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Why do so many people insist that teachers get long paid holidays

c68zapdsm5i1ru

They don't. They are paid for the hours they work, and that pay is calculated pro rata across the year. They would be paid the same overall amount, even if they were left without pay cheques all Summer. They would just get larger pay cheques during term time.

I'm not a teacher, or related to any teachers. But I'm sick of hearing this argument every year by people convinced teachers are getting paid to sit around all Summer doing nothing.

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_Roz_

endacl wrote: »

Further ed. I've never had to stand in front of a roomful of kids.

That might be an idea, I do have experience of training adults. Does that pay the same though? Is this things like QQI tutoring?

Martina1991

Mickeroo wrote: »

I guess the long paid holidays is the main reason I always assumed they had long paid holidays.

Don't forget mid terms, Xmas and Easter :pac:

The Backwards Man

My Dad's harder than your Dad.

duffman13

Benjamin Buttons wrote: »

The average salary of a primary school teacher in Ireland is: €30,184 per year.
The average salary of a TD in Ireland is : €87,258 per year.

I wonder which of the above is overpaid?

Tbh I'd rather TDs paid a really good salary to attract the best calibre of candidates. Unfortunately that doesn't always happen (calibre of candidates) but they're essentially public figures who have to govern the country so 90k a year for some of the abuse some of them have to put up with is fair enough to me.

Its an issue in a of lot state/semi state bodies who struggle to attract and keep the best talent as the top echelons because they can't match the salary available in the private sector for the very best people.

The problem with the country is in administration of public services rather than front line staff (teachers, garda, nurses etc), there has never been a will to tackle this and I don't think there ever will be.

endacl

_Roz_ wrote: »

That might be an idea, I do have experience of training adults. Does that pay the same though? Is this things like QQI tutoring?

Pays secondary teacher scale.

whisky_galore

People whinge about teachers, guards and farmers and I'll bet they wouldn't last a week in any of those jobs.

seamus

They do get long paid holidays. That's indisputable.

By the same argument, I get an 11-month salary, calculated pro-rata and spread out over 12 months.

No, teachers get a yearly salary which include long and generous holidays.

I have no actual issue with this. But claiming that they only get paid for the weeks they work, and that this is then s t r e t c h e d out to cover the whole year, is disingenuous. All salaried workers could make the same claim.

It's union nonsense, playing the poor mouth where none exists.

I personally think teachers should be paid more, in return for higher qualifications. All new teachers should have a masters at a minimum, having completed six years in college. Like in Finland. Existing teachers can then earn their way onto the higher payscale by upgrading their qualifications.

endacl

Deleted User wrote: »

Anyone ever heard of a teacher having her baby in May? Anyone? Anyone?

Why would they? I don't know you. But I'm pretty sure if you could time a life event to take full advantage of paid leave from your job, you would.

thierry14

_Roz_ wrote: »

I'm starting to want to become a teacher after reading all this.... but I'm not a fan of kids, so not sure how that would work. :rolleyes:

Teaching kids all day, everyday would be hell

Must get boring very fast too, especially secondary, repeating the same stuff over and over

Would hate to be a teacher

Oasis1974

whisky_galore wrote: »

People whinge about teachers, guards and farmers and I'll bet they wouldn't last a week in any of those jobs.

Why bring farmers into this they have no education at all there kids won't be school in the first place.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

griffin100

Teaching is a job with good pay and conditions, but it's essentially part time. €30-40k pa for p/t work is not bad. Based on CSO figures highest hourly pay rate in the public sector is in education - http://www.cso.ie/px/pxeirestat/Statire/SelectVarVal/Define.asp?Maintable=EHQ10&Planguage=0

It always make me laugh when teaching unions moan about having to work an extra 'unpaid' hour or two a week.

_Roz_

thierry14 wrote: »

Teaching kids all day, everyday would be hell

Must get boring very fast too, especially secondary, repeating the same stuff over and over

Would hate to be a teacher

Yeah this is true. I'd like to have two months a year off, but really, I'm better off working the full year and never interacting with any humans outside my department peeps.

pickarooney

_Roz_ wrote: »

I'm starting to want to become a teacher after reading all this.... but I'm not a fan of kids, so not sure how that would work. :rolleyes:

Become a college lecturer? Adult education?

endacl

seamus wrote: »

They do get long paid holidays. That's indisputable.

By the same argument, I get an 11-month salary, calculated pro-rata and spread out over 12 months.

No, teachers get a yearly salary which include long and generous holidays.

I have no actual issue with this. But claiming that they only get paid for the weeks they work, and that this is then s t r e t c h e d out to cover the whole year, is disingenuous. All salaried workers could make the same claim.

It's union nonsense, playing the poor mouth where none exists.

I personally think teachers should be paid more, in return for higher qualifications. All new teachers should have a masters at a minimum, having completed six years in college. Like in Finland. Existing teachers can then earn their way onto the higher payscale by upgrading their qualifications.

As I mentioned earlier, while not de facto the case today, historically, it is true. If it weren't, and we were entitled to statutory leave based on hours worked, how would that work? What would happen if every teacher in the school were taking two weeks during the school year?

Edit: We are paid more based on qualifications. I receive almost €5000 extra per year, because some years ago I completed a MSc. In a completely different field, that has nothing whatsoever to do with the subjects I teach...

kylith

Mark Rough Silk wrote: »

Yes, but they're not paid for it. The holidays are a necessary part of the job, because the children need time off. The teachers' salary reflects that and they are only paid for the time they work.

Let's say a teacher gets €35K a year, including 2 month's holiday.

Let's say I also get €35K a year, and 20 days holiday.

A teacher gets 3 times as many holiday days for the same wage. Therefore a teacher gets longer paid holidays than other professions.

Lux23

I think the only perk in a teaching job is the holidays. The pay isn't great for having to deal with snotty brats all day.

Austria!

Benjamin Buttons wrote: »

The average salary of a primary school teacher in Ireland is: €30,184 per year.

http://www.into.ie/pay/PayScales/

SteM

Mark Rough Silk wrote: »

Yes, but they're not paid for it. The holidays are a necessary part of the job, because the children need time off. The teachers' salary reflects that and they are only paid for the time they work.

Children do not need 3 months off for summer believe me. Along with the time off over Halloween, Christmas and Easter 3 summer months is overkill. Any working parent (that doesn’t get 3 months summer holidays) will tell you that.

endacl

Lux23 wrote: »

I think the only perk in a teaching job is the holidays. The pay isn't great for having to deal with snotty brats all day.

It's certainly not the only perk. The most I have to work in any one day is less than five hours, and I'll have a kickass pension when I retire.

seamus

endacl wrote: »

As I mentioned earlier, while not de facto the case today, historically, it is true. If it weren't, and we were entitled to statutory leave based on hours worked, how would that work? What would happen if every teacher in the school were taking two weeks during the school year?

Well you actually are entitled to statutory leave. That leave is given during the holidays because the legislation states that the employer decides when statutory leave is taken, not the employee.

The legislation has changed a lot since the 1950's. Beyond recognition in fact. Which is why it's disingenuous to claim that a change to the remuneration scheme made in the 1950s is in any way relevant to the teachers today, none of whom were even teaching when the change was made.
Any teachers hired in the last 40 years have been paid a yearly salary with long holidays.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

pickarooney wrote: »

Because everyone who has any sense looks at annual salary and annual holidays rather than trying to refute basic logic with this sort of convoluted nonsense?

Wow you're rude. Their annual salary reflects the days they work and the responsibility and skill involved in their job. There is nothing illogical or convoluted about that argument.

endacl

seamus wrote: »

Well you actually are entitled to statutory leave. That leave is given during the holidays because the legislation states that the employer decides when statutory leave is taken, not the employee.

Hey I'm not arguing with you. I have the best paid part time gig in the world!

bucketybuck

Mark Rough Silk wrote: »

Yes, but they're not paid for it. The holidays are a necessary part of the job, because the children need time off. The teachers' salary reflects that and they are only paid for the time they work.

They are paid for it.

My flatmate gets a salary.
I get a salary.

You are going on about when their pay slip goes into their bank as if that changes anything. It doesn't. Teachers get a salary and they get to have the summer months off work, thats just how it is.

If the teacher wasn't guaranteed further work when the summer ended your point might be relevant but for most that isn't the case, they have their salary and they have their job again in September, they can enjoy their holidays with financial security.

Benjamin Buttons

Pure tashte wrote: »

Is that the starting salary? Surely the average salary for all teachers would be far higher than that?

I got the figures from the interweb.
Just 'Google' 'Annual average salary for primary school teachers in Ireland'

I don't envy teachers one bit or begrudge them their summer break.
The vast majority of them work really hard and are very caring and attentive to their pupils needs - and that's psychologically as well as academically.
Imo they deserve every penny, it's a huge responsibility.
TDs however....

The Backwards Man

Open the schools year round, weekends, bank holidays and all. Three or four modules for each year. Teachers can take holidays like everybody else and get no extra for unsocial hours like all other salaried workers. Kids can go to school at a time that suits their parents rather than have to pussy foot around teachers' whims. Classroom sizes shrink. Lollipop ladies get more work. Less broken windows at Easter and Christmas.

Everybody's happy.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Yes, and for that reason their salary for the other nine months of the year is smaller than if they only received a pay cheque during the months they actually work.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

osarusan

They get paid a yearly salary for the work they do.

They are just one of the numerous jobs that don't follow a 48-weeks-a-year pattern.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.