Dravokivich wrote: » They used to. They used to be Mon - Sat + B.Hol Sunday. They aren't covered by PSO. They started scaling the service back in 2008/2009. There might not be a big enough return on the cost.
AlekSmart wrote: » It may be of some interest to note,that as and from,last Friday (21st April) Dept of Social Protection Free Travel Scheme Passes,are valid on Nitelink services.
Isambard wrote: » i think what they actually pay for is a back-door subsidy for the fare paying passengers.
Del2005 wrote: » So the free travel pass which comes out of general taxation is a subsidy to tax payers! Until the complete roll out of the smart travel pass we don't even know if the free travel pass is covering its own costs never mind subsidizing the people who actually pay it.
hungry hypno toad wrote: » This is ridiculous. The social welfare pays for the drink and chipper visit and a free bus home.
Del2005 wrote: » So the free travel pass which comes out of general taxation is a subsidy to tax payers! Until the complete roll out of the smart travel pass we don't even know if the free travel pass is covering its own costs never mind subsidising the people who actually pay it.
XPS_Zero wrote: » It does cover it's own costs now. During the crash years, the govt froze funding so it wasn't keeping up with changing demographics (there has been an increase in the population that are disabled in some way in Ireland since the late 80s when it started at 1000 extra or so a month, and with the populations average age going up that's only meaning more seniors as well). So the increased number of people using FT passes combined with the freeze meant there was a DE-FACTO CIE subsidy to the scheme of a few % points but that's going to be wiped out with the recent increase that Ross and Varadkar agreed to for the next budget. There was a review of the scheme which suggested ditching spouse passes, changing the criteria for companion passes and said that the funding freeze was unsustainable, so it's been ended. Studies of similar schemes elsewhere including one recently in the UK suggest such schemes are a net boon to the exchequer because of the savings in healthcare costs.The smart travel pass is almost completely rolled out there aren't many paper passes left, the last of them will expire by default in a few months and anyone who has not got one will be carrying a scrap of paper that's not valid for travel. No...it won't pay for a drink or chipper visit. It will pay for the bus home all right. Well yes, Free Travel is a net subsidy to the companies that helps lower fares when you work it all out. If FT were eliminated (an academic concept that would never happen anyway) you would get a small bump in fare revenue as it's former users would still undertake essential journeys but most of the journeys they take now (in most cases to end isolation and being trapped at home by age or illness) they'd no longer bother so it's not a simple matter of measuring what the new smartcards read in travel and imagining those journeys as being full fare paying and saying that's what would happen. It would never work that way. However if it was eliminated the DSP is no longer paying any money to the transport companies so:Bus Eireann would loose 18% of it's revenue Dubling Bus would loose 11% of it's revenue IE would loose 8% of it's revenue Luas would loose 9% of it's revenue The Rural Transport Scheme buses would loose 10% of their revenue. Take into account the bump you'd get in the former FT passengers paying for essential journeys like the odd hospital appointment, you'd still be loosing a lot of money which would = fare hikes for passengers generally. It would also mean increased costs for the health service which would mean money not spent on other areas because it's being sucked up by that. As to it's being applied to the Nitelink there are two separate issues with that:Firstly, you have disability allowance users, most of whom should not be out on the p1sser if they are that sick. But even there it's complicated because you're gonna have people who are recovering, almost back to normality who still have the pass (as you get to keep it during a transition back to work in some circumstances) and they're gonna be returning to normality which would include socializing. Most of the people on disability allowance would not be using a Nitelink. You won't get many people with serious mental health issues, cancer or brain trauma out clubbing at 2am.Secondly, remember what makes up most FT passes: seniors. Nothing wrong with them going out for a drink in a late opening bar and taking a late bus home. Does it really make that big a difference if they take a bus at 2am instead of 11:30? Or is it the extra fare that's the issue? When I first heard about it I thought no that makes no sense, but it's really not that different to other services, I mean other countries have 24 hour routes like in London they have their passes available on those routes...funny though Londons late night routes are not premium fare, they cost the same.
AlekSmart wrote: 3. It is worth noting that the 24 Hour Services currently in the formative phase will be charging Normal Fares,thus largely making the Nitelink premium service irrelevant ?
AlekSmart wrote: » Three issues to consider. 1. The old style paper Free Travel document does not have an expiry date. It is entirely up to the holder,or their reps,to return it upon death or change in circumstances. The old style FTP was originally due to be withdrawn during Q 4 of 2016,however delays in the commencement of the PSC Chipped Card programme has seen that date reportedly pushed back to Q1 2018. I know they don't have an expiry date. But the validity and the expiry date are not one in the same. My card shows the expiry as 2023, but I don't actually get to keep using it until then, I keep it until the last of my disability is paid then it's no longer valid and the machines won't recognize it. 2. The DSP Free Travel Scheme is widely described as the Old Age Pension Pass and similar. However the reality is that FTP scheme members of Pensionable Age comprise c. 55% of the Total number of pass holders. The most recent statistics are from the 2014 DSP Annual Report.( Where they were reissued in the form of a G10 errata sheet following the discovery of some anomalies in the original report)https://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Annual-SWS-Statistical-Information-Report-2014.aspx Total FTP holders were 812,892. Total FTP holders of Pensionable Age (Inc Partners/Surving Spouses) 476,971. In comparison,there were 112,079 Disability Allowance recipients qualifying for FTP. The FT Scheme is far broader in relit than merely Old Age Pension based. Maybe too broad. I don't see any real need for spousal passes, and I can see from experience there are far more companion passes out there than are really needed. It's gotta be remembered that even among those who are disabled there are varying levels of disability, while most should not (or should not be able to) be out boozing at night it 's more complex than that. They may be in recovery phase, they may be out and not drinking, it's not black and white. 3. It is worth noting that the 24 Hour Services currently in the formative phase will be charging Normal Fares,thus largely making the Nitelink premium service irrelevant ? This is what I was wondering, there is no real reason why it should not apply to Nitelink when you really think about it. Airlink does not take it...but the Bus Eireann services servicing the airport do, and the Dublin Bus services serving the airport...even if you're talking Express services...X2 takes it, Aircoach takes it....
1. The old style paper Free Travel document does not have an expiry date. It is entirely up to the holder,or their reps,to return it upon death or change in circumstances. The old style FTP was originally due to be withdrawn during Q 4 of 2016,however delays in the commencement of the PSC Chipped Card programme has seen that date reportedly pushed back to Q1 2018.
2. The DSP Free Travel Scheme is widely described as the Old Age Pension Pass and similar. However the reality is that FTP scheme members of Pensionable Age comprise c. 55% of the Total number of pass holders. The most recent statistics are from the 2014 DSP Annual Report.( Where they were reissued in the form of a G10 errata sheet following the discovery of some anomalies in the original report)https://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Annual-SWS-Statistical-Information-Report-2014.aspx Total FTP holders were 812,892. Total FTP holders of Pensionable Age (Inc Partners/Surving Spouses) 476,971. In comparison,there were 112,079 Disability Allowance recipients qualifying for FTP. The FT Scheme is far broader in relit than merely Old Age Pension based.
3. It is worth noting that the 24 Hour Services currently in the formative phase will be charging Normal Fares,thus largely making the Nitelink premium service irrelevant ?
Mrs OBumble wrote: » The one in Co Galway does run on BH Sundays ... www.buslink.ie
sdanseo wrote: » Two problems: unions and management. Exactly, because they're private with no PSO, managed by motivated and sensible people, don't have an over-inflated structure of management (it could be two lads in an office and nothing else), and they don't have unions to worry about.
Collie D wrote: » Do Nitelink do pickups along the route or are all stops outside of the start point pickup only? Thinking of doing Darkness into Light in Malahide next week and I'm living on the route to Malahide
XPS_Zero wrote: » Is there particular logic for doing it the way we do? We could have the 145 routes and 46a routes at least half hour or hourly overnight. Why have special N versions of routes like the combo route 84N when we could just continue normal services? Whats our aversion to Nitelink Rail? We've experimented with a few Luas and DART nitelinks but never put it on regularly, why? Is it an overtime thing?
pat ticket wrote: » Paid €15 for a cab home just now, a €5.20 nite link would have been much appreciated :rolleyes:
sdanseo wrote: » Two problems: unions and management. Mrs OBumble wrote: » The one in Co Galway does run on BH Sundays ... www.buslink.ie Exactly, because they're private with no PSO, managed by motivated and sensible people, don't have an over-inflated structure of management (it could be two lads in an office and nothing else), and they don't have unions to worry about.
Bray Head wrote: The problem with DB is as much management as with unions. Unionisation is inevitable in the transport sector, but unions manage to develop most control when management is weak and does not achieve the respect of its workforce.
Losty Dublin wrote: » There was a plan to bring in a late night 46A to the airport but it was scuppered by DoT heads on the pretext of it interfering with private buses.
devnull wrote: » Why is there a need to run a service to the airport from areas where there already is a service provided to such place by other operators at no cost to the taxpayer? If they want to run an airport services as a night bus there are many other places that are cut off totally, as well as the option of simply not serving the airport at all. Or was it DB seeking to 'flush out' the competition and only interested in such route because someone else was and proved it could work?
gizmo81 wrote: » Some people visit hospitals, out of hours doctor services at night and can't afford a taxi.
n97 mini wrote: » Not on Nitelinks. They don't pick up inbound and only at Westmoreland St and one or two other stops outbound.
