Pat Mustard wrote: » What is this "Kate" business about? "I'm having breakfast, Kate" etc. I googled it but all that comes up is Kate Middleton or whatever she is called now.
please helpThank YOU wrote: » ask the Guildford four about Justice Miscarriages of Justice so I ever time your in court in Ireland just think what Justice will do to You.
mynamejeff wrote: » that wasnt an irish court also it was politically motivated conviction not at all close to the discussion here
mynamejeff wrote: » wouldn't there be significantly less criminals and crime though and safer more peaceful world ? unfair to some but better for every one in the end rather than unfair to everyone and better for some (criminals)
Fleawuss wrote: » There is no death penalty in Ireland.
Esel wrote: » http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057686148/1/#post102078851
please helpThank YOU wrote: » Miscarriages of Justice Michael Feichin Hannon Galway Wrongly convicited of sexually assaulting a ten year old girl that man was declared miscarriage of Justice by the irish courts we also have nun Nora Wall jailed for life in 1999 for a crime she did not do wrongfully convicted of rape jailed for life she was exonerated and that is just 2 so I would not have any fate so ever on the irish/ireland Justice court its very on fair.there is no Justice
Noddyholder wrote: » Also the Nicky Kelly case, Osgur Breatnach, Nicky Kelly, Brian Mcnally, Michael Plunkett, John Fitzpatrick were arrested and beaten by the Garda Síochána to extract confessions under duress from four (Plunkett did not sign). The four were found guilty with no other evidence apart from the confessions. Breatnach and McNally were acquitted on appeal on the grounds that their statements had been taken under duress. Kelly was given a presidential pardon and received £750,000 in compensation
Noddyholder wrote: » Co Meath man has said he is delighted after the Court of Criminal Appeal found his conviction for killing his 19-year-old neighbour more than 40 years ago was a miscarriage of justice. Martin Conmey's conviction for the manslaughter of Una Lynskey in 1971 was quashed by the court in 2010. This morning the court found that the conviction was a miscarriage of justice. Mr Conmey, 63, said he was delighted the decision of the court had totally cleared his name.https://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0729/633746-martin-conmey/ Very interesting story there, Brutal muder of a girl, vigilante revenge and murder and a miscarriage of justice, Here it is http://www.irishexaminer.com/lifestyle/features/profiles/40-years-waiting-to-clear-his-name-199954.html
Samuel T. Cogley wrote: » There might be less crime. We can introduce draconian methods as long as we're willing to pay for them. Whether living in a police state is 'better for everyone' has to be decided by the individual. My understanding is there was very little crime in Nazi Germany and a great sense of community spirit.
please helpThank YOU wrote: » then we have garda Maurice Mccabe what the Justice system did to him hell on earth poor man I feel so sorry from makes me get very upset what the Justice did to him and others this just the tip of ice iceberg .
mynamejeff wrote: » aw come one now !!! what was maurice mccabe convicted of ? what jail was he in ? old allegations dug up by the media is that what you mean ?
please helpThank YOU wrote: » What was done to Garda Maurice Mccabe. who is a hero is Great Nicest Man this was a depraved act by the state and government state agency tusla /hse /garda was pure evil thing to this very good man Garda Maurice Mccabe he is in Jail aright in his HEAD that is his jail. he his good name was taking from him by the evils of Ireland. god help this poor man what was done to him and others by the same to government state agency is act of pure evil. convicted luck the man is not dead from the stress of this nightmare
mynamejeff wrote: » well then you ll agree its about finding the correct balance, something we do not have now
Samuel T. Cogley wrote: » We have a pretty low crime rate and a situation where we see 'scumbags' essentially growing out of it once they start families of their own. The more expensive and safer solution is, essentially, to build more prisons. Are you willing to fund this with around a 3-4% increase in income tax on top of everything else like USC etc. I am, but that informs only my vote. Once we had the prison places we'd have to deal with the knock on effect of a decrease in the 90% rate of people pleading guilty. We'd either have to build more courts or what I'm in favour of, running a night court. Legal aid budgets would need to increase in the short term, but they might decrease again once some of the more prolific offenders or repeat business, which ever way you want to look at it' find themselves behind bars for longer stretches. Be under no illusion though. Conservative estimates place the cost of incarceration at €76,000 per year. We're paying that. It's also a hugely inefficient way of dealing with the problem and might actually lead to an increase in crime and recidivism if the US is used as a model. As for striking a balance, this is ongoing. It's swinging away from individual rights of the accused and to the collective rights of the public at this very moment. Whether that's a good thing or not remains to be seen. This is all going on and is being done transparently and with a huge amount of thought, all one needs to do is go and look.
mynamejeff wrote: » not sure if criminals grow out if it and any family that they have tend to be a further burden on the state
mynamejeff wrote: » I agree more prisons would provide jobs in the buildings and running. there are many ways of providing the money for this. tightening up the laughable legal aid system , collecting the massive amount of unpaid fines from social welfare payments. wastage in the hse and justice systems . when you think of the billions that the gov waste ........
mynamejeff wrote: » guilty pleas generally only come in unwinnable cases after as many remands as possible to bleed the legal aid system as much as possible. changes on the legal aid system would make huge differences here too.
mynamejeff wrote: » There as a night court run in dublin for a while but the judges as solicitors didn't like it so it was stopped. Night court was generally only for fresh charges and warrants anyway with cases being remanded to regular courts and back into the cycle.
mynamejeff wrote: » the cost of incarceration needs to be looked at too , made more basic , gyms education basic medical . why is anything else necessary.
mynamejeff wrote: » Im in the district and circuit courts regularly and higher courts on occasion and cant say ive seen any swing in the balance to be honest , id love to say your right and home it does happen but i dont see it yet.
"We have a pretty low crime rate"
Crime Threats The general crime rate in Ireland is below the U.S. national average. Crimes against U.S. citizens usually involve petty theft, burglary, and other minor offences. Ireland hosts a large number of U.S. and other foreign tourists. There is also a sizeable expatriate presence and U.S. business interests. Through the first three quarters of 2015 crime statistics reported (see chart below), there was a small increase in burglary and fraud cases (+6 percent each) but a larger increase in sexual offences (+14 percent). Dublin remains the county with the highest crime rate in accordance with its demographically-large population. Violent crime is rare but does exist.
Samuel T. Cogley wrote: » There's no evidence I've seen to support this. Crime is generally on a downward or fairly static trend. So given the average family, if they were breeding a new generation of scumbags one would expect an increase in crime. Generally people try and stop their kids getting involved in crime, not all but a majority.
What do you think is going to happen if people are taken off basic social protection payments?
That's simply and patently false. 90% of detected crimes are plead to.
The criminal legal aid bill is about €50m annually. It's absolute peanuts and is vital in maintaining parity of arms between the state and the accused. More is spent on Sports and Recreation services or keeping the Irish language alive.
Solicitors won't attend Garda Barracks and sit in on interviews either as they can do now, this would have to be paid for by legal aid in many cases. If they're bilking the system why have they avoided this potentially lucrative revenue stream?
Again this is patently wrong. Prisons should cost three or four times what they cost now. Rehabilitation reduces crime. You only need to look at the Nordic vs the US model. Ireland tries to steer a middle ground, if you want to change that look at who you're voting for.
The swing has come about in the Supreme Court. There is a retrenchment form the position that a breach of constitutional rights should exclude evidence. One can debate this either way but the courts can do very little to reduce crime. Sentencing is being informed (IMHO) by lack of prison places.
mynamejeff wrote: » again you miss my point , a plea might be entered in the district or circuit after as much money as can be bleed is taken . IE first day , gary doyle order goes back two weeks second day, claims order just arrived , goes back two weeks, third day, solicitor in another court back two weeks forth day. garda in another court two weeks fifth day, offender is a no show so bench warrant sixth day. solicitor says he gave client wrong date back two weeks or plea or date , seventh day. plea. and appeal severity to circuit court which could take three years to be heard on severity only
mynamejeff wrote: » granted 50 million last year down ten from the year before , same article says john Gilligan cost 3 million alone over the course of his crimes , is that fair ? So take money from the irish language service , is more important to be able to walk down he street safely that speak irish , Again as i said there is so much waste in the government
mynamejeff wrote: » Not true the solicitors i know attend stations regularly . the big offices generally send the less experienced solicitors. Anything more serious than shoplifting or a drug search will get a visit to the station and in general sit in on interviews if nothing else as a learning experience for the solicitor
mynamejeff wrote: » ya irish people are not like nordic people or Americans , spend some time in these countries and notice the attitude of the majority is very very different.
mynamejeff wrote: » Lack of prison places is major alright but weak judges out of touch with reality are a major cause too. poor policing public attitude liberal government and any number of other things you want to name too ,
Samuel T. Cogley wrote: » Perhaps I did but it's rendered moot by: It's such a tiny amount of money it would do almost nothing to aid people's safety. You need billions of investment in the prison system. You and I have found €100m.
Fair enough, I certainly hadn't seen it as it was fairly new when I was last in the practical side of things. Not bad that we've managed to have this and still Legal aid is costing the state less than Irish.
I can't speak to DC and CC court judges I know none of them personally. I knew three, now two Supreme Court justices who very generously used to come along to even my alma mater, give lectures, take questions and they all seemed very in touch indeed. I know of a solicitor recently appointed to the HC who was very 'with it' in terms of the type of work he'd done, a very intelligent man also. .
I really don't know what people want when they want judges who are 'in touch'. Granted it's a bit of a common joke that DC court Judges are all in their own little fiefdoms but what do people want, they deal with minor crimes. Any Judge I've ever met has been intelligent, aware of what the public wanted generally and tried to do the best they could with what they had. Granted they shouldn't be letting prison places inform heir decisions but do we really want judges engaging in judicial activism. It's for the public to vote in TDs who will raise taxes and sort out our prison system.
