Truck driven into crowd in Stockholm - No Speculation

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

That is a really odd thing for you to think: every country curtails immigration. I do not think every country is racist.

I can not believe that you just said "coloured people" in 2017.

Do you think that people in Indonesia are fretting about whether to call Europeans "white people", or "fair-skinned" or "Cumquats"?

Do you think they care about it being 2017 and its connection to what they call white people?

The thing they are concerned about...is how to get to such a luxurious country where that kind of **** "matters", you know, like our country. They would love your position, and they'll take it if youre giving it away.

(not picking on Indonesia, just an example out of my arse)

Depp wrote: »

so you agree, you're against regimes that would limit these, like sharia/islamism? does that mean you are a nazi?

No, I can be against human rights violations in Egypt or Saudi Arabia and in Ireland at the same time.

In fact, I am.

moneymad

"It swerved from side to side. It didn't look out of control, it was trying to hit people,a second witness, Glen Foran, an Australian tourist, told Reuters. It hit people, it was terrible. It hit a pram with a kid in it, demolished it."

Imagine that was your child in the pram.Lock up the borders.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

No, I can be against human rights violations in Egypt or Saudi Arabia and in Ireland at the same time.

In fact, I am.

Good to hear! so you would oppose sharia/islamism and the human rights violations were it to come to Ireland then? if so we're in agreement!

also note the ''ism'' at the end of islamism, anyone should be free to practice any religion they wish I'm a huge proponent of that, but anyone who seeks to impose their religion on others or use it as a tool to suppress the human rights of others can get fcuked.

pangbang wrote: »

The real world is FAR harsher than youd like to let on. And its not about dark skin versus white skin, its about countries versus countries.

Theres a priority to life, and it exists whether youd like to accept it or not. All else being equal, you put your family first, your home first, your car first, your job first. Then your neighbourhood comes first, then your community, then your county, then your country, then neighbouring countries and so on and so on.....

Theres a reason for this. Its because that order of priority is a safety net for you. Its a biological imperative. It just starts to gets blurry the bigger you get, harder for instinct to kick in.

Exactly. I think this is something people have to zoom out a bit to see really, look at the planet, and check whether at a certain moment in time, it is okay for populations to migrate freely, or whether it's legitimate for certain people to become protective of their own patch. And these things change over time, so while it might be okay for immigration to happen at certain times, it might threaten native populations at other times.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

That is a really odd thing for you to think: every country curtails immigration. I do not think every country is racist.
I can not believe that you just said "coloured people" in 2017.

Tut tut tut. Must try harder if you really want to turn the tables.

Depp wrote: »

you said yourself a few pages ago your dad was a racist? are you a racist?

It made me very sad when I realized that he was not taking the p!ss, he was not mocking the establishment, he was not being at all ironic.

When he made politically incorrect jokes and remarks, he was not trying to highlight the inequality in the system. He was simply a racist ould lad, a product of his time. I am glad I never heard the depths of his notions about Jews.

And no, I am not a racist. Unlike Marine Le Pen, I did not take over leadership of the racist party my father led and take advantage of that pent-up hate.

Depp wrote: »

Good to hear! so you would oppose sharia/islamism and the human rights violations were it to come to Ireland then? if so we're in agreement!.

And you are in agreement with every left-wing human rights organization in the world!

Hurrah!

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

And no, I am not a racist. Unlike Marine Le Pen, I did not take over leadership of the racist party my father led and take advantage of that pent-up hate.

You keep throwing the accusation of racism around, but you're failing to provide anything further than her father and the history of his party? Not aware of a single policy they promote that discriminates based on race? What racist policies do they espouse?

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

And you are in agreement with every left-wing human rights organization in the world!

as any reasonable human would be, Human rights are essential and should always be protected?

Depp wrote: »

You keep throwing the accusation of racism around, but you're failing to provide anything further than her father and the history of his party?

I listed her policies upthread: stop immigration and encourage breeding by French people. It is the definition of racism.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

And you are in agreement with every left-wing human rights organization in the world!

Hurrah!

And you're in agreement with Marine Le Pen's stance on the protection of human rights for women specifically, yeah !

9 Defendre les droits des femmes: lutter contre l'islamisme qui fait reculer leurs
libertes fondamentales ; mettre en place un plan national pour l'egalite salariale
femme/homme et lutter contre la precarite professionnelle et sociale

To defend the rights of women : fight islamism as it reduces their fundamental freedoms ; establish a national plan for equal pay rights with men, and fight professional and social insecurity.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I listed her policies upthread: stop immigration and encourage breeding by French people. It is the definition of racism.

Racism :
Prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior.

1.1 The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics, abilities, or qualities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

Is French nationality a race ?

edit : to add definition of nationality

The status of belonging to a particular nation.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I listed her policies upthread: stop immigration and encourage breeding by French people. It is the definition of racism.

You said yourself curtailing immigration isn't racist? and as far as I'm aware the policy about birth rates makes no specification on race, it simply refers to ''French'' this does not mean white. If it did, it would indeed be racist, however it doesnt, so it is not.

Mountainsandh wrote: »

Must try harder if you really want to turn the tables.

You really think you can say "coloured people"? Out loud?

My dad got like that towards the end, but he had dementia, so we sort of had to let him away with it.

Depp wrote: »

the policy about birth rates makes no specification on race, it simply refers to ''French'' this does not mean white. If it did, it would indeed be racist, however it doesnt, so it is not.

Ha ha!

Good one.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I listed her policies upthread: stop immigration and encourage breeding by French people. It is the definition of racism.

Heres the thing about racism, its really just another word for differentiation.

Heres how to get rid of racism.
1) Turn everyone green, so theres no pigmentation difference. But what about facial characteristics?

2) Removes everyones eyes then they cant "see" any difference. But what if they can hear a distinction between accents?

3) Remove peoples ears. But what if they can still smell people different from them?

4) Remove peoples noses. But what if they can still feel differences?

5) Remove all facial features. But what if some people are taller?

6) Remove all limbs. But what if these green, shapeless, dumb, deaf organisms can still differentiate between each other?!

Point is, people are ALWAYS going to group together, and apart. And thanks to the current climate and the ridiculous things going on, the word "racism" means less and less. Both a good thing and a bad thing. Boy who cried wolf syndrome all over!

Depp wrote: »

You said yourself curtailing immigration isn't racist? and as far as I'm aware the policy about birth rates makes no specification on race, it simply refers to ''French'' this does not mean white. If it did, it would indeed be racist, however it doesnt, so it is not.

Indeed. People from Guadeloupe for example are very much French, and they have HIGH LEVELS OF CUTANEOUS MELANIN. (wouldn't want to hurt sensitivities with racist language)

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Ha ha!

Good one.

Explain to me how its racist then if I'm wrong? have i misunderstood the definitions of ''race,'' ''racism,'' ''french'' and ''citizen?'' Do you have an argument or are you just going to keep insisting something is racist when its not? As I said, its definitely nationalistic and if you want to argue with that you're perfectly entitled to, but drawing a false equivalencies here, being a nationalist does not make you a racist and it most certainly does not make you a nazi.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

You really think you can say "coloured people"? Out loud?

My dad got like that towards the end, but he had dementia, so we sort of had to let him away with it.

I don't personally say that, but genuinely....do you want to tell me whats wrong with it? Why is coloured bad? Why is black good? Why is white bad? etc!

Theres nothing inherently wrong with it, its a descriptor. There are plenty of words that ARE bad in meaning. Again, why is it only people in western/European countries that are so hung up about other people? I can safely say its doubtful they give a **** a about you in their countries.

Its this kind of insane over-thinking that turns people against each other. The word police!

SterlingArcher

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I can not believe that you just said "coloured people" in 2017.

Believe it or not his words are alot less dangerous than your attempts to shame him for using incorrect terminology.

You see people learn and grow by talking to other people. Sharing ideas . through this process their ideas and thinking evolve. Without this communication there is only violence to solve matters.

It may make you feel morally superior to point it out. But that means you expected to filter and sensor their thoughts and ideas when expressing themselves to the point of being dishonest about themselves. When someone is expressing their thoughts and being dishonest they do not learn.

You need an example of this. Go look at this same topic in the politics café. there is little and no honest debate. Just the sound of eggshells.

It may be easy for you now to be disgusted at your father for his attitude. In his time it was encouraged. But know this. sometime in the not so distant future your own child may be disgusted by Ideas you hold now that are encouraged, but the world has outgrown in the future.

If you need an example opposite to your dads racism. being a religious family used to be a sign of good honest respectability . Now its often times jeered at and the people dismissed as foolish idiotic or associated with all the bad the church has done.

SterlingArcher wrote: »

Believe it or not his words are alot less dangerous than your attempts to shame him for using incorrect terminology.

You see people learn and grow by talking to other people. Sharing ideas . through this process their ideas and thinking evolve. Without this communication there is only violence to solve matters.

Eh, dude, I did not deploy any missiles. We are actually just talking, the way you recommend.

But although it may cause some, well, older and less clued in people to accuse me of political correctness or social justice warriordom:

It is Not OK to say "Coloured people". When my dad was slipping, he used to come out and say "n!gger", and you wouldn't do that, but seriously folks, "coloured people" is not a lot better.

pangbang wrote: »

Heres the thing about racism, its really just another word for differentiation.

Do you know, I once nearly started a thread on this in AH, except I'm terrified of starting a thread on here. (and not overly pushed, too)

It seems like differentiation

(The action or process of differentiating or distinguishing between two or more things or people. For people who like or need definitions)

is the horror of the day.

Do not differentiate between man and woman !
Do not differentiate between able and less able/disabled !
Do not differentiate between people of various sexual preferences !
Do not differentiate between people who identify as the opposite gender !
Do not differentiate between people who identify as a cultural minority !
Do not differentiate !

And yet we're all expecting differentiation in real life. We all want differentiation between children and adults, for example for consent laws.
We want differentiation between abled and disabled, for example more disabled parking spaces.
We want differentiation for our children : more resources for children with special needs, more adaptive teachers to cope with different abilities in class. In fact teachers who do not differentiate are likely to get in trouble with the inspectorate.
We want differentiation for people who identify as a cultural minority, so they can live where they wish and officially identify as a cultural minority.

I am sick of the demonisation of differentiation too. I think we should really cop on and accept to look at, and talk about, and act on differences.

That's not racism ffs.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Eh, dude, I did not deploy any missiles. We are actually just talking, the way you recommend.

But although it may cause some, well, older and less clued in people to accuse me of political correctness or social justice warriordom:

It is Not OK to say "Coloured people". When my dad was slipping, he used to come out and say "n!gger", and you wouldn't do that, but seriously folks, "coloured people" is not a lot better.

So I'll ask again....whats wrong with a descriptor of colour? Who told you it was wrong....was it the "coloured" people? I doubt it, more than likely its the media you consume. Who decided it was bad? Who decided what was good?

Who is controlling your mind?

Il Fascista

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Eh, dude, I did not deploy any missiles. We are actually just talking, the way you recommend.

But although it may cause some, well, older and less clued in people to accuse me of political correctness or social justice warriordom:

It is Not OK to say "Coloured people". When my dad was slipping, he used to come out and say "n!gger", and you wouldn't do that, but seriously folks, "coloured people" is not a lot better.

Policing speech is one of the main things driving people away from the left, so you are not helping yourself or your brethren.

SterlingArcher wrote: »

It may be easy for you now to be disgusted at your father for his attitude. In his time it was encouraged.

It is not easy at all for me. I am very sad when I think that my dad was a racist.

And no, in his time it was not encouraged. It would have been strongly discouraged bu my mother, for example. For my whole life he could only say racist stuff by making jokes, the kind which seem racist until you realize they are about the system! Because he is brave enough to say what no-one will say!

But nope - he really was a racist, and he was less and less able to hide it. If it was actually OK, if he even thought it was, he wouldn't have been disguising it. He knew very well that it was not OK, until he knew nothing anymore.

SterlingArcher

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Eh, dude, I did not deploy any missiles. We are actually just talking, the way you recommend.

But although it may cause some, well, older and less clued in people to accuse me of political correctness or social justice warriordom:

It is Not OK to say "Coloured people". When my dad was slipping, he used to come out and say "n!gger", and you wouldn't do that, but seriously folks, "coloured people" is not a lot better.

Eh dude did anyone ask for your lifestory?

The other poster was talking, you were projecting your daddy issues. How is Walt Disney by the way.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

It is Not OK to say "Coloured people". When my dad was slipping, he used to come out and say "n!gger", and you wouldn't do that, but seriously folks, "coloured people" is not a lot better.

Really ????
This is jargon, lingo. Sometimes it's important, sometimes it isn't. You need to learn to make the difference, or you're really going to get yourself needlessly upset over a lot of things.

I, the terrible racist, was going out with a coloured guy for 2 years. Now this guy wasn't black black, he was kind of brownish. (forgive my utter racism) His origins were kabyle, he was very proud of that. He called himself an arab. Still does as far as I know. That was a very big crush preceded and succeeded by a very long friendship.
Arab is also considered an insult in France, but he had no problem calling himself that. Because that's what he was.
Interesting that rappers for example often use the word "ni***r" when talking about themselves, or their friends.

I'm a bit confused about the word "blind" at the moment too.
I was working with a blind person who talked about himself as blind, doesn't have a problem with others saying he's blind, but then, you know yourself, there's a lot of literature that uses "visually impaired" instead of blind these days.

The more you fret about this, the worse the divide, imo.
All language can be ambiguous.

SterlingArcher wrote: »

How is Walt Disney by the way.

Racist as fÃºck

Mountainsandh wrote: »

Really ????

Yes, really.

Would you call someone a "big buck n!gger"? My father-in-law did.

Just words, right?

SterlingArcher

Mountainsandh wrote: »

Really ????
This is jargon, lingo. Sometimes it's important, sometimes it isn't. You need to learn to make the difference, or you're really going to get yourself needlessly upset over a lot of things.

I, the terrible racist, was going out with a coloured guy for 2 years. Now this guy wasn't black black, he was kind of brownish. (forgive my utter racism) His origins were kabyle, he was very proud of that. He called himself an arab. Still does as far as I know. That was a very big crush preceded and succeeded by a very long friendship.
Arab is also considered an insult in France, but he had no problem calling himself that. Because that's what he was.
Interesting that rappers for example often use the word "ni***r" when talking about themselves, or their friends.

I'm a bit confused about the word "blind" at the moment too.
I was working with a blind person who talked about himself as blind, doesn't have a problem with others saying he's blind, but then, you know yourself, there's a lot of literature that uses "visually impaired" instead of blind these days.

The more you fret about this, the worse the divide, imo.
All language can be ambiguous.

That worse has already reared its head in Sweden. The police in Sweden have been encouraged to no longer use any features of race when describing a potential suspect.

So solving the actual crime becomes second to being seen as politically correct.