nav[aria-label="Primary Navigation"] { padding: 0; & ul { list-style: none; width: 100%; display: flex; flex-direction: row; justify-content: start; align-items: start; gap: 30px; padding: 0; & li { margin: 0; } & ul li { list-style: none; } } }

Child Item

Isn't multiculturalism great...

[Deleted User]

...today I brought my daughter to the playground to meet Slovakian friends with their kids. Also met my cousin and his African partner and their little daughter. After that, I went to my Turkish Muslim barber and to her delight he produced a lollipop.

And I thought, she'll grow up experiencing diversity and cultures that I could only dream of when I was a child in white Catholic Ireland in the late '70s and '80s. And it felt good.

Find more posts tagged with

Quick Links

Comments

CalamariFritti

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Maybe I'm nit picking but I'm not sure I'd want them to totally integrate with Irish society. Bringing some of their customs with me is important too.
We have brought our drunkenness and foul language with us throughout the world. That's me trying to be funny but I believe ice hockey was an Irish invention. Started as hurling on ice skates in Canada. We bring or have brought our song & dance and we brought our religion with us wherever we went.
I'd hate to see these emigrants in 50 years time just looking like different colours of ourselves. I'd like to think that they will leave their mark in Ireland in some small ways.

Possible and likely enough; most sources say origins are not fully known, but most likely just field hockey transferred to ice. But then hurling isn't that far from field hockey either.

Ice hockey is some game though. Both to play and to watch. Its taking 'the fastest field game in the world' to a whole new level.

FraR

Here's a synopsis of a study from Robert Putnam, a political scientest and Professor at Harvard, titled Diversity and trust within communities;

In recent years, Putnam has been engaged in a comprehensive study of the relationship between trust within communities and their ethnic diversity. His conclusion based on over 40 cases and 30 000 people within the United States is that, other things being equal, more diversity in a community is associated with less trust both between and within ethnic groups. Although limited to American data, it puts into question both the contact hypothesis and conflict theory in inter-ethnic relations. According to conflict theory, distrust between the ethnic groups will rise with diversity, but not within a group. In contrast, contact theory proposes that distrust will decline as members of different ethnic groups get to know and interact with each other. Putnam describes people of all races, sex, socioeconomic statuses, and ages as "hunkering down," avoiding engagement with their local community—both among different ethnic groups and within their own ethnic group. Even when controlling for income inequality and crime rates, two factors which conflict theory states should be the prime causal factors in declining inter-ethnic group trust, more diversity is still associated with less communal trust.

Lowered trust in areas with high diversity is also associated with:

Lower confidence in local government, local leaders and the local news media.

Lower political efficacy – that is, confidence in one's own influence.Lower frequency of registering to vote, but more interest and knowledge about politics and more participation in protest marches and social reform groups.

Higher political advocacy, but lower expectations that it will bring about a desirable result.
Less expectation that others will cooperate to solve dilemmas of collective action (e.g., voluntary conservation to ease a water or energy shortage).

Less likelihood of working on a community project.

Less likelihood of giving to charity or volunteering.

Fewer close friends and confidants.

Less happiness and lower perceived quality of life.

More time spent watching television and more agreement that "television is my most important form of entertainment".

Putnam published his data set from this study in 2001[4][5] and subsequently published the full paper in 2007.[6]

He definitely can't accused of being biased;

Putnam has been criticized for the lag between his initial study and his publication of his article. In 2006, Putnam was quoted in the Financial Times as saying he had delayed publishing the article until he could "develop proposals to compensate for the negative effects of diversity" (quote from John Lloyd of Financial Times)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_D._Putnam#Diversity_and_trust_within_communities

Irish Guitarist

I like to wear this while hanging my head in shame

ra,triblend_tee,x3104,red_triblend,front-c,665,630,750,1000-bg,f8f8f8.lite-1.jpg

One eyed Jack

Samaris wrote: »

You going to be okay getting back from the Isle of Conclusions? You're nearly beyond leaping point.

Are you basing this on what you do or what? You know nothing about the person you're insulting, bar that apparently he's friendly with his Muslim barber, so where you pulled this lot from is a bit of a mystery. It's a dickish way to behave though.

I don't think it's right at all to throw personal abuse Conor for what I figured was a low-level, wind-up thread. As bemused as you are, I was bemused by Conor's relating a day out with his daughter as if he'd taken her to the zoo, I could just imagine - "And look sweetie, there's the brown man with a lollipop for you, isn't he lovely? Let's go see what our African and Slovakian friends are up to today", and then the inclusion of the "white Catholic Ireland" was the cherry on top of the "WTF??" cake.

I just didn't get it? I know Conor is from Kerry, but jesus they're not even that backwards down there, in spite of all the Kerryman jokes! Conor I'd imagine is well-educated and well-travelled, I've no doubt his daughter will be too, which makes the whole "Isn't multiculturalism great?" line a bit like something that reminds me of the patronising Disney twee of D'Arby O' Gill and the little people.

I'm not reading too much into it, I'm just saying that's the impression I got, and I just thought "Kerry people aren't that ignorant! I can't tell is this post for real or a wind-up!" That's all.

Bemused, as you said, confused even, but angry? That's a stretch.

dav3

Look what you've done OP, you've got the usual suspect all riled up.

You're going to have to make another thread to keep them happy now. Something about dark skinned people coming to kill us all, or how inferior the unemployed, working class and travellers are should do it.

[Deleted User]

CalamariFritti wrote:

Possible and likely enough; most sources say origins are not fully known, but most likely just field hockey transferred to ice. But then hurling isn't that far from field hockey either.

Feck that I'm claiming it as one of the great things that the Irish gave to the world. It's up to the Canadians to prove me wrong.

CalamariFritti wrote:

Ice hockey is some game though. Both to play and to watch. Its taking 'the fastest field game in the world' to a whole new level.

[Deleted User]

The "I Hate White People" T-Shirt is ok but you need to apologise for being white too. Check out this father and son. Maybe it could even be father and daughter too!

PistolsAtDawn

marcus001 wrote: »

Seeing foreign people gives Conor a fussy feeling in his goolies.

Ha, ha, ha, top comment :-)

PistolsAtDawn

I'm a white man and proud of it. Any white people here consider that wrong?

smurgen

dav3 wrote: »

Look what you've done OP, you've got the usual suspect all riled up.

You're going to have to make another thread to keep them happy now. Something about dark skinned people coming to kill us all, or how inferior the unemployed, working class and travellers are should do it.

Wait til we're more muticultural and he starts days baiting migrants and starts lamenting old ireland.Some people are never happy

[Deleted User]

PistolsAtDawn wrote: »

I'm a white man and proud of it. Any white people here consider that wrong?

Interesting. I was watching a countdown of best UFC stars of all time and Cain Velasquez (a Mexican guy) had a massive tattoo saying BROWN PRIDE across his chest. I wonder would a white chap get away with having a WHITE PRIDE one emblazoned on him.

FTA69

Omackeral wrote: »

Interesting. I was watching a countdown of best UFC stars of all time and Cain Velasquez (a Mexican guy) had a massive tattoo saying BROWN PRIDE across his chest. I wonder would a white chap get away with having a WHITE PRIDE one emblazoned on him.

In fairness the two have very different connotations now don't they? The term White Pride and White Power etc are used exclusively by neo-Nazis and denote things like white supremacy, racism and the subjugation of non-whites in the USA.

Things like Black Pride and the Black Power movement were generally rooted in a response to racism and oppression, and a system which espoused that black and Latino people were inferior in every way. They were generally progressive concepts and not at all rooted in structural discrimination.

You can't compare the two.

iDave

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Omackeral wrote: »

Interesting. I was watching a countdown of best UFC stars of all time and Cain Velasquez (a Mexican guy) had a massive tattoo saying BROWN PRIDE across his chest. I wonder would a white chap get away with having a WHITE PRIDE one emblazoned on him.

Could play it safe and get Irish Pride, if anyone takes offence you could just say you really like bread.

White or brown bread though?

[Deleted User]

iDave wrote: »

White or brown bread

White or dead? That's a bit strong.

Benjamin Buttons

Well done Conor74, a lovely bit of weekend fishing, personally I thought the bait was a little obvious, but never underestimate the anger of these snap-eyed bores. They came in alright, no bother, and you caught a couple of biggies too!
Nice one.

Widdershins

Good thing we're not basing our opinions on multiculturalism on one incident with the barber. Oh, sorry, the ''Muslim Turkish barber''.
Turkish barber turned away a gay couple and a young boy with a disability when they came into his shop to get their hair cut.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/barber-refused-haircuts-to-gay-couple-and-young-boy-with-disability-34789335.html

[Deleted User]

Widdershins wrote: »

Good thing we're not basing our opinions on multiculturalism on one incident with the barber. Oh, sorry, the ''Muslim Turkish barber''.
Turkish barber turned away a gay couple and a young boy with a disability when they came into his shop to get their hair cut.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/barber-refused-haircuts-to-gay-couple-and-young-boy-with-disability-34789335.html

Yeah but he gives out lollipops!

Wailin

Great thread OP....looking for reactions and getting them in droves. Bet you have a nice smug grin on your face;).

Give yerself a good aul pat on the back....you deserve it:rolleyes:

bananabread12

Culture is not just a cross-border concept, it's a cross class issue too....

There are groups within Ireland that have absolutely no understanding or appreciation of private property, nor do they share your values on anything else. Respecting the property of others is something that comes from a thorough education and family values.

I couldn't care less whether someone was black, blue, pink or yellow, gay, straight or anything in-between, male, female, or anything in-between, so long as they're not an uneducated, unsophisticated, thieving little dragged-up Irish scrote. I'd favour shipping out of the lower classes and replacing them with foreign people that actually have something to offer our society as opposed to being a net drain on our resources.

[Deleted User]

Widdershins wrote:

Good thing we're not basing our opinions on multiculturalism on one incident with the barber.

It's very possible they we refused for being gay but I'd suggest that the one not getting the hair cut Yet giving the orders might just have peed off the barber. Then I read further down and how he treated the kid & see he's just a dick

WinnyThePoo

Wailin wrote: »

Great thread OP....looking for reactions and getting them in droves. Bet you have a nice smug grin on your face;).

Give yerself a good aul pat on the back....you deserve it:rolleyes:

Who shat in your cornflakes?

Benjamin Buttons

Widdershins wrote: »

Good thing we're not basing our opinions on multiculturalism on one incident with the barber. Oh, sorry, the ''Muslim Turkish barber''.
Turkish barber turned away a gay couple and a young boy with a disability when they came into his shop to get their hair cut.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/barber-refused-haircuts-to-gay-couple-and-young-boy-with-disability-34789335.html

Even in the most far-flung corners of the world gay people are discriminated against, and not just by Muslims either.

http://www.thejournal.ie/gay-cake-supreme-3383363-May2017/

[Deleted User]

FTA69 wrote: »

In fairness the two have very different connotations now don't they? The term White Pride and White Power etc are used exclusively by neo-Nazis and denote things like white supremacy, racism and the subjugation of non-whites in the USA.

Things like Black Pride and the Black Power movement were generally rooted in a response to racism and oppression, and a system which espoused that black and Latino people were inferior in every way. They were generally progressive concepts and not at all rooted in structural discrimination.

You can't compare the two.

Only because in the case of White Pride, no development of thought is allowed. For White pride, forever and ever more, it's associated with the evils of discrimination and racism...

However use any other colour and the oportunity exists for it to develop to represent something else.

Your logic encourages the idea that White Pride should always be a bad thing.. You mentioned the Black pride movements of the 70s as being progressive, and yet, many of them were militant and excessive in their behavior. But, that's acceptable because they were fighting social injustice. That's convenient.

Widdershins

Benjamin Buttons wrote: »

Even in the most far-flung corners of the world gay people are discriminated against, and not just by Muslims either.

http://www.thejournal.ie/gay-cake-supreme-3383363-May2017/

Does it end up in court in Erdogan's Islamic Turkey? No. It doesn't. It's far worse than refusing to cut their hair in Turkey, as it is in Islamic places generally. This is common knowledge.
If Conor74 wants multiculturalism to encompass Turkish Muslims maybe he should familiarise himself with the prevailing culture of Turkey as it is today for a better idea of what is predominant there. He's not talking about individuals here but of cultures. Lollipops for children are almost customary in barbershops here and fair play to his barber for picking up the custom.

gw80

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Diversity within culture is a good thing. Different cultures existing separately largely independent of each other is not a good thing. The OP mention people from quite different places and these will interact with him and with each other through the medium of a common Irish culture. If immigrant groups reach a critical mass where they no longer have to interact in an "Irish" way but rather according to the customs of another place then there is a problem.

I don't know Charles, I think Europe was an example of different cultures living side by side and getting on reasonable well, but it wasn't easy even with our common traits and historic and prehistoric ties we were at each others throats for thousands of years, but there was also integration and cooperation, but not until the last 70 years or so have we learned to live with each other properly,
And we were doing quiet well, in regards to human rights, technology, quality of life, intergration, and so forth while still keeping our sense of nationality,
But then some higher powers decided to open the floodgates to culture's and countries very different to our own and very quickly (around 2015) we have seen that hard earned unity and peace start to crack, like bexit and some of the eastern block starting to second quess their ( very recent) inclusion into the eu, for example,
I think its just too much too soon and too quickly,

gw80

bananabread12 wrote: »

Culture is not just a cross-border concept, it's a cross class issue too....

There are groups within Ireland that have absolutely no understanding or appreciation of private property, nor do they share your values on anything else. Respecting the property of others is something that comes from a thorough education and family values.

I couldn't care less whether someone was black, blue, pink or yellow, gay, straight or anything in-between, male, female, or anything in-between, so long as they're not an uneducated, unsophisticated, thieving little dragged-up Irish scrote. I'd favour shipping out of the lower classes and replacing them with foreign people that actually have something to offer our society as opposed to being a net drain on our resources.

The problem is, thats exactly what is happening to Europe, we are getting the uneducated, unsophisticated, thieving little dragged up scrotes from the third world.

fryup

Wibbs wrote: »

I've rarely seen a more smug self satisfied expression of right on progressive piety on Boards. And that can be a high enough bar at times. I liked the self doubt around being "white", "Catholic" and "Irish" too. As if all three or one is somehow lesser(white gets the lower case for effect). Well done. *slow handclap(trap)* Bonus points. To her delight he produced a lollipop eh? Seem to have covered all the bases there. Though for future efforts, maybe throw in some Gay folks? Though ask them first. And rainbows. Rainbows are good.

no need to poo poo on the OP's thread,

the OP was making a valid observation on how mush irish society has changed for the better thanks in no small part to multiculturalism

now i don't know what age you are but those of us of a certain generation (40+ ) can really appreciate how much ireland has changed from the dark negative dismal kip it use to be and multiculturalism has played a significant part in that..as well as the celtic tiger, and i applaud it

Malayalam

fryup wrote: »

no need to poo poo on the OP's thread,

the OP was making a valid observation on how mush irish society has changed for the better thanks in no small part to multiculturalism

now i don't know what age you are but those of us of a certain generation (40+ ) can really appreciate how much ireland has changed from the dark negative dismal kip it use to be and multiculturalism has played a significant part in that..as well as the celtic tiger, and i applaud it

I'm not so certain that multiculturalism has played a ''significant'' part in any change in Ireland, given that we are essentially not all that multicultural at all yet...we are still fairly homogenous, being ethnically more than 85% Irish, and most of the rest being from European backgrounds with similar religious histories...

Irish (including dual-Irish/other): 86.9%, UK: 2.5%, Other EU 27: 6.1%, Other Europe: 0.7%, Asia: 1.5%, Africa: 0.9%, USA: 0.2%, Other countries: 0.5%, Multiple nationality: 0.1%, Not stated: 1.2% (2011) -
Wikipedia

I'd say we changed because one, change is inevitable, two, we got out from under the rule of the Church and became more secular, three, we got a few more bob, and started traveling (as opposed to migrating) and four, well...I don't think it was entirely such a 'dark negative dismal kip' before, there was lots of ordinary good things going on.

fryup

Malayalam wrote: »

..I don't think it was entirely such a 'dark negative dismal kip' before, there was lots of ordinary good things going on.

you obviously didn't grow up in the midlands

Malayalam

fryup wrote: »

you obviously didn't grow up in the midlands

I did

Right in the middle. I guess I was / am easily amused!