PeterTheNinth wrote: But I think this is where the disconnect is... I think there is a huge difference with the opinions that are expressed on liberal radio stations, and the opinions that are expressed around the average dinner table. In a similar way to the way there was a huge disconnect between the liberal media in the US and the actual voters. The media here is no longer a balanced representation of the views of the average Irish people. There is only one view welcome in the media, and if you don't subscribe to those views then you will be immediately vilified and there will be Twitter campaigns, Facebook campaigns, bullying through whatever means they have available to him.
SafeSurfer wrote: 99% of the population has had a one night stand? What a ridiculous statement. There are roughly 3.5 million over 17s in Ireland. So only 1%, 35,000 people have never had a one night stand according to you. I find that difficult to believe.
I'm beginning to think that yesterdays' apology has backfired spectacularly on him, he would have been better off if he had clarified his remarks, making it 100% clear that rape is never the victims' fault and that his original intention was merely to encourage people to look out for themselves and their friends on a night out. I would say 85% of what he said was just old fashioned common sense, the stuff that lots of parents would say to their daughters and sons most weekends before they head into town.
Pat Kenny – “ The involvement of alcohol, 302 of the cohort or over 47% of people had consumed about four units, one unit being a glass of beer so four units is the equivalent of two pints of beer or four glasses of wine. When you ask them about how much they have had to drink how do they react?".Dr. Eogan – “I suppose that has always been something that has concerned us a little bit because internationally and nationally we know that survivors of sexual crime and perpetrators of sexual crime are very likely to have consumed alcohol and traditionally we haven’t really focused on that, we have sort of said, we won’t talk about that because that is victim blaming and victim shaming”. Dr Eogan went on to stress that no matter how vulnerable a person is, no matter what they have had to drink or wear they are in no way responsible. She was at pains to stress that nobody in the world deserves to have a sexual crime visited upon them regardless of what they’ve drunk, what they’re wearing, what dark street they’re walking down. She went on to say…. “that it is very important from a public health perspective and a patient safety perspective that when we notice something like this, an association with alcohol, that we highlight it because of health promotion and staying safe. The Rape Crisis Centres do these Stay Safe workshops and you know it’s so important that we highlight that there is an association and just because somebody is drunk does not mean they deserve to have sexual violence visited upon them and from the point of view of the work we do with school students and college students we highlight this link, not to blame anyone but more to give a health promotion/preventative message out there. You need to look after each other, you need to look after yourself. If you have a friend who has drunk an awful lot of alcohol really make sure they get home safe”.For the most part this sounds VERY LIKE what George was trying to say doesn’t it? (i.e Look after yourself when drinking and each other).
Noeleen Blackwell -“There is a knowledge and suspicion that and Dr. Eogan has made it clear that there is sometimes a link between drinking and drugs and rape. And we see the same thing in the Dublin Rape Crisis Centre, our volunteers go down the Rotunda (Sexual Assault Unit) to accompany and support people who are going through the examination down there, the same as other rape crisis centres around the country…. So without a doubt, if somebody has taken drink their capacity to deal with an approach in relation to sex or anything else, their capacity is impaired. We are told it about peoples mobile phones, we are told about it when they go out about physical assaults, the same is true of sexual assaults. For a person, in order to, ahem the risk of harm coming to them in some form or another can be increased by drinking more than they are capable of sensibly drinking and that’s one side of the coin". Again, isn’t this VERY SIMILAR to what George was saying?
Pat – Do you have a sceptical cap that you put on from time to time. It’s great that help and sympathy is offered immediately but am, do you have to be a little careful too that you might be used for nefarious purposes?Dr. Eogan – No, the sexual assault treatment unit would never be sceptical.
optogirl wrote: » I'm not saying that one person or persons has said both of these things at once but we get these conflicting messages all the time.
anna080 wrote: Lady Chatterton I think you need to go over to After Hours (where George is getting a savaging) and repost what you have posted above. It's very enlightening.
chicken foot wrote: » I know you think you're the boss calling people "snowflakes" but it's the equivalent of wearing a Dunce Hat - you're just highlighting the absolute level of your ignorance. G Hook is an absolute knob jockey, his view of women has always been through a sexualised lens, should he be fired? I don't know,..perhaps spend a weekend at the RCC & see for himself. I think people forget the absolute horror of Rape at times. Just imagine someone physically forcing themselves INTO YOU!! Men & Women alike should be able to conjour up the sheer brutality, force and viciousness needed for this to happen. By agreeing with Hook, that you believe women shouldn't go home with a stranger, then you are placing yourself in the position of being a potential rapist too or you plan on never, ever having a one night stand yourself. As for his comments re consent in a relationship, I can't even go there. I don't know any husband/partner who feels he can have sex with his wife whenever he sees fit.
Jorge Andrade wrote: » Wanting a man sacked for simply giving his opinion which wasn't that bad shows the true colours of these nasty individuals.
Lady Chatterton wrote: » I posted this comment yesterday on this thread. Today, I am even more convinced that this witch hunt against George is not only unjust but it’s sinister.Here is why – On July 18th last, Pat Kenny carried a 25-minute item on his radio programme about the number of people presenting at Sexual Assault Units around the country. Noeleen Blackwell, Chief Executive Officer of the DRCC and Dr. Maeve Eogan, Medical Director of the National Sexual Assault Treatment Unit in the Rotunda were invited on to discuss the findings of Rape Crisis Centres Annual Report (based on reports to Rape Crisis Centres in Dublin, Cork, Galway, Mullingar, Letterkenny & Waterford) the report found that nearly one in two people who sought help had drunk at least the equivalent of two pints of beer. Dr. Eogan confirmed that 712 men and women sought help and received care from the sexual Assault units in the country last year. I can’t transcribe the entire interview but I thought the following was very interesting in light of the current controversy. (The full interview can be heard on the Newstalk Website - 18/07/17 - Part 2). Pat then moved on to speak to Noeleen Blackwell, CEO of Dublin Rape Crisis Centre about the report's findings. Noeleen Blackwell went on to reiterate what Dr. Eogan said earlier that rape NEVER being the victim's fault. George’s big mistake and only mistake in view was he should have made it abundantly clear that the victim is never to blame for rape, there was nothing wrong with anything else he said. Dr. Eogan & Noeleen Blackwell had been relaying the same/similar message to the public only six weeks earlier. Pat went on to have a very robust discussion with Noeleen Blackwell on the issue of consent. It well worth listening to. However, I’m wondering if Pat was conducting the interview tomorrow would his line of questioning be the same, I would hope it would be but I’m unsure. For example: He asked Dr. Eogan the following about people who seek help from the Sexual Assault Centres? I honestly believe if he asked that same question in the current climate, people would be calling for his resignation too. I think we will see lots of toned down interviews on radio and TV in the future, journalists and broadcaster will be terrified of experiencing the vile blacklash George is experiencing over a clumsy mistake, it's sad when you see how close he was to the official Rape Crisis Centre/National Sexual Assault Treatment Centre message.
suicide_circus wrote: » How sinister is that?
Jorge Andrade wrote: » I would sack anyone who pulled that petition bullsh1t in my company, it is bullying, pure and simple
Lady Chatterton wrote: » George’s big mistake and only mistake in view was he should have made it abundantly clear that the victim is never to blame for rape,
Is there no blame now to the person who puts themselves in danger?
The Rape of Lucretia wrote: » Its even worse than that. Its wanting a man sacked for either wilfully misunderstanding what he said in order to press the misandry agenda ,or being dim enough to actually misunderstand what he said. Its a kristallnacht moment for Ireland here.
The Rape of Lucretia wrote: » Very sinister indeed. We live in a police state - one policed by The Great Offended.
Chelsea Miniature Somehow wrote: » But this is the issue is it not? Not only did he not make it clear that the victim is never to blame for rape he implied that the victim was to blame: I read that as a rhetorical question. That's where I take issue and I guess where others take issue.
Lady Chatterton wrote: » Exactly, he should have only apologised for that, the rest of his advice was in line with the advice given by the RCC representatives during their 18/07/17 interview with Pat.
Lady Chatterton wrote: » As for the second post you quoted, it's not mine so I've no comment to make on it.
ballsymchugh wrote: » I bring news of great joy:https://twitter.com/solidarityie/status/907663502529134592
Bunny Colvin wrote: » Who the fook are those guys?
ballsymchugh wrote: » Brilliant post. I heard the PK interview alright, felt he was questioning whether or not every claim was entirely valid, such as if 2 people hook up while hammered, and then discover the next morning that something may have happened that would not have happened in a completely sober situation, then is it fair to apportion blame?
PeterTheNinth wrote: » That's what always strikes me as contradictory about these groups that represent the right "for women to chose what to do with their bodies". The inference always seems to be the women were chaste virgins that were somehow cajoled or deceived and left pregnant by some Pat Mustard type (b*stard) man. It a lot easier to blame the man than and accept that women like sex too, and in many cases are at least equally responsible for the decision to have sex.
chicken foot wrote: » What? How the hell you construed the whole Repeal the 8th movement into that piece of tripe above is beyond me. The 8th campaign has highlighted rape, incest & fatal foetal abnormalities as extreme cases where abortion is warranted in order to get through to the other side that it's not a decision that is made lightly or in normal circumstances. It NEVER failed to mention the women who need abortions for many other reasons - financial, violent relationships etc. 1200 packets of the abortion pill was intercepted by customs in 2015. Presuming, on the safe side, that the same amount got through, that estimates that 4 women a week are having a medically induced abortion AT HOME. Now, take those odds, spread it over the years and you can guarantee that in a room of 20 women you know, at least 2 will have had abortions. Now, let's take in the poverty levels among lower class,the financial pressure in the middle classes, the housing crises and the statistic that 1 in 4 Irish women have suffered some form of domestic violence and then come back to me....with your "chaste virgin" ****e. Most women have sexual encounters because they want too, both sides know the risks but it's ALWAYS the woman who, literally & figuritively carries the burden. Until you cop on and realise that women are not all out to get you but accept that they carry the higher price for having sex you'll never be able to debate this issue fairly.
Deleted User wrote: » Do you leave money in full view, in the car?
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