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New Proposed Sheep Scheme

paddysdream

Surprised to find no one has mentioned the proposals for the new sheep scheme.Are the returns from sheep so good this year that it's slipped past everyone?

Looking at the options its hard not to feel that the thinking behind this (and many other schemes)is to give to the farmer and make him spend it on products and/or services that benefit the wider agri related industry.Kind of a green money laundering scheme.

Now in fairness the proposed options are not the most onerous but its the thinking behind them rather than the actual options themselves that I find a problem.Are many of these schemes planned to support farmers or, like the farm building grants of the celtic tiger era,mainly to benefit those that farmers buy from?

On an unrelated but similarly depressing theme,many on here finding that lamb thrive and kill out is pretty poor this year?Every single farmer that I have met over the last two months has the same complaint ie lambs not putting on flesh and/or killing out anything from one half to a full kilo under normal given similar live weight too last year.

Thats about my quota of depression for today thank you !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

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Lambman

Got mines not sure now tho they had 2 numbers on it the number off ewes I have and the number I was getting paid for which is about half off my ewes but i only had sheep in my own flock number for 1 off the reference years

Bleating Lamb

Was chatting a neighbour whose Agri Advisor told him that regarding the scheme if you picked the mineral supplementation measure(which a lot of people did).....that it would be this backend around breeding time that would count for it....so he told him to give ewes a cobalt bolus around a month before going with ram this autumn and keep the receipts for it and that would satisfy the measure for 2017.Is that what others understand is the case?

I dose ewes with Vit B12 combi dose a couple of times from Sept on each year.
I wonder would this satisfy the requirements or is the bolus a better and easier once off job?

ganmo

Bleating Lamb wrote: »

Was chatting a neighbour whose Agri Advisor told him that regarding the scheme if you picked the mineral supplementation measure(which a lot of people did).....that it would be this backend around breeding time that would count for it....so he told him to give ewes a cobalt bolus around a month before going with ram this autumn and keep the receipts for it and that would satisfy the measure for 2017.Is that what others understand is the case?

I dose ewes with Vit B12 combi dose a couple of times from Sept on each year.
I wonder would this satisfy the requirements or is the bolus a better and easier once off job?

Ya the scheme started Feb '17 so the first year goes from Feb '17 to end Jan '18 so ya the pre breeding mineral supplementation will have to be done in the breeding season of those 12 months.

We picked the scanning option so we held off scanning this year till Feb incase we were late scanning next year

arctictree

Bleating Lamb wrote: »

Was chatting a neighbour whose Agri Advisor told him that regarding the scheme if you picked the mineral supplementation measure(which a lot of people did).....that it would be this backend around breeding time that would count for it....so he told him to give ewes a cobalt bolus around a month before going with ram this autumn and keep the receipts for it and that would satisfy the measure for 2017.Is that what others understand is the case?

I dose ewes with Vit B12 combi dose a couple of times from Sept on each year.
I wonder would this satisfy the requirements or is the bolus a better and easier once off job?

I believe leaving out a mineral bucket is sufficient for the scheme?

rangler1

arctictree wrote: »

I believe leaving out a mineral bucket is sufficient for the scheme?

as long as you use enough of them, ie if the bucket says enough for 50 ewes for 20 days, then you have to make sure you've given 3 buckets for 60 days or however long

DJ98

If you selected meal feeding when should a march lambing flock start?

Inchilad

DJ98 wrote:

If you selected meal feeding when should a march lambing flock start?

Post weaning i think.

Western Pomise

Apologies if this was answered already.

Have scanning and mineral supplementation down as measures for the scheme,scanned the ewes in Feb 17' so that will count for scheme for 2017,will give mineral bolus to ewes in early Sept 17 in prep for breeding season,intend to cull heavily this backend in September....if I buy in strong ewe lambs to replace the number of ewes I sell does that satisfy the conditions of the scheme alright for 2017?

Say if I sold a few dry/wrong ewes in August after lambs coming off them (but without giving them mineral bolus),would that be ok?

Thanks for any replies.

J.O. Farmer

I think you can sell the ewes after weaning without the bolus as mineral supplementation is for 60 days after letting out the ram.
Ewe lambs won't cover you for ewes though they'll need to be over the year I think.

Western Pomise

J.O. Farmer wrote: »

I think you can sell the ewes after weaning without the bolus as mineral supplementation is for 60 days after letting out the ram.
Ewe lambs won't cover you for ewes though they'll need to be over the year I think.

Thanks for reply,would the ewe lambs not count when they turn a year of age ?(could always have being born in Jan 17').

Lambman

But what do they class as a breeding ewe? I could run all my ewe lambs with the ram and put them in my census as breeding ewes because wont have scanned at that stage so dono wat is or isnt in lamb? Or am i just being awkward?

rangler1

Western Pomise wrote: »

Thanks for reply,would the ewe lambs not count when they turn a year of age ?(could always have being born in Jan 17').

A ewe lamb is allowed as a replacement for a breeding ewe that you cull but not allowed as a breeding ewe in the census in december in the year of her birth......ewes that were born march 2016 are allowed only as replacements for your culls in 2017 even if they haven't lambs

rangler1

Lambman wrote: »

But what do they class as a breeding ewe? I could run all my ewe lambs with the ram and put them in my census as breeding ewes because wont have scanned at that stage so dono wat is or isnt in lamb? Or am i just being awkward?

Ewe lambs don't qualify as breeding ewes,
Running with a ram doesn't count

Lambman

How many years did we sign up for lads?

rangler1

Lambman wrote: »

How many years did we sign up for lads?

Just apply every year

Lambman

The 1 might be enough...

rangler1

Lambman wrote: »

The 1 might be enough...

€10 ewe subsidy doesn't come too often...

Western Pomise

It's a wonder that there wasn't more of a kick up from Hoggett producers then as they form an important part of the sheep chain and from what your saying won't qualify for the scheme at all which doesn't seem too fair.

sheepmad

Easy to know there is a subsidy......sheep numbers have invreased again according to the census 2016.
http://www.agriculture.gov.ie/media/migration/animalhealthwelfare/animalidentificationandmovement/NationalSheepGoatCensus2016110517.pdf

Green farmer

Anyone new to sheep can buy in as many sheep as they like, to claim as much as they like , but established sheep farmers are paid on historical figures and won't get any more if they expand their enterprise. Despite the fact that we're more likely to keep doing sheep even after the grant finishes. Here's hoping that any left over funding might be given to lads if they have extra numbers now then what they had in 14/15.

Birdnuts

Seems to be encouraging a big expansion in the national flock going on what was in the farming press this week - hope we don't lose out at the factory end!!

Lano Lynn

Western Pomise wrote: »

It's a wonder that there wasn't more of a kick up from Hoggett producers then as they form an important part of the sheep chain and from what your saying won't qualify for the scheme at all which doesn't seem too fair.

as I suggested before if the cencus date was at the same time as the bfp those hoggets would count benifiting those of us who breed their own replacements and hogget producers and quite likely put a couple of quid on ewe lamb in the back end .it is unfair that hogget producers don't get it but even more so those who put the effort into breeding their own replacements

razor8

Lano Lynn wrote: »

as I suggested before if the cencus date was at the same time as the bfp those hoggets would count benifiting those of us who breed their own replacements and hogget producers and quite likely put a couple of quid on ewe lamb in the back end .it is unfair that hogget producers don't get it but even more so those who put the effort into breeding their own replacements

And spending nights in a shed or field lambing them

Westernrock

What bolus has anyone found beneficial in the past? Hoping to bolus ewes this week for part of the scheme but want to use a bolus that is worth the effort of putting in!
All opinions and experiences welcome.
Thanks

ganmo

Westernrock wrote: »

What bolus has anyone found beneficial in the past? Hoping to bolus ewes this week for part of the scheme but want to use a bolus that is worth the effort of putting in!
All opinions and experiences welcome.
Thanks

What soil type do you have?
Different soils are deficient in different minerals so different blouses will have different results

AntrimGlens

Westernrock wrote: »

What bolus has anyone found beneficial in the past? Hoping to bolus ewes this week for part of the scheme but want to use a bolus that is worth the effort of putting in!
All opinions and experiences welcome.
Thanks

Bleed a sample of the ewes and then you'll know for sure. Take five ewes randomly as long as they're not in lamb and you'll have a fair spread. No point in spending over a pound a head on them if they don't need it.
I bolus twice a year for iodine and selenium as we're on selenium deficient ground. Noticed a big improvement in ewes holding to the ram when i was at that game.

Westernrock

ganmo wrote: »

What soil type do you have?
Different soils are deficient in different minerals so different blouses will have different results

Typically this area would be deficient in selenium, iodine and cobalt but most boluses have these in varying quantities, just wondering if there was a brand of bolus anyone found good, or one that people found no benefit from?

Westernrock

AntrimGlens wrote: »

Bleed a sample of the ewes and then you'll know for sure. Take five ewes randomly as long as they're not in lamb and you'll have a fair spread. No point in spending over a pound a head on them if they don't need it.
I bolus twice a year for iodine and selenium as we're on selenium deficient ground. Noticed a big improvement in ewes holding to the ram when i was at that game.

Ewes bled last year were low in selenium and iodine but supprisingly ok for cobalt given this area is usually very low in cobalt...
what bolus were you using for selenium and iodine?
Thanks

ganmo

In that case I'd look for ones with high iodine and selenium, particularly selenium as they have the most impact on fertility.
Cobalt is more linked with digestion so that would improve fertility but indirectly

AntrimGlens

Westernrock wrote: »

Ewes bled last year were low in selenium and iodine but supprisingly ok for cobalt given this area is usually very low in cobalt...
what bolus were you using for selenium and iodine?
Thanks

Animax Tracesure