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Cafe business start up cost

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  • 09-10-2012 3:31am
    #1
    JajaD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 411 ✭✭


    I am a recent graduate. Ive done a masters in Public Relations and Im getting no replies from any jobs im applying for. I am not prepared to do a 9 month, non paid internship for a company that will probably not even hire me in the end. Im getting tired of waiting around. So ive decided that I should go for a life long dream and use my masters. I want to open up my own cafe.

    Does anyone know how much it would cost? Ive read up about the process of opening one up but id like to hear from anyone who has personal experience....


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    #2
    bogwalrus
    Registered Users Posts: 1,454 ✭✭✭bogwalrus


    I'm just finished my first year of running my café and will be moving location due to not having enough of my target market and of course the high costs of running a cafe.


    Just to give you an idea of costs for a small cafe in country town:


    initial investment 20K

    Costs per month:

    Rent €800
    Rates €200
    electricity €250
    card machine & internet €100
    Bin collection €50
    cleaning products, napkins, toilet paper... €100

    Total €1,500


    The above works out at €50 per day of costs alone.

    If your margins are around 40% then you will need to be taking in €120 a day just to cover these costs.

    In the above scenario you would want to make an average of €250 per day making it €1,750 a week if your opened sunday's also.

    This might only leave you with profits of around €400 per week and if you have staff you might as well half this so lets say now your down to €200 profit for yourself. The rest of this cash will go into constant hidden costs like advertising and other re-investments.


    So the reality is that you will need to get the CHEAPEST rent possible with the best Location and footfall in order to survive and make some sort of cash.


    If you do not think you can take in an average of €1,750 a week based on the costings above i would not go ahead with opening a café.

    I have been negotiating with two properties and will be able to get a rent of €200 per month compared to the €800 pm i have been paying. In my new premises i will make sure to have an average profit margin of at least 40% and keep those hidden costs down.


    Pm me if you have any other questions.


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    #3
    pm1977x
    Registered Users Posts: 1,213 ✭✭✭pm1977x


    Hi, best of luck, good short thread here on same topic with great advice from someone who seems to know all the ins and outs:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056709034


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    #4
    YellowSheep
    Registered Users Posts: 384 ✭✭YellowSheep


    Where are you based?

    Regards Oliver


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    #5
    JajaD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 411 ✭✭JajaD


    Thanks for the help guys.

    @yellowsheep...im based in the D15 area but would be interested in anywhere with good foot-fall.


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    #6
    brianblaze
    Registered Users Posts: 2,101 ✭✭✭brianblaze


    Hi guys,

    I'm doing a cost analysis for a coffee business, and need to know some small pieces of info! I'm currently in New Zealand until February so can't just go in and ask in Dublin sadly!

    How much do cafes pay for their beans etc... I'm trying to work out a cost per cup, and stick it in a business plan for when I get back. Solely coffee, no food or premises etc at the moment, just the bare bones.

    The cafe owners here have told me they get their machines and cups for free from their beans suppliers, so long as they contract to buy from them for a period of time. Is this the same back home?

    Thanks in advance!


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    #7
    thebooxttt
    Registered Users Posts: 20 ✭thebooxttt


    HI jajaD,
    I run my own small town-seaside resort food business, this list of running costs is what I deal with on a regular basis:
    *Insurance can be anything depending on location, size, security, stock etc
    *Rent approx 10% of t/over
    *Wages approx 30% of t/o
    *PRSI (something people forget to include in costing) 8% of wage costs
    *Food costs approx 30% of t/o
    *Gas or Electric really depend on which you use & how much equipment is on at any one time & believe me when you are paying the bills you soon learn to turn stuff off when not in use! As for which is better...it's really a personal choice & of course equipment cost price & what's hooked up at your location.
    *Water rates which are metered on usage
    *Council rates which are dependent on you city/county council
    *Refuse Costs...I pay €35 per 1100L bin lift(big 4-wheel bin), €8 per recycle bin & €12 per food waste bin
    *Kitchen consumables: approx 5% of t/o...your tinfoil, washup liquid, cleaners, pest control, hand held fire equipment, paper towels etc
    *Banking Charges: you may get free banking for first time business accounts. Note: I accept credit cards & charges are pure mental...€30 per month for the terminal rental, 25c per laser transaction & 1.5-2% of all other card transactions goes straight to the credit card company. Unlike the airlines, we in the food business don't seem to be capable of/allowed to add a card handling charge...something I would be fully supportive of---Sorry, I'm ranting on a pet hate!
    *Accountancy fees, depending on your business approx 500-800 per year...If you’re working all the hours God sends you won't want to be spending precious down time doing books!
    *And the VAT man...he takes 9% of all t/o. There is a zero rate for any take-out food business, but best get some advice on that one. Most of your purchases, presuming mostly food stuffs, will have no vat content but if, for e.g., you purchase a laptop for the business then the vat portion of the purchase price is deductable from your liability but other than that he...the Col Gen...gets 9% of everything!

    It also depends on how much work you intend on doing yourself. I work as chef in my food business but sometimes go front of house & I work 7 days a week 6-8 hrs per day winter & 12-14 hrs per day summer. If I paid myself properly for the hrs I worked I could have retired years ago! :)
    But I do enjoy it, make a living, take 1 holiday per year, keep a house & home, enjoy a social life (during the winter months!) & I'm answerable......to me! :D
    Good Luck


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    #8
    YellowSheep
    Registered Users Posts: 384 ✭✭YellowSheep


    Although "thebooxttt" is fairly correct with the percentages, I just want to point out that these % should be calculated on your NET turnover.

    As for the 9% VAT....VAT should not enter any P&L or forecast as you are the collector and should be straight passed on. That's why it is very important when you write a forecast that you ALWAYS look to get your turnover from an achievable NET turnover.

    Any more question please feel free to PM.

    Cheers Oliver


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    #9
    Twoandahalfmen
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 769 ✭✭✭Twoandahalfmen


    YellowSheep wrote: »
    Although "thebooxttt" is fairly correct with the percentages, I just want to point out that these % should be calculated on your NET turnover.

    As for the 9% VAT....VAT should not enter any P&L or forecast as you are the collector and should be straight passed on. That's why it is very important when you write a forecast that you ALWAYS look to get your turnover from an achievable NET turnover.

    Any more question please feel free to PM.

    Cheers Oliver

    You may seen helpful but once you get to pms you tell people to stop shouting Abd that there rise because there typing in capitals. Wouldn't recommend Dealing with this guy.


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    #10
    Peterdalkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,091 ✭✭✭Peterdalkey


    Twoandahalfmen wrote: »
    You may seen helpful but once you get to pms you tell people to stop shouting Abd that there rise because there typing in capitals. Wouldn't recommend Dealing with this guy.

    The schoolchild has spoken!


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    #11
    Twoandahalfmen
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 769 ✭✭✭Twoandahalfmen


    Peterdalkey wrote: »

    The schoolchild has spoken!

    Who do you think you are "calling me a schoolchild" I had dealings with him over a cafe and he was nice at first but once I sent a message with questions because it was in capitals w he wouldn't deal with me and accuses me of "shouting" time waster


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    #12
    Jarren
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,692 ✭✭✭Jarren


    Twoandahalfmen wrote: »
    Who do you think you are "calling me a schoolchild" I had dealings with him over a cafe and he was nice at first but once I sent a message with questions because it was in capitals w he wouldn't deal with me and accuses me of "shouting" time waster


    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=82602294&postcount=1


    :pac:


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    #13
    Peterdalkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,091 ✭✭✭Peterdalkey


    Twoandahalfmen wrote: »
    Who do you think you are "calling me a schoolchild" I had dealings with him over a cafe and he was nice at first but once I sent a message with questions because it was in capitals w he wouldn't deal with me and accuses me of "shouting" time waster

    Exactly! In an earlier post you claimed to be still attending school, is this not the case?


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    #14
    Twoandahalfmen
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 769 ✭✭✭Twoandahalfmen


    Jarren wrote: »


    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=82602294&postcount=1


    :pac:

    So what if I'm in school I still want to set up cafes and learn what takes big deal of I can't yet I still have a vision and yellow sheep was no help at all


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    #15
    Jarren
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,692 ✭✭✭Jarren


    Twoandahalfmen wrote: »
    So what if I'm in school I still want to set up cafes and learn what takes big deal of I can't yet I still have a vision and yellow sheep was no help at all


    Fair Play :)


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    #16
    Peterdalkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,091 ✭✭✭Peterdalkey


    Twoandahalfmen wrote: »
    So what if I'm in school I still want to set up cafes and learn what takes big deal of I can't yet I still have a vision and yellow sheep was no help at all


    He is a very naughty boy indeed!!


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    #17
    YellowSheep
    Registered Users Posts: 384 ✭✭YellowSheep


    :D


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    #18
    DubTony
    Registered Users Posts: 3,268 ✭✭✭DubTony


    Twoandahalfmen wrote:
    Who do you think you are "calling me a schoolchild" I had dealings with him over a cafe and he was nice at first but once I sent a message with questions because it was in capitals w he wouldn't deal with me and accuses me of "shouting" time waster


    Twoandahalfmen wrote: »
    So what if I'm in school I still want to set up cafes and learn what takes big deal of I can't yet I still have a vision and yellow sheep was no help at all

    Lucky for you. Now go and ask your English teacher how the punctuation thing works.


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    #19
    Twoandahalfmen
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 769 ✭✭✭Twoandahalfmen


    DubTony wrote: »
    Lucky for you. Now go and ask your English teacher how the punctuation thing works.

    Piss Off


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    #20
    Peterdalkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,091 ✭✭✭Peterdalkey


    Twoandahalfmen wrote: »
    Piss Off



    Naughty, naughty boy!!!!


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    #21
    Twoandahalfmen
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 769 ✭✭✭Twoandahalfmen


    Peterdalkey wrote: »
    Naughty, naughty boy!!!!

    Your really quite funny, you have all of us here in stitches:P


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    #22
    Peterdalkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,091 ✭✭✭Peterdalkey


    Twoandahalfmen wrote: »
    Your really quite funny, you have all of us here in stitches:P

    Stunning riposte! However, it should read " you are (or even you're) really quite funny". You just can not beat free education. I guess you are taking the lower paper in English.


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    #23
    dbran
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 2,094 Mod ✭✭✭✭dbran


    Enough :)


This discussion has been closed.
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