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Child Item

Ban children from Pubs ?

Andy From Sligo

I think all under 18's should be banned from pubs or any establishment that serves alcohol on the premises come to think of it, like restaurants etc if they sell drink

- what do reckon? - too severe or do you agree?

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blue note

It's not that complicated. They'll be grand. My concern is the fact that they'll be drinking in fields and lanes before they're 18 in greater quantities and with no adults around by not letting them into pubs.

D0NNELLY

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I think all under 18's should be banned from pubs or any establishment that serves alcohol on the premises come to think of it, like restaurants etc if they sell drink

- what do reckon? - too severe or do you agree?

Where would they go for a pint?

rob316

After spending my childhood in a pub with my dad, the last thing I would do is bring my kids to a pub. It's mind numbling boring for them and is no place for them. There is only so much Lucozade and bacon fries you can consume while watching daddy slowly get hammered.

Banning them from pubs would be ridiculous though.

Daledge

blue note wrote: »

It's not that complicated. They'll be grand. My concern is the fact that they'll be drinking in fields and lanes, in greater quantities and with no adults around by not letting them into pubs.

So why are you suggesting it?

Kids are going to drink anyway, the more you make it "forbidden", the more they'll do it for the thrill. A pub is a lot safer than a bush, believe it or not.

EDIT: Apologies, for some reason thought it was OP that had posted this.. Now I feel stupid.

Winterlong

rob316 wrote: »

After spending my childhood in a pub with my dad, the last thing I would do is bring my kids to a pub. It's mind numbling boring for them and is no place for them. There is only so much Lucozade and bacon fries you can consume while watching daddy slowly get hammered.

Banning them from pubs would be ridiculous though.

Every family is different I suppose. My favourite part of the week is every friday at about 6pm myself and my 6 year old go to the pub for a 'boys meal'. I have a pint, he has a juice and we both have some half decent food and a right good chat. No phones or tablets or tv.
We are there for an hour or so. It's lovely time together in a family friendly pub.

Ubbquittious

Daledge wrote: »

So why are you suggesting it?

Kids are going to drink anyway, the more you make it "forbidden", the more they'll do it for the thrill. A pub is a lot safer than a bush, believe it or not.

EDIT: Apologies, for some reason thought it was OP that had posted this.. Now I feel stupid.

But you can't unban underage drinking. No politician will have the cojones to do something that's so against the trend and against what people have been told is progress for the past 100 years.

People also draw a certain comfort from being able to complain about those damn bloody kids and their drinking as well as being able to vilify the parents. It satisfies a certain subconcious instinctive desire for being part of a clan. This is why people with nothing to do join the housing association and complain about everything.

People have a desire to be part of a righteous group of better people with one or more groups of worse undesirable people who they see as being below them being the outlaws and the 'enemy' of the clan. Underage drinkers, recreational drug users, boy racers and people who do backyard burning are easy pickings.

rob316

Winterlong wrote: »

Every family is different I suppose. My favourite part of the week is every friday at about 6pm myself and my 6 year old go to the pub for a 'boys meal'. I have a pint, he has a juice and we both have some half decent food and a right good chat. No phones or tablets or tv.
We are there for an hour or so. It's lovely time together in a family friendly pub.

Sounds great man, nothing wrong with that, keep it up!

Sofiztikated

Winterlong wrote: »

Every family is different I suppose. My favourite part of the week is every friday at about 6pm myself and my 6 year old go to the pub for a 'boys meal'. I have a pint, he has a juice and we both have some half decent food and a right good chat. No phones or tablets or tv.
We are there for an hour or so. It's lovely time together in a family friendly pub.

Go away you, with your actual parenting. Who do you think you are, being a responsible person.

Having said that, I've no problem with pubs making the individual decision to ban children. Aim for that target market, and work away. Similarly, others can go family friendly, and aim for that market.

Wildcard7

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I'm pretty sure in most respects tourists dinrt come here just to go eat in our restaurants and that there is more to ireland than restaurants and pubs? .. If not, god help us!

I don't know what you do on your vacations, but I generally eat something about 3 times a day, pretty much every day. I don't go on holidays somewhere purely to eat, but it kind of comes as a necessity with everyday life.

Now I don't have any kids so this wouldn't really affect me, but the idea of being restricted to eat in burger joints for a week does not sound terribly appealing to me.

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I'm not saying this is what happens but say if the kids look at the adults drinking pints and shots in a pub (at any time of the day) and think " ooh that looks grown up, I want to do that" or say if someone orders them an alcoholic drink for them? - if you bar them by law from setting foot in there in the first place, then there is not a problem or no risks.

Alcohol is out there, you can't change that. Even if your idea came true, it's a fact that sooner or later kids will get in contact with it. The benchmark is how well and how responsibly they handle it by that stage. Do you really think treating it as a forbidden fruit until they're 18, when they finally have access to every pub and every off license teaches someone to handle it responsibly?

How do you teach your kids to handle money? Do you not give them any money, maybe even deny that money exists, dropping your kids off at daycare when you go on a shopping spree, and then when they have their first wages you're surprised they don't save a penny because they blow it all on crap they don't need? No. You give them an allowance and explain to them why they can't have everything they want. Unless they save or work for it.

I know 2 kids (now in their 20s) that have been to parties and open air festivals with their parents (where we met them), have seen their fair share of drunk people, and have had access to alcohol since long before they were 16 (that's in germany). And they're quite responsible when it comes to drinking. They're not abstinent by any definition, but I've never seen one of them black out drunk, throwing up, or drink driving, which is a lot more than I can say about the few people I know that were completely forbidden alcohol until they were 18 where there were no more limits and they went completely bananas.

meeeeh

This thread was started by someone who thinks going out for family meal is going to McDonald's.

I would be more worried about my kids getting that impression than them seeing an odd drunk drinking his pint.

Andy From Sligo

If at 6pm there are some unsavoury arguments going on between adults, not necessarily people tanked up out of their mind but they have had a couple and its dropped the barriers, and its not getting to fisticuff levels but it is get quite brash, there's lots of swearing , there lots of goading, there's lots of unsuitable subject matter the 6 year old should not be listening to (but its OK for adults) and you have just sat down with your pint and your child with its orange juice.... What will/do you do? Do you go over and tell the adults to 'tone it down a bit lads, ive got my kid in here' ? Or do you wait and see if the landlord chucks them out (which is highly unlikely if they are just getting loud, suggestive and swearing) or do you get up and leave , leaving the drinks you just paid for.... Or just sit there and let your child see it all, take it all in and think ah sure they hear this language on the street or at home and its not doing them any harm and the unsavoury talk about certain subjects is just going to go over their heads. - I'm pretty sure there are other more suitable places to take a 6 year old to do a bit of family bonding time more suitable than a pub, which should be an exclusive place for adults to escape to and have some drinks without having to worry about children being in the vicinity and earshot.
How about home?, if not home, park, if its raining a fast food place just for an hour (stuff in moderation is fine and I am sure a lot of fast food restaurants have some kind of healthy eating these days not just burgers and chips) .. You will have to forgo your pint though but that maybe not a bad thing either , but think what a better environment it more likely is than a pub for the 6 year old?

Andy From Sligo

meeeeh wrote: »

This thread was started by someone who thinks going out for family meal is going to McDonald's.

I would be more worried about my kids getting that impression than them seeing an odd drunk drinking his pint.

Eh? When you go to a fast food restaurant such as McDonald's they dont hold a gun to your head as soon as you go through the door and say "you will have burger and chips or we will shoot you!!" .. When was the last time you were in one the 80's was it? .. These days they have a great choice of healthier stuff on the menu. Even burger n chips once in a while is not bad for you, everything in moderation and all that!

Malari

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

If at 6pm there are some unsavoury arguments going on between adults, not necessarily people tanked up out of their mind but they have had a couple and its dropped the barriers, and its not getting to fisticuff levels but it is get quite brash, there's lots of swearing , there lots of goading, there's lots of unsuitable subject matter the 6 year old should not be listening to (but its OK for adults) and you have just sat down with your pint and your child with its orange juice.... What will/do you do? Do you go over and tell the adults to 'tone it down a bit lads, ive got my kid in here' ? Or do you wait and see if the landlord chucks them out (which is highly unlikely if they are just getting loud, suggestive and swearing) or do you get up and leave , leaving the drinks you just paid for.... Or just sit there and let your child see it all, take it all in and think ah sure they hear this language on the street or at home and its not doing them any harm and the unsavoury talk about certain subjects is just going to go over their heads. - I'm pretty sure there are other more suitable places to take a 6 year old to do a bit of family bonding time more suitable than a pub, which should be an exclusive place for adults to escape to and have some drinks without having to worry about children being in the vicinity and earshot.
How about home?, if not home, park, if its raining a fast food place just for an hour (stuff in moderation is fine and I am sure a lot of fast food restaurants have some kind of healthy eating these days not just burgers and chips) .. You will have to forgo your pint though but that maybe not a bad thing either , but think what a better environment it more likely is than a pub for the 6 year old?

Seriously, I have never seen the kind of "brash" behaviour you describe here in any pub at 6pm! Very occasionally I've seen it late at night on the streets, but you must be frequenting very different places than I do.

There is nothing wrong with bringing a child to a place where alcohol is served for food. In fact I'd encourage it as a good way to socialise them as to how to behave in a restaurant or gastropub. Honestly, getting them into the idea that you only have fast food when you eat out is appalling.

pilly

I know everyone is dismissing Andy's idea and I don't agree with it either but I wouldn't mind a few child free restaurants around the place.

I have grown up children no and been there done that and I would love to go out for dinner on a Sunday afternoon to a restaurant that didn't have kids running around screaming and knocking things over.

Am I alone here?

Winterlong

Sofiztikated wrote: »

Having said that, I've no problem with pubs making the individual decision to ban children. Aim for that target market, and work away. Similarly, others can go family friendly, and aim for that market.

Absolutely agree. Pubs are free to set out their stall for their target markets as they wish.
The problem is more the parents, right.
Some parents think it is ok to have their kids watch them suck the barrel. And it's not ok, not at home and not in a pub.

Jack the Stripper

Ban big walls of posts, ban cheese and onion taytos, ban everything.

Malari

pilly wrote: »

I know everyone is dismissing Andy's idea and I don't agree with it either but I wouldn't mind a few child free restaurants around the place.

I have grown up children no and been there done that and I would love to go out for dinner on a Sunday afternoon to a restaurant that didn't have kids running around screaming and knocking things over.

Am I alone here?

No, but that's coming from the other side of the argument

I agree with you, and I most often choose places that are not child-friendly for this reason.

KERSPLAT!

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

Wall of text

And your issue with restaurants? If someone is being loud and "brash" they shouldn't be in a restaurant.

I certainly agree that after a certain time there should be a ban on under 18s in a pub but restaurants, no problem with anytime.

If a child is in there after what should be their bed time, that's another issue.

pilly

Malari wrote: »

No, but that's coming from the other side of the argument I agree with you, and I most often choose places that are not child-friendly for this reason.

Yeah me too but hard to find one on a Sunday afternoon in particular.

armaghlad

Think the onus is on parents to have consideration for other people dining/drinking in the establishment.

If you've a young child/baby/toddler who is likely to start crying/squealing/jumping/climbing/running about the place, maybe Nando's, TGIs, Frankie & Benny's, Mcds etc are more suited for you and your family.

Working in the trade I know that most staff would prefer this to be the case; and while we are more than family friendly, it does get annoying when when a crowd come in for lunch at 1pm and stay pinting until 6 (when we kindly ask them to leave) while their kids run about the place like demented eejits

pilly

armaghlad wrote:

Working in the trade I know that most staff would prefer this to be the case; and while we are more than family friendly, it does get annoying when when a crowd come in for lunch at 1pm and stay pinting until 6 (when we kindly ask them to leave) while their kids run about the place like demented eejits

Drives me nuts. Especially when kid comes over and sits beside you and you're supposed to laugh and find them cute. Fcuk off!

Winterlong

In fairness, whether you are in a pub or in a cafe, restaurant or where ever, parents need to keep their kids under control.

meeeeh

Winterlong wrote: »

In fairness, whether you are in a pub or in a cafe, restaurant or where ever, parents need to keep their kids under control.

Yes and mine are. But as long as place is not adults only or too late, I have no problem going to a pub or restaurant with them. If that bothers other it's on them to find more suitable place. I will not apologize for my well behaved kids having a meal.

That being said I have no desire being around people who come in at one for food and stay till six drinking even if there are no kids with them.

Cienciano

I think the problem is bad parenting. People who sit in the pub all day drinking and ignore their kids. I don't think penalising every parent in the country is going to make them good parents all of a sudden.

Tombo2001

Daledge wrote: »

So what happens when little Timmy and his mates all turn 18 after never having stepped foot in a pub?

They'd obviously head down the local with absolutely no idea how to act, no etiquette, no idea how much is considered too much.

I grew up in a pub environment (albeit, not often), and I've never once gotten into a fight or acted unsociably after "a few scoops". I've done my fair share of sh1te talk but that's about it.

Why do people feel the need to control and bubblewrap everything. Educate, not ban.

Or maybe they just wouldn't go to the pub, because its not part of their culture.

Which is a better outcome than being a pub regular who understands how to behave in a pub and to 'hold their drink'.

Lets not forget that alcohol is ultimately unhealthy, in any quantity, as a lifestyle choice. This business of being a 'modest' drinker, and that this is grand.....its one of the biggest myths in Irish society.

Shenshen

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Or maybe they just wouldn't go to the pub, because its not part of their culture.

Which is a better outcome than being a pub regular who understands how to behave in a pub and to 'hold their drink'.

Lets not forget that alcohol is ultimately unhealthy, in any quantity, as a lifestyle choice. This business of being a 'modest' drinker, and that this is grand.....its one of the biggest myths in Irish society.

I think you underestimate teenagers a bit, there. They're not yet fixed in their ways or their culture, far from it. That's the age when they will be most likely to try new things and push boundaries, after all.

Tombo2001

Shenshen wrote: »

I think you underestimate teenagers a bit, there. They're not yet fixed in their ways or their culture, far from it. That's the age when they will be most likely to try new things and push boundaries, after all.

Push boundaries can mean lots of different things.

Children of smokers are more likely to become smokers.

Children of drinkers are more likely to become drinkers.

Andy From Sligo

pilly wrote: »

I know everyone is dismissing Andy's idea and I don't agree with it either but I wouldn't mind a few child free restaurants around the place.

I have grown up children no and been there done that and I would love to go out for dinner on a Sunday afternoon to a restaurant that didn't have kids running around screaming and knocking things over.

Am I alone here?

ah no, not at all. there are times you want a nice relaxing meal without tired bored crying kids running around playing chase and acting up.. but wouldnt it be lovely that if you so wish a quiet meal like that , that you could book up in the comfort of that there is no blurred lines and that "This restaurant/pub prohibits under 18's by law" (or under 16' or 12's if you think over 18's is too harsh)

we might then be able to say I want to go out for a bite to eat , I now have a choice of tired bored crying kids running around playing chase and acting up in a fast food restaurant ... or do you know what I want to leave that all behind and relax , so lets go to that lovely quiet restaurant down the road...

Andy From Sligo

Winterlong wrote: »

Absolutely agree. Pubs are free to set out their stall for their target markets as they wish.
The problem is more the parents, right.
Some parents think it is ok to have their kids watch them suck the barrel. And it's not ok, not at home and not in a pub.

I dont know the full ins and out of pub law (come to think of it I dont know hardly anything of pub law) - so if they did operate setting out their own rules and prohibit entry under a certain age , but it wasnt law , couldnt the pub be then sued or done for discrimination or something?

Sofiztikated

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

ah no, not at all. there are times you want a nice relaxing meal without tired bored crying kids running around playing chase and acting up.. but wouldnt it be lovely that if you so wish a quiet meal like that , that you could book up in the comfort of that there is no blurred lines and that "This restaurant/pub prohibits under 18's by law" (or under 16' or 12's if you think over 18's is too harsh)

we might then be able to say I want to go out for a bite to eat , I now have a choice of tired bored crying kids running around playing chase and acting up in a fast food restaurant ... or do you know what I want to leave that all behind and relax , so lets go to that lovely quiet restaurant down the road...

Go to the lovely quiet restaurant down the road then!

I can't stand brats, and screaming in pubs and restaurants. So I don't go to those pubs and restaurants. I don't need a "law" to make that decision. You can make that decision yourself as well!