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Child Item

The Kerry Babies Case

irishguitarlad

What do you think of it? As the son of an Abbeydorney woman I take an interest in it as I kept on hearing about it growing up. I reckon the gardaí were covering up for someone when they blamed Joanna Hayes. Anyways, what's your opinion?

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ohnonotgmail

MrJones1973 wrote: »

I think a lot of you are deluded if you think its positive for kids teens to meet up and have sex with strangers for very obvious reasons. I don't think it was common practice for teens to meet strangers in disco s and pool halls and have sex with them. Back in the 1980s.
I wonder what impact these apps will have on their emotional development ?
Most teenage girls regret losing virginity at a young age
Perhaps you might say im an old fart but nobody will convince me that a wham bam thank you mam teenage culture is a positive.
We already have to teach kids its not ok to have sex with a comatose girl. God knows whats next!!

all of the teenage pregnancies i remember from school in the 80's must have been miraculous conceptions.

MrJones1973

I think a lot of you are deluded if you think its positive for kids teens to meet up and have sex with strangers for very obvious reasons. I don't think it was common practice for teens to meet strangers in disco s and pool halls and have sex with them. Back in the 1980s.
I wonder what impact these apps will have on their emotional development ?
Most teenage girls regret losing virginity at a young age
Perhaps you might say im an old fart but nobody will convince me that a wham bam thank you mam teenage culture is a positive.
We already have to teach kids its not ok to have sex with a comatose girl. God knows whats next!!

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volchitsa

MrJones1973 wrote: »

Im not saying men did not try it on in stupid and illegal ways in the past but teens did not meet up on apps with total strangers looking for sex . Some might say there is no harm. I dont

Things have changed, there was no internet back then, and now we don't let priests rape children.
I'm not sure it's necessarily all for the bad really. All this nostalgia is just that, nostalgia.

You were more innocent back then, and so were teens in general - but not everyone was. And some adults could and did use that for their own agenda. On the whole, I think it's better for young people to choose to have sex with whoever they want rather than some of them being manipulated into having sex with pillars of the community whom everyone looks up to.

MrJones1973

Im not saying men did not try it on in stupid and illegal ways in the past but teens did not meet up on apps with total strangers looking for sex . Some might say there is no harm. I dont

volchitsa

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How is that different to the past?

I remember fellas trying to get into my knickers on the first date 30 years ago.[/quote]
I remember having to physically fight off a friend of a friend who had taken me home after a partyin the early 80s too - and he was a Guard. Never even crossed my mind to report him, because it was one of those things back then. The idea that this is new is just silly.

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MrJones1973

Nobody wants to go back to the 1980s but our tinder world could use a rein in. Consent is being taught in schools now and a lot of young teens expect sex first date.

dense

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

you're right it's dalkey

Long, but worth a read:

Dalkey house of horrors, as it became named:

http://www.broadsheet.ie/2016/01/12/a-dalkey-archive/

Ash.J.Williams

julyjane wrote: »

Yes that's the one I was referring to. Dalkey/Dun Laoighre I'm not sure which

you're right it's dalkey

tayto lover

Deleted User wrote: »

No there wouldn't. Not for a known gun importer, terrorist, attempted murderer and viewer of child pornography.
Seriously, someone like that should be extremely well-known to every Garda around. The ****ing FBI were investigating him at one stage FFS.

Of course there would.

Odhinn

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Or just put them into one or other kind of "home".

We used to have the highest psychiatric incarceration rate in the world.

"Father Feely interfered with me!"
"A priest thats a pervert? Ye must be mad"

julyjane

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

there's a house of horrors case in DunLaoghaire where a baby was born and the granny stabbed him/her to death with knitting needles. I believe there was a paedo ring involving a garda cover up there too.

Yes that's the one I was referring to. Dalkey/Dun Laoighre I'm not sure which

[Deleted User]

tayto lover wrote: »

Good for you then.
Nobody seemed to know he had a gun in the house, even her.
If the girl asked the garda to go to the house with her to get her clothes and he refused because he was on his own there would be loads saying "what a coward, he shouldn't be a garda".
It doesn't matter what they do as they can't win for losing it seems.

No there wouldn't. Not for a known gun importer, terrorist, attempted murderer and viewer of child pornography.
Seriously, someone like that should be extremely well-known to every Garda around. The ****ing FBI were investigating him at one stage FFS.

Ash.J.Williams

julyjane wrote: »

Infanticide has been happening for millennia, thankfully rare but there are cases in history of newborn babies being killed at or shortly after birth (possibly due to poverty/shame/postpartum psychosis etc.) It was usually done by something not very violent such as smothering. 28 stab wounds, I find it hard to believe a mother could do that. The only other case I heard of a baby being stabbed was in the Dalkey house of horrors.

there's a house of horrors case in DunLaoghaire where a baby was born and the granny stabbed him/her to death with knitting needles. I believe there was a paedo ring involving a garda cover up there too.

tayto lover

Deleted User wrote: »

And there's a lot who will defend absolutely anything when it goes against what they think.
The guy was on bail for terrorism offences. He was known to have had guns. If he isn't on every Garda within 15 miles' radar then there's something massively, massively wrong with how the Gardai operate. I knew who he was and I never met him nor any of his family. But I can pay attention to what happens around me.

Good for you then.
Nobody seemed to know he had a gun in the house, even her.
If the girl asked the garda to go to the house with her to get her clothes and he refused because he was on his own there would be loads saying "what a coward, he shouldn't be a garda".
It doesn't matter what they do as they can't win for losing it seems.

julyjane

volchitsa wrote: »

I must have missed that, how do we know he/she is now dead? Doesnt that imply knowing who killed him?

Though personally I dont believe that someone who killed a newborn baby would have been motivated by the sort of personal hatred that would make them then destroy the grave. I think something else is going on there, and that it may not be the killer of the baby at all. Assuming he was killed, as I said before.

Just speculating of course, but I dont think infanticide is motivated by personal hatred, and I think destruction of a grave is a symbolic act that is probably a very different act from infanticide.

Infanticide has been happening for millennia, thankfully rare but there are cases in history of newborn babies being killed at or shortly after birth (possibly due to poverty/shame/postpartum psychosis etc.) It was usually done by something not very violent such as smothering. 28 stab wounds, I find it hard to believe a mother could do that. The only other case I heard of a baby being stabbed was in the Dalkey house of horrors.

Hotblack Desiato

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The guy was on bail for terrorism offences. He was known to have had guns.

The judge who gave him bail is the bigger problem tbh.

[Deleted User]

tayto lover wrote: »

I'm sure it happens all the time. What if he was the only garda on a beat and he had a run in with the same guy?
They don't seem to have the resources or the time to wait for reinforcements.
It's easy to be wiser after the event but when you have to face it then different logic is to the fore, as I said there's a lot of hurlers on the ditch.

And there's a lot who will defend absolutely anything when it goes against what they think.
The guy was on bail for terrorism offences. He was known to have had guns. If he isn't on every Garda within 15 miles' radar then there's something massively, massively wrong with how the Gardai operate. I knew who he was and I never met him nor any of his family. But I can pay attention to what happens around me.

tayto lover

Deleted User wrote: »

Someone who was on bail for terrorist offences was paid a visit by a lone, un-armed Garda. If there's not massive incompetence somewhere there I just don't know what to say.

I'm sure it happens all the time. What if he was the only garda on a beat and he had a run in with the same guy?
They don't seem to have the resources or the time to wait for reinforcements.
It's easy to be wiser after the event but when you have to face it then different logic is to the fore, as I said there's a lot of hurlers on the ditch.

Hotblack Desiato

Or just put them into one or other kind of "home".

We used to have the highest psychiatric incarceration rate in the world.

Ash.J.Williams

When people act like Iran is a backward religious kip I cringe a little because we were the same not so long ago. we didn't execute people, but we drove them to suicide.

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volchitsa

....... wrote: »

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I must have missed that, how do we know he/she is now dead? Doesnt that imply knowing who killed him?

Though personally I dont believe that someone who killed a newborn baby would have been motivated by the sort of personal hatred that would make them then destroy the grave. I think something else is going on there, and that it may not be the killer of the baby at all. Assuming he was killed, as I said before.

Just speculating of course, but I dont think infanticide is motivated by personal hatred, and I think destruction of a grave is a symbolic act that is probably a very different act from infanticide.

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_Dara_

Kerrydude1981 wrote: »

What I found strange was Baby John's headstone been smashed up back in 2004 just as it was coming up to what would have been his 20th birthday,was it just vandals and why did they pick out that grave of all the graves in the graveyard

Good piece here about it

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/what-now-in-the-hunt-for-baby-johns-killer-36512195.html

What kind of lowlife would smash his grave? :mad: He is the innocent party here.

Kerrydude1981

What I found strange was Baby John's headstone been smashed up back in 2004 just as it was coming up to what would have been his 20th birthday,was it just vandals and why did they pick out that grave of all the graves in the graveyard

Good piece here about it

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/what-now-in-the-hunt-for-baby-johns-killer-36512195.html

[Deleted User]

tayto lover wrote: »

I don't know what he was told or not told. I saw a Prime Time programme about it and they didn't think he was told anything about the murderer. They went to Dundalk but would have had to go to Omeath area anyway because that's where she lived with him.
In the second case Talkofthetown said the Garda expected to charge people soon. I'd say that they will only get one chance at it and it has to be right or it won't succeed.

Someone who was on bail for terrorist offences was paid a visit by a lone, un-armed Garda. If there's not massive incompetence somewhere there I just don't know what to say.

tayto lover

Deleted User wrote: »

Am I right in thinking that no-one told him that there was someone in his area on bail for arms importation? And I believe they originally went to Dundalk (a "main" station) and were told to go to the small station? There's a huge amount of incompetence involved.
For the other care it's been going on ridiculously long time. If they had the evidence (not sure how much more they'll get at this stage) could they not have charges ready and get the suspects extradited?

I don't know what he was told or not told. I saw a Prime Time programme about it and they didn't think he was told anything about the murderer. They went to Dundalk but would have had to go to Omeath area anyway because that's where she lived with him.
In the second case Talkofthetown said the Garda expected to charge people soon. I'd say that they will only get one chance at it and it has to be right or it won't succeed.