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Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread VIII - MOD NOTE POST #4781

Steve

Continuing on from the previous thread....

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Dog Botherer

Great to see Leavy in there. Anyone know if he’s fit?

[Deleted User]

thomond2006 wrote: »

Chris Farrell in there and no Rory Scannell suggests Henshaw will remain at 12.

Yeah, he's two of each centre position in the squad.

molloyjh

Former Former wrote: »

The last person to start a test for Ireland at full-back is named in the squad.

Re: TOH; the writing was on the wall for him in the summer tour.

Conway? Against Japan?

If you go back to the last competitive game we played (England in the 6Ns) we had Zebo on the wing. Probably phrased what I meant badly, which was that we've had a second distributor in the back field generally. Is there one there other than Carbery now?

Buer

molloyjh wrote: »

The more I think of it the more I wonder if Carbery will be utilised at FB. We've had Zebo there and utilised his distribution there a fair bit in the last year or so. Unless Carbery is playing FB we don't have anyone who can fulfil that role in this squad.

To be honest, I'd be surprised if Carbery doesn't start a game at 15. Aside from the fact he is in excellent form there, he hasn't played a single game anywhere else this season.

thomond2006

Chris Farrell in there and no Rory Scannell suggests Henshaw will remain at 12.

thomond2006

molloyjh wrote: »

Actually you're right. Curveballs galore today!

Meh, don't have any strong feeling one way or the other there. Dave covers more positions than Sweetnam so if I were to replace him with anyone it'd be Conway.

Sweetnam has played fullback a lot at B&I level.
(Yes I know..B&I level)

[Deleted User]

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

The same Beirne who has never been in an Ireland camp? Extended or otherwise?

No, the same Beirne who is joining Munster.

molloyjh

aloooof wrote: »

I've only just realised that Rory Scannell hasn't been picked either?

Actually you're right. Curveballs galore today!

thomond2006 wrote: »

Ah Sweetnam or Conway should be in there ahead of Dave Kearney.

Meh, don't have any strong feeling one way or the other there. Dave covers more positions than Sweetnam so if I were to replace him with anyone it'd be Conway.

Former Former

molloyjh wrote: »

Shocked at the call to drop Zebo. Wouldn't agree with it myself either. Think swiwi is right re the nose and the face. Cronins absence is also a big surprise given the lack of both quality and experience outside of Best.

The more I think of it the more I wonder if Carbery will be utilised at FB. We've had Zebo there and utilised his distribution there a fair bit in the last year or so. Unless Carbery is playing FB we don't have anyone who can fulfil that role in this squad.

The last person to start a test for Ireland at full-back is named in the squad.

Re: TOH; the writing was on the wall for him in the summer tour.

Buer

phog wrote: »

If dropping Zebo is the right call then Beirne should be named in the squad.

He's not available for any training camps or meet ups. Therefore, he is not considered. Plus he doesn't deserve it particularly on his form of the past few weeks (neither does Dillane though).

There really isn't much ambiguity about the selection policy for players who are contracted outside of Ireland.

[Deleted User]

phog wrote: »

If dropping Zebo is the right call then Beirne should be named in the squad.

I agree - but what is his contract situation with Scarlett's in terms of being available for squad meet ups and the international windows?

thomond2006

phog wrote: »

If dropping Zebo is the right call then Beirne should be named in the squad.

I agree, although I imagine Beirne doesn't have release for the usual camps outside the international window.

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

The same Beirne who has never been in an Ireland camp? Extended or otherwise?

That's one reason why you would get him in now instead of new year. We are stacked at lock though, it's arguably the strongest position in the squad.

arsebiscuits1

phog wrote: »

If dropping Zebo is the right call then Beirne should be named in the squad.

The same Beirne who has never been in an Ireland camp? Extended or otherwise?

molloyjh

Shocked at the call to drop Zebo. Wouldn't agree with it myself either. Think swiwi is right re the nose and the face. Cronins absence is also a big surprise given the lack of both quality and experience outside of Best.

The more I think of it the more I wonder if Carbery will be utilised at FB. We've had Zebo there and utilised his distribution there a fair bit in the last year or so. Unless Carbery is playing FB we don't have anyone who can fulfil that role in this squad.

[Deleted User]

errlloyd wrote: »

Would it be fair to say that other than Sexy, Keatley and Carbery none of those backs are particularly good at passing the ball.

I really hope Carbs gets a run at 15, otherwise we're here for Warren Ball.

I mean they are primary distributors so it's expected that they have a variety and depth to their passes but others are capable. Adam Byrne actually has as many assists as tries last season if not more so which would be an obvious indicator but guys like Stockdale and McCloskey have a decent passing game also with plenty of subtlety and accuracy.

phog

If dropping Zebo is the right call then Beirne should be named in the squad.

thomond2006

molloyjh wrote: »

Best guess at the first choice 23 from that:

McGrath Best Furlong
Toner Henderson
POM Stander SOB

Murray Sexton
Henshaw Aki
Stockdale Kearney Earls

Herring, Healy, Ryan, Ryan, Ruddock, Marmion, Carbery, D Kearney

Ah Sweetnam or Conway should be in there ahead of Dave Kearney.

Former Former

thomond2006 wrote: »

No, I mean pick him until the RWC. I think he's good enough to be picked while in France. When you look at the other options selected he comfortably starts in Ireland's back three and definitely makes the RWC squad.

Ah, Zebo was never going to be the player for whom the rule would be broken. He has never (never) been a first choice player for Ireland and not remotely in the Murray/Sexton league of importance to the team.

So the question becomes, when does he get dropped? If these AIs are about building for the future, then you drop him now. He is no more a long term option than Trimble or Bowe.

irishfan9

Zebo made his choice, he knew there would only one decision Joe would make in order to protect irish rugby.

aloooof

errlloyd wrote: »

Would it be fair to say that other than Sexy, Keatley and Carbery none of those backs are particularly good at passing the ball.

I really hope Carbs gets a run at 15, otherwise we're here for Warren Ball.

I've only just realised that Rory Scannell hasn't been picked either?

molloyjh

LH: McGrath, Healy, Kilcoyne
HK: Best, Herring, Tracey
TH: Furlong, Ryan, Porter
LK: Toner, Henderson, Dillane, Ryan, Treadwell
BS: POM, Ruddock, Leavy
OS: SOB, TOD
N8: Stander, Conan

SH: Murray, Marmion, McGrath
OH: Sexton, Carbery, Keatley
IC: Henshaw, McCloskey
OC: Aki, Farrell
WG: Earls, Kearney, Stockdale, Sweetnam, Byrne
FB: Kearney, Conway

Best guess at the first choice 23 from that:

McGrath Best Furlong
Toner Henderson
POM Stander SOB

Murray Sexton
Henshaw Aki
Stockdale Kearney Earls

Herring, Healy, Ryan, Ryan, Ruddock, Marmion, Carbery, D Kearney

thomond2006

Buer wrote: »

Nah, that would be madness. Any player who is a starter for Ireland would consider rolling the dice and moving then.

Zebo was a guaranteed starter for Ireland at this stage but he wasn't indispensible especially with the form of guys like Earls and Stockdale along with lads like Carbery, Kearney and TOH all having played 15 for Ireland in the past year.

I get you. I probably see Zebo as a better option relative to other players more than other posters.

[Deleted User]

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

I'd be gobsmacked if Robbie was anything other than a 13 this series.

So would I, but then we can play slightly differently if we have a bunch of battering rams in the backline with aki, mccloskey and the two big lads on the wings in Stockdale and Byrne and Henshaw making big carries from fullback.

I'd vary it up a bit by having Earls in there and Ringrose at 13 and keep one of the lads inside but it's not without potential.

Don't see it happening, but we've plenty of options. Exciting times.

[Deleted User]

thomond2006 wrote: »

he comfortably starts in Ireland's back three and definitely makes the RWC squad.
.
.
.
I get it from the IRFU's point of view but given the other options I wouldn't be so quick to discard Zebo.

The message is clearly that it doesn't matter what the other options are. If you leave you're out. I think it's the right call personally.

[Deleted User]

Dropping Zebo is the right call. We need to continue the push to see the best Irish players playing for the provinces. The lack of players moving abroad and players like Beirne moving back shows that its working quite well.

errlloyd

Would it be fair to say that other than Sexy, Keatley and Carbery none of those backs are particularly good at passing the ball.

I really hope Carbs gets a run at 15, otherwise we're here for Warren Ball.

thomond2006

Banjaxed82 wrote: »

I only have a passing interest in select rugby matches, so pardon my ignorance, but why does Zebo moving to France affect his Ireland place?

Unless your name is Jonathan Sexton, you don't get picked by Ireland unless you are playing in Ireland.

Buer

thomond2006 wrote: »

No, I mean pick him until the RWC. I think he's good enough to be picked while in France. When you look at the other options selected he comfortably starts in Ireland's back three.

Nah, that would be madness. Any player who is a starter for Ireland would consider rolling the dice and moving then.

Zebo was a guaranteed starter for Ireland at this stage but he wasn't indispensible especially with the form of guys like Earls and Stockdale along with lads like Carbery, Kearney and TOH all having played 15 for Ireland in the past year.

awec

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Back 3: Byrne, Conway, Earls, Kearney, Kearney, Stockdale, Sweetnam

Earls, Stockdale and Kearney for the bigger fixtures I presume.

Not much choice at full back really, I presume it's whatever Kearney is fit.

Utopia Parkway

Not really sure how TOH doesn't make that squad. Especially with Zebo now excommunicated. TOH has been really good for quite a while now.