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Child Item

Rescue 116 Crash at Blackrock, Co Mayo(Mod note in post 1)

sparrowcar

Contact lost just before 0100 off the west coast of Achill island on a rescue mission.
Search in progress including all available ships and Rescue 115.

Hopefully a positive outcome to this.

Please keep replies civil, and respectful of the crew and their families.

Please do not speculate as to any cause unless you have a factual basis to do so (and can back it up with information released to the public).

There will be zero tolerance for troublemakers or those that choose to ignore these guidelines.

There are other moderator messages in the thread, as a result of issues that have arisen, and we will be less forgiving going forward, due to the ongoing sensitivity of this incident

As per normal boards guidance, any comments on moderation are off topic and should be addressed directly to mods or cmods by PM. Any part of posts which are off topic in such a manner may be edited or removed, with possible sanction. Non news posts will be moved to the parallel R116 Non news and discussion thread

Should any new reports, updates or news stories come out, posts which can be boiled down to "I Told You So" or other triumphalism about previous commentary will result in significant punishment.

Any threadbans will carry over to any replacement thread should this approach 10,000 posts

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Discodog

TallGlass wrote: »

On the radio it mentioned it was picking up equipment and supplies before heading to site.

That makes sense as she wouldn't be able to get close until Sunday at the earliest. Even then it won't be easy.

Discodog

cosanostra wrote: »

A Temporary Restricted Area has been established with a radius of 10nm around Blackrock LH and Drones will be confiscated by Gardai Effective 17/03/2017 12:26 - 20/03/2017 17:00

This is a classic case where a drone could be extremely useful to survey the wreckage, on the Island, that can't be reached

TallGlass

Also mentioned that the funeral will be tomorrow for Captain Dara Fitzpatrick. Mass at Patrick's Church, Glencullen.

ED E

Discodog wrote: »

This is a classic case where a drone could be extremely useful to survey the wreckage, on the Island, that can't be reached

One would assume they did it to keep the area clear for the ICG/AGS/AC helis operating in the area.

TallGlass

Discodog wrote: »

This is a classic case where a drone could be extremely useful to survey the wreckage, on the Island, that can't be reached

Can't imagine a drone be much use now in them winds, I would say mother nature would be doing the confiscation before the Gardaí!

kub

Discodog wrote: »

This is a classic case where a drone could be extremely useful to survey the wreckage, on the Island, that can't be reached

I imagine that the Gardai etc have their own drones, they just do not want people being noisy and getting in the way of helicopters etc.

cosanostra

Discodog wrote: »

This is a classic case where a drone could be extremely useful to survey the wreckage, on the Island, that can't be reached

It's not a restriction on state owned drones I'd say it's more like they don't want some story hungry journalist to get a lad down the road to fly out a drone to Blackrock and try and get pics.

XsApollo

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

It's very windy here in Dublin, I can only imagine conditions are very poor over the west!

I know nothing about aircraft and stuff, but have been following the thread.

Weather is brutal here in Shannon, windy , gusty and heavy rain.

mickdw

Is there a ban on private helicopters in the area.
If this was the uk, sky news would have live pictures from overhead.

Discodog

TallGlass wrote: »

On the radio it mentioned it was picking up equipment and supplies before heading to site.

Just passed Spiddal so in Galway tonight.

sjb25

Discodog wrote: »

This is a classic case where a drone could be extremely useful to survey the wreckage, on the Island, that can't be reached

They are onsite being used by emergency personnel not just Johnny down the road who wants a nose

Discodog

The wreckage on the Island is so critical. It could be there because of a mechanical failure & that just happened to be where it ended up. But that must be very long odds given the size of the Island.

notharrypotter

mickdw wrote: »

Is there a ban on private helicopters in the area.
If this was the uk, sky news would have live pictures from overhead.

From post 8 on page 1.

A TEMPORARY RESTRICTED AREA (TRA) HAS BEEN ESTABLISHED FOR THE IRISH
COAST GUARD (IRCG). IN THE VICINITY OF BLACKROCK LIGHTHOUSE, COUNTY
MAYO IN THE SHANNON FIR CENTRED ON THE FOLLOWING LATERAL LIMITS:
540400.00N 0101900.00W WITHIN A RADIUS OF 10NM.
SFC TO 5,000FT AMSL.
THE IRISH COAST GUARD ARE THE CONTROLLING AUTHORITY.
NO DRONE OPERATING PRIVATELY OR UNDER AERIAL WORKS PERMISSION MAY
OPERATE WITHIN THE TRA. RPAS MAY BE SUBJECT TO SEIZURE BY AN GARDA
SIOCHANA. AREA RESTRICTED TO USE BY IRCG AND STATE ACFT. FURTHER
INFO FROM FLT OPS DEPT, IAA TEL: 00 353 1 6031117/ 1148/1410 OR
EMAIL FOD(AT)IAA.IE. SEE WWW.IAA.IE
LOWER: SFC
UPPER: 5000FT AMSL
FROM: 17 MAR 2017 12:26 TO: 20 MAR 2017 19:00

Curious as to why you would consider having news helicopters hovering overhead beneficial?

Reati

Most TRAs issue since the new Rockrlets and unmanned aircraft SI back in 2015 now contain the no drones language. The language about Gardaí taking it is always the same. In fact the old aerial works permit refer to doesn't even exist anymore.

I think blackrock is a bit far out for any commercially available drone unless they go out with a boat. The TRA is 10NM in diameter so pretty big and It's more likely to keep airspace clear for helis going in and out of the area.

Lastly the TRA airspace is controlled by the coast guard so they can give permission to rescue drones if weather permits but Most drones can't handle winds past 10m/s.

Gaoth Laidir

This is the TRA. It extends over inhabited areas so hence the reference to drones. From here

SachaJ

I've been following this thread since the first alert on the news on Tuesday morning. Living in Drogheda, I'd usually see R116 a couple of times a week passing over head and when we'd hear the noise there would always be a race to the windows to see it. Very frequently it would fly pretty low over the house if they were training over or searching the river. An absolute tragic loss. I was only saying to the wife that no matter how it happened, 6 kids have lost a parent. She replied and asked "how many countless kids have not lost a parent due to the R116 crew?".... These guys really do amazing work.

I do have a question though and it's not insinuating or speculating any cause to the crash, just something I was thinking about. Around 13km from Blacksod they turned with the intention of returning there to refuel. They were at 4000ft. Around 5km later was Black Rock on which some debris was found. This information is in the public domain. Would it be normal procedure to descend at around a 13 degree angle so far out from their destination given the conditions?

Gaoth Laidir

Just to repeat the weather conditions at the time of the crash (around 1 am, March 14th) at Belmullet, 30 km northeast of Blackrock. Cloudbase was about 300 feet and visibility 3000 metres. Thunderstorms were not present.

Visibility: 3 km
Wind: 220 (SE) @ 10 m/s (19 kts)
Temp 10.6 °C, Dewpoint 9.9 °C
Sea level pressure: 1025.4 hPa
Pressure trend past 3 hours: almost no change
Weather: rain showers
Cloud: Overcast with base at 300 ft

At Mace Head, 80 km to the southeast, conditions were similar, with cloud Overcast at 400 ft, lowering to 200 ft by 2 am. Visibility at midnight was 5 km, at 1 am it was 2.7 km, at 2 am 1.9 km.

Calina

notharrypotter wrote: »

From post 8 on page 1.
Curious as to why you would consider having news helicopters hovering overhead beneficial?

TBH I think the authorities have done an extremely effective job in terms of controlling the flow of information or possible information. They must have known there was wreckage on the island from day one - there were helicopters flying in the area actively searching the area from very early on.

I think it's not a question of assuming access is beneficial but that we have now a generation of people who are familiar with 24 hour news cycles, are familiar with news video on demand either via the official news media or via social media with phones. In comparison, the coverage has been decidedly restrained here. You'd have to wonder how RTE or TV3 would survive if they were trying to fill a 24 hour channel based on how this has played out. It's also not the first time that a news story in Ireland has been dealt with in a significantly more sensitive manner than might be the case in the UK, for example.

SachaJ

Reati wrote: »

I think blackrock is a bit far out for any commercially available drone

I'd say you could do it with the Parrot DISCO. That has a 45 minute flight time and you could program waypoints/flight plan and let it off.

Discodog

Does anyone know if Blackrock is a waypoint on the way in to Blacksod ? Their track seemed to be direct to Blackrock.

Reati

SachaJ wrote: »

I'd say you could do it with the Parrot DISCO. That has a 45 minute flight time and you could program waypoints/flight plan and let it off.

Good point you're right. I was thinking quads and hexs. These fixed wing chaps might be able to get out that far but never used in so can't speak to the range.

mickdw

notharrypotter wrote: »

From post 8 on page 1.
Curious as to why you would consider having news helicopters hovering overhead beneficial?

Where did I say that. I asked a question and in my mind was thinking of the Scottish case of the police helicopter that crashed I to pub. There was pretty much 24 7 coverage from news helicopter.

Negative_G

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Noooooooooooooooo........ Don't mention the war...... We're just back on track, wha?

:eek::eek::eek:

Your post is a tad sensationalist and unnecessary.

The TRA specifically relates to the use of civilian RPAS. Given that the emergency services have access to their own RPAS, the decision was likely made to protect the airspace and prevent prying eyes.

My point was to highlight that this is unfortunately a futile exercise if media is already being exchanged amongst individuals that have nothing to do with the investigation.

Unfortunately, it likely that it is only a matter of time before the media get their hands on it.

Steve

First catch of the day already, if you ignore the first post and terms of reference you *will* be sanctioned.

...And Justice

Are we allowed to ask where Dara's body was found ?.All I've seen in the media is that she was "rescued" and died shortly after.

Steve

Of course, yes.

faoiarvok

For information, a TRA applies to all aircraft, not just RPAS/drones. It reserves a section of airspace normally under the control of one authority for the use of another (e.g. Civilian airspace being reserved temporarily for military use etc).

The authority responsible for the TRA may allow access to other airspace users at their discretion.

Discodog

...And Justice wrote: »

Are we allowed to ask where Dara's body was found ?.All I've seen in the media is that she was "rescued" and died shortly after.

My impression was recovered from the sea but I don't recall an accurate location. There was peculation on Sky that the remaining crew may be strapped in. It's possible that she was out of the cockpit & was thrown clear.

Gadgetman496

Search for Coast Guard helicopter to focus on 'three hour window'

...And Justice

Steve wrote: »

Of course, yes.

Thanks, I still have it in my head, how the others were not nearby. Still can't understand why the others haven't been found? The pings from the chopper were still live 15 hours after on marine traffic.