Keepgrowing wrote: This is designed for Northern Europe where the cost of feed is crippling them. I was on an 800 cow farm in the UK this week who can't stop pumping litres despite the fact that he's losing £20k cash per month. He can't stop because of debt. In fact he needs to drop 250 cows out of his system and take this money.
kowtow wrote: » Is it the debt that's killing him or the cost of feed?
Keepgrowing wrote: » It's price of milk and cost of feed but he has to try and ride it out to make payments on the massive capital invested. He's like a hamster in a wheel.
freedominacup wrote: » There's plenty of us here too. Quota costs are still the big pain in the hole. We'd be going a lot handier this year without them. I don't see applying for that scheme as a waste of time. They won't know until Nov what lads are actually doing and I don't think they can.chance being without the milk.
whelan2 wrote: » So why dont they come out and say they will be paying a minimum of x for the months involved so lads can do their sums?
Keepgrowing wrote: It's price of milk and cost of feed but he has to try and ride it out to make payments on the massive capital invested. He's like a hamster in a wheel.
Buford T. Justice V wrote: If we are to believe the executives, they are selling it all on the spot market when the price is falling and have it all on forward contracts when the price is rising
kowtow wrote: Hence my constant concern at the detail of fixed price arrangements.
kowtow wrote: Hedging is best left to the producer so he can match his own risk. If the processor is badly hedged (per your example) the producer now has to cover coops speculation losses as well as his own.
Dawggone wrote: » The crap that some posters got for saying that they were going to apply for the maximum amount of litres of a scheme that is nothing short of bloody favouritism....at the end of the day it's only 14cpl. At 24cpl I'm not interested. Speaks volumes....
kevthegaff wrote: » kowtow wrote: Hence my constant concern at the detail of fixed price arrangements. kowtow wrote: Hedging is best left to the producer so he can match his own risk. If the processor is badly hedged (per your example) the producer now has to cover coops speculation losses as well as his own. On the money as usual kowtow, by the time it trickles down to the supplier another downturn will begin. Bloody super levy fine I agree free.
Injuryprone wrote: » I presume that's aimed at me. You along with other posters on here only seem able to half read things. Posters were not criticised for applying for the maximum (I've applied for the max myself). Posters were criticised for applying for the max while at the same time saying they've no intention of claiming whatever is granted to them. Whatever money is allocated to those posters next week that goes unclaimed will go back into the eu coffers. That's not in the best interest of farmers Imo. Posters were also encouraging others to follow in their footsteps. These farmers are effectively saying "that's my money and even though I don't want to claim it, no one else is having it either". Definition of selfishness. Every euro that goes unclaimed is great news for the bureaucrats and in turn the processors. It is not for you or any other poster on here to be telling anyone else whether they should or shouldn't be applying for this scheme. Everyone should be making up their own mind for themselves. But what farmers should be making sure of is that they claim their full allocation so that the full €150m gets drawn down into farmers pockets.P.s. Having said all that, I've actually done the same in the tams scheme as what these posters are doing now. Part of the tams pot has been granted to me but due to onerous conditions that were attached to the grant approval, I won't be drawing down the grant. That 30k will go unclaimed and end up God knows where. These conditions were not flagged up prior to my application.
Injuryprone wrote: » I presume that's aimed at me. You along with other posters on here only seem able to half read things. Posters were not criticised for applying for the maximum (I've applied for the max myself). Posters were criticised for applying for the max while at the same time saying they've no intention of claiming whatever is granted to them. Whatever money is allocated to those posters next week that goes unclaimed will go back into the eu coffers. That's not in the best interest of farmers Imo. Posters were also encouraging others to follow in their footsteps. These farmers are effectively saying "that's my money and even though I don't want to claim it, no one else is having it either". Definition of selfishness. Every euro that goes unclaimed is great news for the bureaucrats and in turn the processors. It is not for you or any other poster on here to be telling anyone else whether they should or shouldn't be applying for this scheme. Everyone should be making up their own mind for themselves. But what farmers should be making sure of is that they claim their full allocation so that the full €150m gets drawn down into farmers pockets. P.s. Having said all that, I've actually done the same in the tams scheme as what these posters are doing now. Part of the tams pot has been granted to me but due to onerous conditions that were attached to the grant approval, I won't be drawing down the grant. That 30k will go unclaimed and end up God knows where. These conditions were not flagged up prior to my application.
Buford T. Justice V wrote: » You can write in and withdraw from the scheme and that will free up the funds for other applicants in the next few windows.
Mooooo wrote: » Those of ye paying the fine arent the only ones paying kev, plenty still paying off debt associated with quota purchase
mahoney_j wrote: » So you effectively want a hand out to take it easy at the expense of the lad that stays milking ......!!!!!.
Mooooo wrote: Those of ye paying the fine arent the only ones paying kev, plenty still paying off debt associated with quota purchase
OverRide wrote: » Oh god,the eldest lad,he's 22 was in the parlour with me milking this morning and Olivia Newton John came on the radio 'I remember dancin to that with your Ma I said' Over 30 year ago in a dancehall up in Courtown opposite the beach and amusements Time flies
mahoney_j wrote: » also as previously stated and confirmed to me elsewhere applications are for now just that ,ammount of reduction won't be known till Jan and then ammount of aid per applicant will be decided ,yes u will know in a few weeks poteintaly what ltrs you'll be paid on but actual ammount will be different once scheme ends on 31/12
mahoney_j wrote: So you effectively want a hand out to take it easy at the expense of the lad that stays milking ......!!!!!.also as previously stated and confirmed to me elsewhere applications are for now just that ,ammount of reduction won't be known till Jan and then ammount of aid per applicant will be decided ,yes u will know in a few weeks poteintaly what ltrs you'll be paid on but actual ammount will be different once scheme ends on 31/12
Injuryprone wrote: » I've read every bit of literature on the scheme that I could find (I don't listen to other people's interpretations) and I've not read anywhere where it says that the grant amount will be adjusted in Jan based on what the actual reduction is. If you could provide a link to support your claim, it would be greatly appreciated.
kevthegaff wrote: » But the more uptake of the scheme pressures buyers and processors to give a "little" more, win win for schemers or non schemers
Injuryprone wrote: » Farmers that stay milking are funding the scheme now? #thanksformakingmypointforme
mahoney_j wrote: » Read likewise ,confirmed to me by someone much higher up command chain
Keepgrowing wrote: » Caked in shyte.... Fighting for scraps.... Open for business Wtf are you on about. You have no idea how professional most farmers are here. The discussion was not about the scheme but about applying with no intention of reducing volume just to give the co op a fright.......now that's plain waste of time. Your neighbours are getting 28c I believe to do phuck all yet they'll be tipping dung an roundabouts the first frosty morning or if the bakery opens late for them. Irish dairy farmers took whinging to a new level this year but are only in the junior league compared to the French ones. Hosted 2 French groups last year and again this year and they could make cribbing an Olympic sport, rot my whole listening to them but I collected my €400 and shut my ears. This scheme suits someone easing back or a winter guy changing to spring production or a very inefficient supplier who will not make the 14c over variable costs. Fixed costs won't change. This is designed for Northern Europe where the cost of feed is crippling them. I was on an 800 cow farm in the UK this week who can't stop pumping litres despite the fact that he's losing £20k cash per month. He can't stop because of debt. In fact he needs to drop 250 cows out of his system and take this money. Irish dairy farming will be fine so long as we realise that it's about removing as much of the valuable proteins, cheese and bagging the rest to get it out of here as soon as possible. This notion of tiny outfits adding value to every component of every litre and selling it locally cannot work as we only have 4m mouths here and are already over 50% on the way to harvest 2020 targets
