Christian people think that we are all nuts - you must be logical in your responses!
fkx2nspcw9omhg wrote: » There is no situation where you are allowed to kill the unborn. In the case of a mother's life, would she not sacrifice her life for the sake of her born child? Of course she would. It's the same in the case of the unborn child. After all, when she dies, she has to stand before the Son of Man, and give an account of her actions.
NaFirinne wrote: » Really.....what is the correct term? I mean you don't say to a woman who your hear is pregnant congratulations on your fetus. You say congratulations on your baby. You are fast to use medical terms when you want t ease your conscious about killing unborn babies. People have done it for hundreds of years in the past - Dehumanize the people they want to kill. Weren't even irish people called the white ape at one stage. You can rename an unborn baby to whatever term you wish, but your for still for killing them. Anyone voting for removing the 8th will have their deaths on there soul when the come before the son of man
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J C wrote: » but this doesn't remove the moral responsibility from anybody, when they act on matters of life and death ... such as when they cast their vote in the upcoming abortion referendum. Do we really want a society where the most dangerous place to be is in your mother's womb? There are obvious substantive reasons why 'thou shall not kill' is a critical principle for society to live by ... other than the fact that it is the Sixth Commanment of God (although that in itself should be very important for any Christian). The most obvious (and selfish reason) is that I could be the next victim, in a society that doesn't enforce and criminally sanction the principle of 'thou shall not kill'. ... and you or I might never have been born, if our societies didn't protect the right to life of unborn children, at the time. ... so why should we metaphorically 'lift the drawbrdge' behind us now? ... and leave future generations of children to 'run the gauntlet' of being aborted, in a society that legally allows unlimited abortion?
NuMarvel wrote: Our Constitution says otherwise, but for some reason, no one on the "pro life" side wants to change that.
fkx2nspcw9omhg wrote: » There is no situation where you are allowed to kill the unborn.
NaFirinne wrote: » I can't come up with a single reason for killing an innocent baby.
pilly wrote: » No, your mask is well and truly slipping now by showing what you think of women. If you genuinely believe that women are having abortions JUST BECAUSE then you have an extremely low opinion of women and there is nothing Christian at all about that.
J C wrote: » The mask is slipping allright for the narcissists, who would prefer to abort their unborn child, than go through with their pregnancy ... just because they want to. ... that's what abortion on demand is, after all. Of course, the vast majority of pregnant women do go through with their pregnancies, even in less than ideal circumstances ... and they should be applauded for doing so ... and given all practicable support by the state for doing so ... in line with the sentiments of the 8th. ... and there certainly should be provision for abortion in hard cases. However, exploiting hard cases to push through abortion on demand is quite hypocritical.
J C wrote: What difference does it make how somebody voted on marriage and divorce referenda? ... when, unlike the current referendum, that is to be put before the people no lives were or will be lost as a result of either referenda. I have said that it is within the competence of the state to determine the terms of state marriage and divorce ... so I support the state in the exercise of their powers to bring equality to bear on its services for all its citizens ... including marriage and divorce.
J C wrote: » What difference does it make how somebody voted on marriage and divorce referenda? ... when, unlike the current referendum, that is to be put before the people no lives were or will be lost as a result of either referenda. I have said that it is within the competence of the state to determine the terms of state marriage and divorce ... so I support the state in the exercise of their powers to bring equality to bear on its services for all its citizens ... including marriage and divorce.
