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The 8th amendment(Mod warning in op)

RobertKK

The citizens assembly voted to replace or amend the 8th amendment.

50% voted to replace or amend
44% voted to repeal
Rest preferred to not state an opinion

Now deciding how it will be replaced or amended
: Let the Dail legislate on the rights of the unborn
: Amend the provision in the constitution.

Meltdown on twitter by Repealthe8th people.

Mod- This thread has descended in to petty name calling. We've tried to let this thread run without too much mod interference but now it's on our radar we will be watching. From here on the name calling stops. If you can't debate civilly we will remove your right to post.

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kenmc

ricero wrote: »

Abortion cannot be used as a form of contraception. Society cannot become a place without responsibilities and abortion a way out for people who dont use contraceptive methods when practicising sex.

What about those whose contraceptives fail for any reason?

I really hope that's a very short horse you're riding there, high ones can cause serious injuries when you fall off

[Deleted User]

Jim Ellis wrote: »

They have a point. Morals and value of human life are slowly being eroded in society. The right-on liberals will find something else to focus their attention on after this referendum is passed.

Well you could say the same for the other side, if we vote no will they concentrate their efforts on getting a womans right to travel for an abortion removed?

ricero

kenmc wrote: »

What about those whose contraceptives fail for any reason?

I really hope that's a very short horse you're riding there, high ones can cause serious injuries when you fall off

God damn you passive agressive liberals. Respect my opinion !

murpho999

ricero wrote: »

Abortion cannot be used as a form of contraception. Society cannot become a place without responsibilities and abortion a way out for people who dont use contraceptive methods when practicising sex.

It's not a form of contraception.

People should not be forced to having a child that they do not want or cannot support or for making a mistake.

I also strongly believe it's a highly personal choice for women and not for society.

Also, it's not led to any problems in other societies that have permitted abortion for around 50 years now.

Itssoeasy

Deleted User wrote: »

Weren't the RCC only the other day trying to link legalising abortion to the opening of a door to euthanasia for the elderly and people with disabilities.

EDIT: I'm really not looking forward to this campaign , my eyes will be rolling in my head so fast it'll look like they are still

yeah I'm not looking forward to it either because this issue is an extremely emotive one with strong views on both sides. I've no problem with people having a respectful and frank exchange of views on the issue. I think the facts need to be the central and most important thing. I feel both sides need to deal in facts.

I would say in January 2018 I'm most certainly in the undecided column. That's why I mentioned about Ronan Mullen being a poor spokesperson(or advocate) for the anti repeal side. He certainly puts me off.

Army_of_One

Doltanian wrote: »

Lookup White Genocide, the population replacement agenda driven by the leftwing marxist organisations around the world to make European White people a minority and to end Anglo-American-European Hegemony in the world.

lol

Night Falls

There is a whole lot of crazy on this thread and it is absolutely fascinating to watch.

Loafing Oaf

ricero wrote: »

The wording will be key. If its for severe disabilities and rape victims then i would consider voting yes.

It won't be...

Bannasidhe

Jim Ellis wrote: »

They have a point. Morals and value of human life are slowly being eroded in society. The right-on liberals will find something else to focus their attention on after this referendum is passed.

Yes, in the good old days there was huge respect for morals and the value of life which is why unmarried women were forced into laundries and their children, the ones who didn't die of neglect and get left in a septic tank, were sold to Americans.

How dare the liberals insist on closing the laundries and compensating the women. The cheek of liberals to insist that being an unmarried mother is not a crime worthy of incarceration of mother and child. The absolute nerve of liberals to deny the Church and State the right to sell children in return for lucrative export contracts.

Itssoeasy

Jim Ellis wrote: »

They have a point. Morals and value of human life are slowly being eroded in society. The right-on liberals will find something else to focus their attention on after this referendum is passed.

Well with respect I think to say that Ireland was a shining city on the hill(to use the American phrase) in terms of value of human life in particular is seeing things through rose tinted glasses. The magdeline laundries, sex abuse scandals certainly don't point to any value of human life. It's good that we as a country are more excepting and more open. And the Catholic Church is still around and the poeple who wish to go to mass do so but it's not the iron grip it once had.

Odhinn

Jim Ellis wrote: »

They have a point. Morals and value of human life are slowly being eroded in society. The right-on liberals will find something else to focus their attention on after this referendum is passed.

These would be the crowd who were selling babies for cash, allowing vast amounts of child abuse go unchecked, putting infants remains in unmarked graves, septic tanks, harrassing unmarried mothers or those of whoms lifetstyles they disapproved? That RC?

Odhinn

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Yes, in the good old days there was huge respect for morals and the value of life which is why unmarried women were forced into laundries and their children, the ones who didn't die of neglect and get left in a septic tank, were sold to Americans.

How dare the liberals insist on closing the laundries and compensating the women. The cheek of liberals to insist that being an unmarried mother is not a crime worthy of incarceration of mother and child. The absolute nerve of liberals to deny the Church and State the right to sell children in return for lucrative export contracts.

We are on the same wavelength. Truly the end is nigh.

Laois_Man

My main gripe with the governments chosen method is when you take it out of the constitution and into the hands of the legislatures, every General Election forever more could effectively become another abortion referendum with every party proposing new changes as part of their manifesto. Whatever the new text is, if any, it needs to continue to live in the constitution

evancunny95

I really do worry now that the result of this referendum will be No. Polls show a strong lead at the moment but expect that to nosedive like in the SSM which was a completely different kind of referendum. Student vote should see a bump, but even end of May students are starting to leave for the summer. I do think a lot of it will come down to turnout, with Dublin turnout being vitally important.

pconn062

Night Falls wrote: »

There is a whole lot of crazy on this thread and it is absolutely fascinating to watch.

Yup, topics like this really bring out the loonies on both sides. Then the rest of us normal people have to face 4 months of them.

Loafing Oaf

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

LOL. you realise that Michael Martin has come out in support of repeal?

Striking how little vitriol Martin has attracted from the pro-lifers since his conversion to the dark side. Contrast how eager they have been to deploy their beloved 'pro-abortion' label at the slightest hint of liberalism on the issue from Fine Gael over the years. I guess the problem with that slue is it kind of loses its sting if all parties are 'pro-abortion' to one degree or another...

Kurtosis

Deleted User wrote: »

Weren't the RCC only the other day trying to link legalising abortion to the opening of a door to euthanasia for the elderly and people with disabilities.

EDIT: I'm really not looking forward to this campaign , my eyes will be rolling in my head so fast it'll look like they are still

Yes they were. And also scaremongering by spouting nonsense like this:

Dr Doran said the proposals “are significantly more liberal than the current law in Britain, where slightly more than one in five unborn children are aborted every year”.

Abortions in England, Wales and Scotland are carried out before 24 weeks of pregnancy but can be carried out after that in certain circumstances, such as if the woman’s life is at risk or the foetus would be born with a severe disability.

Night Falls

It's also ironic for someone to be decrying the erosion of morals and the value of human life when in the very same thread someone is pining for a dictator infamous for the murder of thousands of his citizens and for the repression of the democratic process. But of course the abuse is only coming from "the left".

murpho999

evancunny95 wrote: »

I really do worry now that the result of this referendum will be No. Polls show a strong lead at the moment but expect that to nosedive like in the SSM which was a completely different kind of referendum. Student vote should see a bump, but even end of May students are starting to leave for the summer. I do think a lot of it will come down to turnout, with Dublin turnout being vitally important.

SSM carried by 62% to 38% so it was very comfortable.

I think many public figures such as politicians etc who are going to campaign for No are actually out of touch and not realising the change that has taken place in Irish society over the last 20 years.

_Dara_

Gulp. I feel so nervous now. And I’m actually going to be out of the country at the end of May.

ohnonotgmail

Laois_Man wrote: »

My main gripe with the governments chosen method is when you take it out of the constitution and into the hands of the legislatures, every General Election forever more could effectively become another abortion referendum with every party proposing new changes as part of their manifesto. Whatever the new text is, if any, it needs to continue to live in the constitution

No government will want to touch abortion legislation with a bargepole for a long time to come

[Deleted User]

murpho999 wrote: »

Sorry but you're talkng absolute sh1te.

Women don't have abortions because of Marxist plots.

It's ok. That memo will be released soon. Everything is Marxist plots.

PopePalpatine

Night Falls wrote: »

It's also ironic for someone to be decrying the erosion of morals and the value of human life when in the very same thread someone is pining for a dictator infamous for the murder of thousands of his citizens and for the repression of the democratic process.

He gets a pass, shure he was saving his countrymen from giving up on furthering the white race and cross-dressing!

Zonda999

I am glad of the governments decision but honestly, I'd also be concerned of a No vote here. We know these things always even up towards the end and I imagine the turnout for this will be big, especially the grey vote who will definitely have their voices heard. I think for this to pass comfortably, there'll have to be a big push for those <35 to actually vote, as well as in the urban areas generally.

Night Falls

circadian wrote: »

It's ok. That memo will be released soon. Everything is Marxist plots.

To be fair, Duck Soup was very much ahead of it's time.

Laois_Man

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

No government will want to touch abortion legislation with a bargepole for a long time to come

They’ll be forced to take a position on it if losing votes to another party in an election campaign

Zubeneschamali

Doltanian wrote: »

Fianna Fail need to pull the plug on this charade excuse of a Government immediately to prevent a referendum taking place.

So, some of the prolifers are beginning to believe the polls - realizing they will lose, they want to prevent a vote.

Zubeneschamali

Doltanian wrote: »

as a Conservative, Anti-EU, Anti-Feminst, Pro-Trump, Anti-Marxist I will vote against Abortion.

By all means do, and tell both of the other conservative, anti-EU, anti-feminist, pro-Trump, anti-Marxists in Ireland to vote No too.

pleas advice

Kurtosis wrote: »

Yes they were. And also scaremongering by spouting nonsense like this:

what nonsense is this?

Night Falls

Zonda999 wrote: »

I am glad of the governments decision but honestly, I'd also be concerned of a No vote here. We know these things always even up towards the end and I imagine the turnout for this will be big, especially the grey vote who will definitely have their voices heard. I think for this to pass comfortably, there'll have to be a big push for those <35 to actually vote, as well as in the urban areas generally.

I'm not certain that the older female vote will be as weighted in favour of what you might call a "conservative" position as in other topics. Young votes are certainly needed, but I don't think the older generations will be the gimme that would usually be assumed.