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Rescue 116 Crash at Blackrock, Co Mayo(Mod note in post 1)

sparrowcar

Contact lost just before 0100 off the west coast of Achill island on a rescue mission.
Search in progress including all available ships and Rescue 115.

Hopefully a positive outcome to this.

Please keep replies civil, and respectful of the crew and their families.

Please do not speculate as to any cause unless you have a factual basis to do so (and can back it up with information released to the public).

There will be zero tolerance for troublemakers or those that choose to ignore these guidelines.

There are other moderator messages in the thread, as a result of issues that have arisen, and we will be less forgiving going forward, due to the ongoing sensitivity of this incident

As per normal boards guidance, any comments on moderation are off topic and should be addressed directly to mods or cmods by PM. Any part of posts which are off topic in such a manner may be edited or removed, with possible sanction. Non news posts will be moved to the parallel R116 Non news and discussion thread

Should any new reports, updates or news stories come out, posts which can be boiled down to "I Told You So" or other triumphalism about previous commentary will result in significant punishment.

Any threadbans will carry over to any replacement thread should this approach 10,000 posts

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sdanseo

Steve wrote: »

I believe so, last NTM I can find was 2005.

http://www.irishlights.ie/safety-navigation/notices-to-mariners/2005-11-blackrock-sligo-lighthouse.aspx

Different lighthouse.

limericklad87

Of course... a momentary case of tunnel vision.. apologies

Mech1

limericklad87 wrote: »

This discovery of wreckage on the island must be fairly recent as we've seen the search patterns being used for the last 2 days indicating the uncertainty of where the bulk wreckage is

search was primarily for survivors, any other debris is noted / collected if possible and move on.

Welruc

Mech1 wrote: »

was the lighthouse operational?

Yeah its operational, light does a rotation roughly every 8 secs

Steve

Mech1 wrote: »

was the lighthouse operational?

I believe so, last NTM I can find was 2005.

http://www.irishlights.ie/safety-navigation/notices-to-mariners/2005-11-blackrock-sligo-lighthouse.aspx

limericklad87

This discovery of wreckage on the island must be fairly recent as we've seen the search patterns being used for the last 2 days indicating the uncertainty of where the bulk wreckage is

vicwatson

Dark sun wrote: »

Judging from that photo its possible they were returning to refuel and could have possibly hit black rock lighthouse maybe heavy fog or mist might have impaired view maybe confused with blacksod lighthouse .:(

But they had radar, or maybe not

Mech1

January wrote: »

All reports say that it was a pretty clear night out there that night.

was the lighthouse operational?

homerjay2005

ED E wrote: »

Hit it accidentally. Remember we had a recorded speed of 160km/hour. Thats not the kind pace you use for landing I would assume.

ya thats a good point. the point above about debris being found on the island is new information which points to a collision though,if its true.

January

Dark sun wrote: »

Judging from that photo its possible they were returning to refuel and could have possibly hit black rock lighthouse maybe heavy fog or mist might have impaired view maybe confused with blacksod lighthouse .:(

All reports say that it was a pretty clear night out there that night.

ED E

homerjay2005 wrote: »

so if this is true and im reading it as i think you are trying to say, it definately plausible that they hit the island.

landed at the wrong place thinking it was blacksod?

Hit it accidentally. Remember we had a recorded speed of 160km/hour. Thats not the kind pace you use for landing I would assume.

homerjay2005

Mech1 wrote: »

hit the island?, possible.

landed at the wrong place thinking it was blacksod?, no I dont believe that could happen.

remember I know little to nothing about this sort of stuff, just listening in.

whats the normal turning distance though? isnt it a bit unusual to go out so far from blacksod and actually fly directly over blackrock?

Dark sun

Judging from that photo its possible they were returning to refuel and could have possibly hit black rock lighthouse maybe heavy fog or mist might have impaired view maybe confused with blacksod lighthouse .:(

Mech1

homerjay2005 wrote: »

so if this is true and im reading it as i think you are trying to say, it definately plausible that they hit the island.

landed at the wrong place thinking it was blacksod?

hit the island?, possible.

landed at the wrong place thinking it was blacksod?, no I dont believe that could happen.

remember I know little to nothing about this sort of stuff, just listening in.

homerjay2005

eatmyshorts wrote: »

Large parts of debris, specifically the tail area, were recovered from Blackrock Island itself, in the area of the lighthouse and adjoining building.

so if this is true and im reading it as i think you are trying to say, it definately plausible that they hit the island.

Negative_G

For those discussing the "radar let down" procedure, it is not just a case of keep on descending until you break out into VMC conditions.

I am not familiar with S92 operations but the crew will normally nominate a "decision height" which is based on a Radio Altimeter read out.

A 'Rad Alt' gives an instantaneous height read out from the bottom of the aircraft to the terrain below, or in this instance the water surface. In simpler terms, imagine a laser beam pointing directly down from beneath the aircraft and giving a readout to the pilots in feet. This system operates completely independently of barometric pressure so the QNH setting is not a factor although it will feed into the scan and information loop.

Generally, If they are not visual by the nominated read out, they will add power and climb away. I have no idea what this height would be for their specific operation but guess that it would be in the region of several hundred feet.

Given the fact that they transitted to the area at 3-4000 feet. I would guess that this is what occurred given the prevailing warm front/warm sector conditions.

I would assume that the S92 is fitted with EGPWS which should have given the crew a warning if they were descending toward known terrain such as the island. Then again, they may have had it inhibited whilst carrying out the procedure.

A lot of assumptions, I know. But just considering plausible scenarios from the information we have at the moment.

Please god they find the other crew members. And well done to all the first responders, IRCG, RNLI, fishermen and the Defence Forces for assisting in what must be difficult conditions.

jpfahy

refusetolose wrote: »

Flight path posted earlier superimposed on a screenshot from google maps and scaled to match

refusetolose

jpfahy wrote: »

just trying to show a photo

jpfahy

deuceswild wrote: »

What app are you using?

just trying to show a photo

Welruc

jpfahy wrote: »

What app are you using?

irishgeo

eatmyshorts wrote: »

Large parts of debris, specifically the tail area, were recovered from Blackrock Island itself, in the area of the lighthouse and adjoining building.

:eek:

irishgeo

cosanostra wrote: »

Would have thought it would be quicker for it to head round the southern coast and up the west coast

i wouldnt know which way is quicker.

eatmyshorts

Large parts of debris, specifically the tail area, were recovered from Blackrock Island itself, in the area of the lighthouse and adjoining building.

And no, I can't link to a source, as the info came direct from someone who saw it.

jpfahy

cosanostra

irishgeo wrote: »

blackrock has a helicopter landing pad.

Granuaile is on the move to blacksod but its only just passing dublin. wont arrive till friday at least.

Would have thought it would be quicker for it to head round the southern coast and up the west coast

spookwoman

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Was the S92 equipped with any type of forward looking ground radar detection? This incident made me think of the 94 Mull of Kintyre crash especially if the wreck is reported to be only 60 metres out.

Not sure looking for info myself and found this its a powerpoint presentation page 17 and 18 G-REDW Ditching - IOSH

this year s92 check for rear rotor issues https://stv.tv/news/north/1377995-safety-checks-reveal-faults-with-north-sea-helicopters/

irishgeo

blackrock has a helicopter landing pad.

Granuaile is on the move to blacksod but its only just passing dublin. wont arrive till friday at least.

spookwoman

El Weirdo wrote: »

What a disgustingly horrible, click-baity headline.

The whole story on RTE this evening was very off putting. Hope they find the others and answers to what happened.

jimmycrackcorm

Was the S92 equipped with any type of forward looking ground radar detection? This incident made me think of the 94 Mull of Kintyre crash especially if the wreck is reported to be only 60 metres out.

Mech1

Just in case any media try to amend the facts, this is my live recording as R116 left Dublin.
http://archive-server.liveatc.net/eidw/EIDW3-Twr-118600-Mar-13-2017-2300Z.mp3