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Sexism you have personally experienced or have heard of? READ POST 1

Chemical Burn

SEXISM MEN HAVE EXPERIENCED

Inspired by the thread I saw in the Ladies' Lounge, about Sexism they apparently experience from day to day life, I thought I might start a thread about sexism that us gentlmen experience apart from the others in the LL.
So Gentlemen of GC, what sexism discrimination do you experience?

Please NO AH-type responses or attacking the OP or thread ...

I was told by a driving instructor (back in the day) that I would have a lesser chance of passing the test because of how I looked and because I was a man (instructor was female). This was 11 years ago.

I was in college queuing up to use a photocopyer / printer and it was faulty, and I had to page the maintenance guy. Even though I was first in the queue, he pushed me aside and told me to " let the "ladies" go ahead of me ", when the machine was back up and running again. This was 10 years ago.

MOD NOTE! ** READ THIS **
I'm going to make this completely crystal clear, for the benefit of all.

This is a thread for men to post their experiences of sexism that they believe they have experienced. Discussion in this thread is welcome, from both men and women - so long as it goes with the ethos of the thread. Addition - this thread will also encompass general sexism against men.

The following is no longer to take place in this thread:

- Discussion of which sex has it worse
- Arguing about what is, or isn't sexism in your view

This is the Gentlemen's Club forum. This forum will always have a male leaning ethos. Men do not have to defend their experiences in this thread to anyone.

We will start banning people who continue to derail this thread.

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Comments

Kidchameleon

Jesus Christ I don't know how I'd feel if I saw a sign like that, its unbelievable.

silverharp

what the fckidyfck!

Harry‏ @Harrybfc1889 · 8h8 hours ago

 More

@Sargon_of_Akkad this is what I was "taught" in English revision today. Indoctrination.

H3llR4iser

gizmo555 wrote: »

The Guardian reports today (June 8) that Madrid's Municipal Transport Authority is posting signs to discourage "manspreading". Like "mansplaining" it seems to me this is yet another way of attacking men just for being men. I have never in my life heard anyone mention or comment on this alleged problem outside of the media. And, in the spirit of equality, why aren't there signs to discourage women from spreading their handbags and shopping all over bus & train seats?

EDIT - it comes as no surprise to read on the Madrid Transport Authority website that these signs are being introduced at the request of a "feminist collective"

http://www.emtmadrid.es/Noticias/EMT-amplia-su-senalizacion-a-bordo-del-autobus-par.aspx

These ultra-extremist idiot have always been around, but what really baffles is the consideration and attention they're getting over the last 5 years or so. I can't for the life of me understand why this is happening - there has to be some MAJOR economical / financial / political reason behind it, no movement or idea reaches that much influence without any of the above.

I heard this thing on the radio this morning, where it was reported with some sort of badly hidden statisfaction (4FM). Yep, sure, being a total d1ck and taking two seats isn't ideal, but (to begin with) it's not just men doing that; but the campaign specifically targets "sitting with your legs open" and affixes it to men - as if, say, sitting with an enourmous bag on your side wasn't an issue.

But the icing on the cake is the fact that "manspreading" has been defined as "sexually abusive"...so we're at a point where a random guy, sitting on a train minding his business/reading the paper/watching Champions League highlights on the phone or whatever, is sexually assaulting someone.
Also, if there happen to be two other guys by his side, is everything ok?

red ears

H3llR4iser wrote: »

These ultra-extremist idiot have always been around, but what really baffles is the consideration and attention they're getting over the last 5 years or so. I can't for the life of me understand why this is happening - there has to be some MAJOR economical / financial / political reason behind it, no movement or idea reaches that much influence without any of the above.

I heard this thing on the radio this morning, where it was reported with some sort of badly hidden statisfaction (4FM). Yep, sure, being a total d1ck and taking two seats isn't ideal, but (to begin with) it's not just men doing that; but the campaign specifically targets "sitting with your legs open" and affixes it to men - as if, say, sitting with an enourmous bag on your side wasn't an issue.

But the icing on the cake is the fact that "manspreading" has been defined as "sexually abusive"...so we're at a point where a random guy, sitting on a train minding his business/reading the paper/watching Champions League highlights on the phone or whatever, is sexually assaulting someone.
Also, if there happen to be two other guys by his side, is everything ok?

And this sort of unfairness is possible because men don't have any advocacy groups speaking out against it. We are told we don't need them and to complain means we are misogynist. Where is this going to stop?

iptba

silverharp wrote: »

what the fckidyfck!

ashleigh graham.‏

I'm pretty sure Lady Macbeth was the main villain, so wait... is that toxic femininity? 👀

Harry‏ @Harrybfc1889 4h4 hours ago

I did put this point across but my teacher responded with "there's no such thing as toxic femininity"

https://twitter.com/ashtweets25/status/873190873667907584

https://twitter.com/Harrybfc1889/status/873191155336441856

Carlos Orange

You don't hear the phrase toxic femininity much because there is a word for it.

iptba

psinno wrote: »

You don't hear the phrase toxic femininity much because there is a word for it.

What word would that be? And would English teachers use it in schools as a way to analyse a piece of (Shakespearean) literature?

silverharp

psinno wrote: »

You don't hear the phrase toxic femininity much because there is a word for it.

feminists

I'd hope their state exams wouldnt ask these questions so the teacher here is just wasting their time. It is funny though younger teenagers are following guys like Sargon and can at least kick back a bit.

H3llR4iser

iptba wrote: »

https://twitter.com/ashtweets25/status/873190873667907584

https://twitter.com/Harrybfc1889/status/873191155336441856

Ah, easy - "toxic masculinity" because the author, William Shakespeare, was a man, and as a man he had the nerve of making a woman the villain of the story - a woman, which as such everybody knows, is only capable of motherly, tender compassion and love. Shakespeare instead brought forward the impossible idea that a woman might actually be capable of a broad spectrum of emotions and behaviours, you know, stuff like revenge, fury, rage, malignancy - that would make her a human being, which I mean...patriarchy! Toxic masculinity!

If it was a lecture, the best thing to do would have been to walk out, really.

iptba

From what I've picked up, quite a lot of 3rd level literature courses can involve feminist analysis of literature.

Though when a man wanted to teach a "men in literature" course (in the US), he faced difficulties:

Springfield College Tries To Oust Professor For Teaching ‘Men In Literature’

The world has more than 900 women's studies programs, and thousands of classes about women in literature. English professor Dennis Gouws tries to teach one 'men in literature' class, and it's one too many.

http://thefederalist.com/2017/03/29/springfield-college-tries-oust-professor-teaching-men-literature/

silverharp

Basically college exams are going to be changed to suit women so there will be "take home " exams and more course work to "balance" things up. we are on the path to that oz dystopian video about the privilege points

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4598036/Saying-genius-brilliant-alienate-female-students.html

Cambridge academics are being discouraged from using terms such as genius, brilliant or flair in feedback for fear of alienating female students.
It is one of a series of moves lecturers say will help women – including changing exams and even removing portraits of men from the library.
Dr Lucy Delap, lecturer in modern British history, said ‘vague talk of genius, brilliance [and] flair carries assumptions of gender inequality’. She said some women ‘don’t find it very easy to project themselves into those categories’.

Dr Delap revealed exams were being overhauled in a bid to tackle a ‘gender differential’ which sees women outshone.
This could mean more coursework, take-home exams, group work or a portfolio of essays.

Sleepy

More groupwork would definitely have suited the women I was in college with. It was usually an excuse to drink coffee at group meetings while letting the smartest person (typically a man due to distribution) do the vast majority of the work.

silverharp

Sleepy wrote: »

More groupwork would definitely have suited the women I was in college with. It was usually an excuse to drink coffee at group meetings while letting the smartest person (typically a man due to distribution) do the vast majority of the work.

hopefully you could pick your groups and have a male only one?

Sleepy

Honestly, for my post-grad we did just that - a group of us who were the best of the class at the individual subjects teamed up to do all the group projects - I did the programming one, a friend did the databases one, another friend did the Systems Analysis one etc.

It wasn't an option for the undergrad and the 4 women I was stuck with for the main group project (worth 5 ECTs at the time) would have had their average scores dragged up by that project.

Now, of course, I knew some exceptionally smart women in college. They were less common, however, than exceptionally smart men. Though, on the other end of the scale, the majority of the utter wasters in the course would have been male.

Pawwed Rig

Sleepy wrote: »

More groupwork would definitely have suited the women I was in college with. It was usually an excuse to drink coffee at group meetings while letting the smartest person (typically a man due to distribution) do the vast majority of the work.

Our college had a group assignment for every module. Generally you choose your own groups and gravitate to people with the same level of motivation as you have (for better or worse). Sometimes you end up with a leech but ime gender played no role as to who was the smartest person in the group.

silverharp

Sleepy wrote: »

Honestly, for my post-grad we did just that - a group of us who were the best of the class at the individual subjects teamed up to do all the group projects - I did the programming one, a friend did the databases one, another friend did the Systems Analysis one etc.

It wasn't an option for the undergrad and the 4 women I was stuck with for the main group project (worth 5 ECTs at the time) would have had their average scores dragged up by that project.

Now, of course, I knew some exceptionally smart women in college. They were less common, however, than exceptionally smart men. Though, on the other end of the scale, the majority of the utter wasters in the course would have been male.

the major takeaway point is that the group work as a principle works against the very top performers . the lecturer in the article was only concerned with the number of 1st degrees awarded even though for all we know the class is 2/3 or 3/4 female.

I remember saying it to my wife because Junior ended up doing more of the work in one or two school group projects and it was this that group work doesn't really exist in the working world. In the real world you have a team leader and subordinates and the trick is to be able to work well in a hierarchy . only in something like a brainstorm do you do group like stuff.

Sleepy

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Our college had a group assignment for every module. Generally you choose your own groups and gravitate to people with the same level of motivation as you have (for better or worse). Sometimes you end up with a leech but ime gender played no role as to who was the smartest person in the group.

It may have had a lot to do with the fact I did Commerce which is a fairly handy degree (less than 17 hours lectures a week). Owing to this, there was a fairly high proportion of girls in my year reading for their MRS rather than their B.Comm.

ligerdub

Society continues to lower its standards to give a leg-up to those who can't or won't put the necessary into getting the job done.

We had a recent situation where there was an increase in the number of female TD's. Vincent Browne (presented by a woman) had an all-female panel for a week. They debated female only issues for the week (which smacked of a missed opportunity to me) and one suggestion, which was unanimously agreed upon, was that government meetings and discussions should be carried out and completed within specific business hours. This would enable women to complete their parenting duties. This irked me for two reasons. 1. If a man had used those exact words he's have been accused of all sorts of stuff relating to "women should be in the home" viewpoints etc, and 2. It's completely unrealistic. You don't change the job to suit the people who are sitting in the seat. The people sitting in the seat adjust to the job that is required.

I'm no expert, but I have done quite a bit of reading on the subject, and what seems to be a common factor in play for those who have a strong tendency to achieve is the area of focus. They hone their skills, they specialise, and they dedicate a lot of time to get to that level. Obviously in the age we live in we have ways to make things a bit more flexible, but we shouldn't do it without good reason.

What we'll end up seeing is a lot more people coming up to mediocrity, and the ones who would have achieved a lot more end up coming down towards mediocre levels themselves.

red ears

silverharp wrote: »

Basically college exams are going to be changed to suit women so there will be "take home " exams and more course work to "balance" things up. we are on the path to that oz dystopian video about the privilege points

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4598036/Saying-genius-brilliant-alienate-female-students.html

It's astonishing, yet more help for women even though they are outperforming men in education. Is there nobody in authority or with influence that is going to do something for boys in education.

KrustyUCC

There is a bake off competition for a charity fundraiser in work

One lad wanted to enter

He got an email from the competition judging panel saying that basically he was wasteing his time as nobody would believe he could make a cake that would win the competition

eviltwin

KrustyUCC wrote: »

There is a bake off competition for a charity fundraiser in work

One lad wanted to enter

He got an email from the competition judging panel saying that basically he was wasteing his time as nobody would believe he could make a cake that would win the competition

Who told him that? That's crazy, men are well established in the baking world now, sure half the contestants ( and one of the judges ) on the bake off show is male.

Tell him to shove that and enter.

KrustyUCC

One of the judges

it really is crazy esp as it actually cost money to enter the competition

He decided he will take the day off, spend it with his family and bake them a cake instead

D0NNELLY

KrustyUCC wrote: »

One of the judges

it really is crazy esp as it actually cost money to enter the competition

He decided he will take the day off, spend it with his family and bake them a cake instead

Reply and cc hr with a gender equality awareness programme link

D0NNELLY

D0NNELLY wrote: »

Reply and cc hr with a gender equality awareness programme link

Though when i tried to find a gender equality programme i came across genderequality.ie

Nothing equal about it!! My tax euros hard at work!

LostinBlanch

A woman who made up rape and sexual assault claims against 15 men, and sent one innocent man to jail for 7 years :eek: is currently on trial in the UK for perjury and perverting the course of justice.

I can't even imagine what kind of perverted thinking leads someone like her to do such things.

Arcade_Tryer

red ears wrote: »

It's astonishing, yet more help for women even though they are outperforming men in education. Is there nobody in authority or with influence that is going to do something for boys in education.

Parents perhaps?

In a lot of these types of discussions concerning education, it's very easy to forget that boys and girls really aren't all that different, just as men and women are not. Changing curriculums or exam structures to help boys or girls is really avoiding the fact that the most significant determinants of how well boys and girls perform in education is the society they grow up in, and parents' influence.

All of this nonsense about how such and such an exam or curriculum structure favours boys over girls, or vice versa, is nonsense, and serves only to skew the issue away from the real issues of societal values toward education, and parents' role in providing early education to children.

iptba

Facebook ad in my feed:

https://www.facebook.com/SmirnoffIreland

Smirnoff
Sponsored

As part of our commitment to double the number of female headliners in electronic music, we are running a series of free DJ & production workshops across Ireland this summer! See the full film & sign up to one of the workshops at www.thisgreedypig.com/MoveTheNeedle #MoveTheNeedle #2XWomenHeadliners

MOVE THE NEEDLE

According to music heavyweights THUMP, females, transgender and non-binary people made up an average of only 17% of headliners in 2016 at electronic music festivals around the world. This percentage is far from gender parity.

On International Women’s Day, Smirnoff launched their “Equalizing Music” campaign with a pledge to double female headliners by 2020. Here in Ireland, Smirnoff has joined forces with the Gash Collective to work together to increase representation of women across all elements of nightlife culture to drive meaningful and lasting change.

Join us across the country this summer to Move the Needle with a series of free workshops. Each workshop will provide an introduction to using CDJs and turntables, beatmatching and Ableton production with leading female Irish producers, DJs and trained teachers. Featuring members of the Gash Collective and other leading figures from the industry, such as ELLLL, Eve, Lolz, Marian Hawkes and Aoife Nic Canna.

I'm guessing Smirnoff don't run similar initiatives for areas where there are fewer men.

silverharp

Im not even going to look up the "Gash Collective"

red ears

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

Parents perhaps?

In a lot of these types of discussions concerning education, it's very easy to forget that boys and girls really aren't all that different, just as men and women are not. Changing curriculums or exam structures to help boys or girls is really avoiding the fact that the most significant determinants of how well boys and girls perform in education is the society they grow up in, and parents' influence.

All of this nonsense about how such and such an exam or curriculum structure favours boys over girls, or vice versa, is nonsense, and serves only to skew the issue away from the real issues of societal values toward education, and parents' role in providing early education to children.

I do agree they have pretty much the same ability which is all the more reason not to have programs and help for one sex and not the other.

Calhoun

iptba wrote: »

Facebook ad in my feed:

https://www.facebook.com/SmirnoffIreland

Smirnoff
Sponsored

I'm guessing Smirnoff don't run similar initiatives for areas where there are fewer men.

I would be more concerned about a cynical cash grab by a drinks company. They are a private company afterall, so if there sending a message out that your not their target demographic that's fine i wouldnt drink it.