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Child Item

Good wide family car

Gwynston

We have 3 kids aged 7, 10, 12 and a 2008 Ford S-Max which we've really liked (it's the most car-like MPV), but it's starting to get on a bit and we're looking to change to something newer (<18mo).

While the extra 2 rear seats have been useful when we've occasionally had extra school friends or cousins in tow, I'm thinking we could manage without them now. But one other good thing about the S-Max is that there are 3 individual seats in the middle row, which gives more space, comfort and less scope for fighting between the kids.

I've been looking around and there are lots of nice cars around, like big saloons/hatchbacks/estates or SUVs. But one thing I notice is that they all have a bench seat in the back with only two properly sculpted seats, typically also with a tunnel/hump in the floor, so the middle passenger will be severely compromised, and I can see lots of scope for moaning and squabbling.

So what medium/large family car provides decent, wide accommodation in the back for three growing passengers?

Or do only MPVs provide such?

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Gwynston

Update:
Went back to my local Peugeot dealer today as they have a new LHD 3008 in for viewing. It's not big enough in the back for my requirements, but I wanted to check out the interior and the styling to get an idea what the forthcoming new 5008 might be like.

It's certainly a fairly radical departure by Peugeot! It's not as radical as Citroens, but it's definitely different, and with much better quality and finish than Citroen. My wife doesn't go for anything too quirky, so I have to get her to look at it. She'll either love it's style and plushness (certainly a world away from the old 3008 & 5008) or dismiss it off hand as being too left field :rolleyes:

Anyway, I think it bodes well for the new 5008 which will be bigger and chunkier, going by imagery so far. I think that will veer more towards a classy look compared to the 3008's smaller proportions lending it more towards cutesy.

While there, I also looked again at the current 5008. I think I may have previously over-estimated the rear space of that. Although it has 3 separate seats, they're not as big as my S-Max. In the Kodiaq thread, I was comparing the widths across the back and quoted this measurement of 1442mm:
http://www.peugeot.ie/range/find-your-vehicle/5008/technical-information.html

That would make it comparable to the S-Max, but despite the suggestion from that diagram, the seats aren't that wide. I measured across the seat bases and got 132cm, which is not as wide as the 140cm in the S-Max. Which makes sense really because the seats looks smaller and the cars is certainly not as wide.

So I'm beginning to think the current 5008 and similarly-sized Grand Picasso would not be wide enough after all to consider, despite having 3 separate seats. My 3 kids aren't getting any smaller, so downsizing from what we have is not really an option.

So unless I want to wait more than 6 months for the new 5008, it looks like a new S-Max for me. There are very few 2016 models with the 150bhp engine though - and most of them seem to be white (see my other thread on that

). New ones are so expensive though....

SmithySeller

You are spot on, the S-Max is huge and when people talk about money I don't know if they realise how much bigger an S-Max is than the current 5008 and indeed the Grand Picasso which has the exact same size seats as the 5008. Now I could be wrong but I'm guessing the new 5008 seats may if anything be only slightly larger. The dimensions Manufacturers trot out are deliberately very misleading indeed to suit their needs. X-Trail is the perfect example, very very compact with lots of metal!

Gwynston

Yeah, when we visited my parents in Canada last year they were all excited that with their new X-Trail, the 7 of us would all fit in happily and be able to go places together. It turned out not quite to be the case!

Even with just the 5 of us, it wasn't very roomy and when we tried to use the 3rd row, it left practically no leg room in both the 2nd and 3rd rows!

That's why I was left so disappointed by the Kodiaq. A smart, well-made car that's likely to be good value, but despite it's apparently big proportions, there's only two-and-half seats in the middle row! Such a shame because leg room is good and even the 3rd row is at least as spacious as an S-Max.

SmithySeller

Hah sounds like us in Portugal. never did I wish for a Renault so much. I had the option of an X-Trail or a Grand Scenic!

So disappointed

Ryath

Out of curiosity how wide is the middle seat in the Smax? Surprising how much wider the middle row of seats is. The Zafira is only 14cm shorter and the same width externally as an Smax. Plastic panel trims are very chunky on the zafira though, it really eats into space especially noticeable in the boot.

Have you you looked at the Seat Alhambra rare second hand but 3.9% finance on new might make it an option?

Gwynston

Not sure offhand about the internal dimensions of the S-Max but I know the width across the 3 seat bases is just over 140cm.

Yes, the Alhambra would certainly be big enough! I like the interior, but from outside they're a bit van-like.

Remember, the S-Max is basically the same floorplan as the full-size Galaxy (which has a higher rear roofline and higher-set 3rd row seats). But the middle row and the forward accommodation is basically the same in both.

But I was hoping to get something other than the full-size MPV-shape of a Galaxy or Alhambra, and spend less too! I'm beginning to think the S-Max is the only fit for my criteria...

Funmum05

@gwynston, As you know I bought the New Smax. My kids have been complaining that the seats are smaller then my 2010 s max so I went out and measured the middle row. They are 135cm across or 44.1cm per seat width

Gwynston

What? :eek:
We've been robbed!

Thanks for the heads up. I'll have to check it out more closely myself...
After all this contemplation, I'd almost decided the new S-Max was the only realistic replacement for my old one - now I'm not so sure...

Funmum05

Yeah I was very surprised myself when I sat in the back. The kids are used to it now and they're not on top of each plus I haven't noticed any difficulty strapping them in. My eldest is 11 and sits in the very back row and he says the space feels the same as before. Like you I didn't want the full SUV such as the galaxy as its too big and clunky even though there is only a few cm's in the difference between the 2. It also doesn't feel as sturdy as the S max. I liked the Alhambra purely for the sliding door. A friend of mine drives one and hates it. Says there's no power whatsoever in it and it drives like a bus lol

Gwynston

Yeah, a lot of these cars are under-powered considering the number of people they're expected to carry. The vast majority are sold in Ireland with the least powerful engine, which is why I sourced my original S-Max from the UK to get the 140bhp model.

The new entry-level 120bhp S-Max is over 3 secs slower 0-60 and even the 150bhp engine is slower than my old one - it needs the 180bhp engine to match the performance. The new car must be a lot heavier, so you definitely opted for the right engine in the 180!

Funmum05

The car definitely feels heavier but now that I've hit the 1k mark the power is coming in. I would've loved the 210bhp but couldn't justify 48k for it before adding the extras i wanted plus I prefer manual to powershift. I thought I would've noticed a hell of a lot more power then my old one which was the 143bhp, while there is a difference its not huge.

Gwynston

Just found this Turkish(!) website with some new 5008 images I haven't seen before (other country's websites are also available, I'm sure

):
http://www.ahaber.com.tr/galeri/otomobil/2017-peugeot-5008
But specifically, this one show the dimensions:
http://i.ahaber.com.tr/galeri/otomobil/2017-peugeot-5008/1_d.jpg
The crucial one there is labelled N across the back seats which is 1432mm, which is actually less than the old 5008 that I linked to earlier which labelled N as 1442mm. So if Peugeot are using the same measuring criteria, that suggests the new 5008 is actually narrower across the back seats than the old one. :eek:

But bearing in mind when I personally measured the old 5008's actual seat base width as being 1320mm (which was less than my S-Max's 1400mm), I can only conclude that the new 5008, despite having 3 separate seats will not be wide enough

Also, looking at the N measurement of overall internal width, the new (1432mm) is less than the old (1442mm). The external dimensions look wider on the new 5008 though, so where's all the space being wasted?

LaLa2004

Gwynston wrote: »

The crucial one there is labelled N across the back seats which is 1432mm, which is actually less than the old 5008 that I linked to earlier which labelled N as 1442mm. So if Peugeot are using the same measuring criteria, that suggests the new 5008 is actually narrower across the back seats than the old one.

1442mm - 1432mm = 1 centimetre

Not worth getting worked up about a reduction of 1cm in the width of a car.

Gwynston

I've come back for an update on this (been offline due to family bereavement).

Just to summarise - I was looking for a nearly-new car to replace our old S-Max but the new model seemed to have taken a big leap in price and so I was considering other family cars and SUVs which were a bit cheaper. But as this thread covers, I found that most of them didn't provide enough space for my 3 kids across the back seats. So I ended up with...

... another S-Max!

I've noticed since the new year quite a few year-old 150bhp ones coming on the market, many of them UK imports that dealers here are bringing in. Quite a few also with high spec: leather seats, reverse camera etc.

In the end a very high-spec Titanium Sport X-Pack with 180bhp became available for not much more than a lot of the others on sale, but crucially the dealer was offering me a much better trade-in than others.

So I ended up spending more than I'd planned, but have a really high-spec car, and most importantly it meets our space demands as well as our old car! :cool:

@Funmum05 - I think we basically have the same car you got (or should have done) The sports kit really makes a big difference, and I'm glad we have the 180bhp engine as it overall doesn't feel much faster than our old S-Max, so the 150bhp engine would have felt underpowered to me.

Funmum05

I'm thrilled you got the S max. It really is the best in its class. Mine is only coming into its own now with regards speed. Definitely needed the 180bhp, I had the 140 before hand and while nippy once up to speed it could be sluggish getting there.

I'm still trying to get the sports kit on mine 9 weeks later. Its gotten so bad all I can do is laugh. My car has been in twice, first time they got the wrong piece in so couldn't put the skirts on, 2nd time they thought they had it all done until I pointed out that the front grille wasn't the black honeycomb. They then tried to pawn me off, because I had the front camera I couldn't get the honeycomb grille. I politely pointed out that the pack came with the front camera as standard so of course they could get the grille. They have since had 2 more grilles delivered and are still wrong. This is has gone as far as Ford Ireland and they are just as useless. Their sales staff don't stand a chance of getting anything right if ford Ireland can't manage it.

On a side note keep an eye on the radio esp if its the sync 3, there are known issues with it cutting out. Mine has stopped working twice and the garage have been informed, also the hill start only randomly works now. My car just seems to be cursed from the day I ordered it lol

Gwynston

No problems with radio or hill start yet, although we've only had it a week. Think ours has Sync 2.

Really liking the smooth ride - very solid feeling car. My wife likes the comfort and styling, space in the back is fine, despite being slightly less than the old S-Max.

Sorry to hear you're still having trouble getting your spec corrected. Hope it's sorted soon.

colemanja

The best wide family car you can get is the VW Amarok, I waited so long for a Kodiaq and then it wouldn't fit my three car seas in the back - opted for a VW Amarok - I am so delighted I did - what a machine.

biko

Thread is old.
We'll see if someone else comes along asking for suggestions.