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Agriculture - overpriced?

fuisce2

Hi! lovely to meet you guys. i've a riddle for ye. ALL help much appreciated.

RIGHT, to the brief!
- there's 2 acres for sale, asking price 190.000, on the market over a year now, Co.Kildare
-he wont sell it subject to pp, (aka we buy it and dont get pp, tough!)
- owner has tried (multiple times) to get pp and been rejected becasue he doesnt satisfy the auld local needs

- hubbie and i BOTH satisfy that need (easy tiger)

our conundrum is
- we'd have to sell our house to buy the land
- (obviously) there's no guarantee even then that we'd get pp

my question is about the asking price. My dad is certain (after convo with planning guy in a different area) that agricultural land, without pp, is only worth about 10k per acre! So dad reckons he's trying to sell it at the price of a site when it's hasnt even got outline pp. in other words, if we buy it as is we're overpaying by <maths>...lots!

Can the owner even get outline pp without satisfying local needs? The estate agent told me he'd in no hurry to sell (as he was fairly certain land would wait until we get house sold-we've done nothing about that yet dont worry!) so maybe he's just waiting until someone risks it?

Any help much appreciated lads, I'm going around in circles. oh and i've spoken to two different planning consultants who were both cautiously optomistic but we're waiting to hear back from them. thanks in advance

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tabby aspreme

The fact you already own a house, even if you sell it, will make it more difficult to get planning, have you already got planning in kildare for the house you live in, is the house you live in close to the site. I don't think kildare Co Co will give a farmer outline planning for a site.

fuisce2

Hey tabby,
thanks for that. No didnt get planning for this one. our current address is spitting distance from both our parents' homes, which in turn are within the 5km limit from the site (required for the local needs aspect). My husband has issues with his knees which are aggravated by stairs (this house has 2 flights) so we need to move to a bungalow basically. all the ones around here (because they take up more land) are way out of our budget (amongst other issues). We dont want to apply based on medical need (he's not an invalid or anything) but it's basically the only reason we're moving. I agree about the council not giving the owner outline pp but he isnt using the land for farming. it's just called 'agricultural'.

BryanF

You own a house. Local needs doesn't apply.

tabby aspreme

Your best option could be to look for a house in need of repair or modernisation , 190 k for a site, add, 40/50k for council levies sewage, water, esb connection and planning / architects fees , before you turn a sod.

Rabbo

You are looking at unzoned land in an area with restrictive local needs planning policy. There is no way that it's worth that money. It's a field at the moment, not a site. Purchasing a field like that on the assumption of gaining planning permission is insanity, there's a reason he isn't offering it subject to getting planning

fuisce2

BryanF wrote: »

You own a house. Local needs doesn't apply.

gosh really? Can i ask if you know something i dont? we wouldnt have a house you see as we'll have to sell it in order to buy the land in the first place... I didnt see that anywhere in the local need criteria

fuisce2

@tabby well we weren't planning on offering the asking price tbh,

but i was more curious if anybody knows what the land is 'vaguely' worth.

@ Rabbo: thanks

Rabbo

fuisce2 wrote: »

@tabby well we weren't planning on offering the asking price tbh, but i was more curious if anybody knows what the land is 'vaguely' worth.

@ Rabbo: thanks

€10-€15k per acre for good agricultural land!

sydthebeat

Regardless of the local need query... 190k for a site is utterly ridiculous.

Its meaningless really whether it's a 1 or 2 acre site, and most definitely the second acre is not worth twice the first one.

Its no wonder it hasn't sold yet, and it definitely should not be sold unless it subject to planning the fact that he's not willing to do this tells me that he is in no real need to sell it so he can sit on it.

My advice, go meet the planner and try to ascertain whether you can comply with local need requirements.... And after that try to seek out a suitable site.

And to answer your question, no, outline generally isn't given in an area where local need applies.

Metric Tensor

I know sites that went for well up in the hundreds in the "mad" times. They a had planning in place though.

If you already have a house in the area then in the normal course of things you don't need a house so local need doesn't apply. Of course mitigating medical circumstances may change that a bit.

tabby aspreme

1acre site with ruin and no services sold for 85k recently , would have made 115k in 05/06 , south kildare

BryanF

BryanF wrote: »

You own a house. Local needs doesn't apply.

fuisce2 wrote: »

gosh really? Can i ask if you know something i dont? we wouldnt have a house you see as we'll have to sell it in order to buy the land in the first place... I didnt see that anywhere in the local need criteria

fuisce2

Thanks everyone. We'll look into it more.