We don't know what austerity is

zenno wrote: »

You are obviously thinking of people that are defrauding the social welfare system and getting more money illegally because this is the only way you could go on a foreign holiday. You would have nothing left after food and bills on €188 a week, not a chance. The cost of living here in Ireland is very high, this is what makes €188 vanish so easily. Holidays are for people that actually have a realistic amount of money.

I am working full time and I can't afford a holiday this year, or for the next few years the way things are. And it's only going to get harder with the cost of living still going up, there will be more and higher taxes by the end of the year too.

I have no idea how people can exist on €188 per week.

And before the high horse brigade come in here, no I don't have a mortgage. Right now though I wish I had as it would be cheaper than my rent by a good margin.

geneyuss wrote: »

When the Sligo County Council manager gets paid more than the Spanish Prime Minister there is no recession/austerity in this country,

and i agree with earlier post, this welfare state needs to come to an end, E200 per week, free housing, free clothes, childrens allowance for everyone, free elec, free phone, no wonder every doley i know has a better house ,car, lifestyle than i do, considering im paying for both.

I think you need to stop listening to everything you hear in the pub to be honest..

I was out of work for a year in 2010 and I certainly didn't get all these "freebies" you're talking about - I got €188 a week and rent allowance of €45.. that's it (oh and a medical card which I think I used once for a GP visit)
That was down from a wage of nearly 3 grand a month I might add after 15 years of paying my way honestly (I know.. that last word is a foreign concept to the "cute hoors" of Ireland) in this State.

Out of that "fortune" I was expected to pay my bills (no free electricity, gas or phone here), my debts (that don't disappear with your job/income you know!), look for a job.. oh and eat of course!

And before all the other keyboard economists chime in with their "the dole isn't intended to pay loans, or to run a car, or a mortgage" lines, you try telling your bank then that "hey I have no job so you're alright to just wait for that money I owe you, right?" and see how you get on! While most will work with you, you have to give them something (or are these same people who spout this nonsense the same ones who still expect to just have their overpriced mortgages written off?)

This sort of ill-informed crap really annoys me on this forum :mad:

geneyuss wrote: »

i lasted on it for two years, times were a "little" harder, but i didnt starve, far from it , i actually lived quiet comfortably for doing nothing, im worse of now because my wages have been slashed, and im paying more taxes all for people that dont want to work, or dont deserve certain welfare payments.

A quick glance out my window here and looking at most of my neighbours houses they have two cars outside, and nobody seems to work, ah yes, times are tough

Sounds to me like you have more of a problem with what your neighbors are or aren't up to more than anything - another typically Irish thing of course!

I suppose any poor fecker who is laid off and on the dole should have an American-style Yard Sale to sell off whatever they have and then go live in a workhouse, yes? :rolleyes:

zenno wrote: »

That is not an intelligent comment at all.

that is not a well thought out reply.....

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

Just to throw in another point... although I'm working now and doing well again, I know that could change overnight and I have every sympathy for any poor fecker just trying to pay his bills, look after his family and worrying about giving all his debtors just enough to keep them off his door another week

Although I feel the burden of tax needs to be spread more evenly, I don't begrudge anyone the €188 they get and for which they will most likely be treated like a junkie scumbag by those helpful people in the Dept of Social Welfare (or whatever name they're calling it this week)

Welfare cheats or those who are too feckless to even want to work though I've no sympathy for

I had occasion to sign on a couple of times due to seasonal work, and was never treated with anything other than courtesy.

looksee wrote: »

I had occasion to sign on a couple of times due to seasonal work, and was never treated with anything other than courtesy.

As with everything else though in this country, it depends who you get

I had a Community Welfare Officer shouting at me through a frosted glass window because I'd basically caught him out on something - that attitude soon changed after I spoke to his boss (another thing the Irish don't do well - complain effectively)

The first time (ever) I went to sign on, I drove the 40 mins to the town in question, paid my parking and went in with my little blue card only to have some jobsworth tell me that I'd have to come back two days later cause they weren't accepting sign ons that day even though the card says anytime that week (and they weren't exactly busy).
Took a chat with her boss before that was sorted but I got it sorted on the day - all while yer one was telling other "newbies" who'd come in after me the same crap she'd tried on me

Oh and I worked in the PS for years too so it's not a anti-PS rant.. there are a lot of hard working underpaid (generally front-line) staff on contracts (who are then the first to go too) but their efforts are all too often overshadowed by the lazy, institutionalised, overpaid middle-management types which dominates the sector

geneyuss wrote: »

i have signed on many times over the years and have never came across this
but i wholeheartedly agree with your last line

I have had to sign during a couple of periods during my lifetime. Having only had two periods were I was either not working or studying, I wouldn't have known the system, and how to work it, and have sometimes during both periods been made feel crappy for only going for the minimum that I though I was entitled to.

Maybe not to junkie statis but still preety low, and I was only claiming my 188 a week, and not everything else that others are going for weather they are intitled to it or not.

Its the career scrongers they should be going for and not those who are geniunally trying.

If we were only paying out the 188 a week our welfare bill would be slashed. It's the myriad of assorted extras (that seemingly only those "in the know" avail of) that are the real problem tbh.

We also have to ask ourselves how a nation apparently undergoing austerity can manage not to even touch the contributory pension by a single Euro in the 4 or 5 years since the "crisis" began.

geneyuss wrote: »

When the Sligo County Council manager gets paid more than the Spanish Prime Minister there is no recession/austerity in this country,

and i agree with earlier post, this welfare state needs to come to an end, E200 per week, free housing, free clothes, childrens allowance for everyone, free elec, free phone, no wonder every doley i know has a better house ,car, lifestyle than i do, considering im paying for both.

its 188 per week. no free houseing, part of your rent is covered. no free clothes!! child allowance is for the child. EVERY child gets it. part of your electricity and your phone bills are payed for those on disability allowance or pensions. do a bit of reading on it next time.

Kinski wrote: »

Yeah, and it's interesting how people are always keen to cite welfare rates in the UK as evidence to support the contention that Ireland pays too much, but are much less keen to consider the differences between bankruptcy laws in those jurisdictions (it's a lot easier to get out from under onerous debt burdens in Britain.)

Not only that of course but it's a completely different country with different demographics, economies of scale, prospects and not to mention currency.

You might as well compare Ireland with a country in Africa for as much sense as those comparisons make.

Also, despite the "crisis" and the massive increase in numbers of people out of work, I note very little has actually come down in price - if anything things continue to increase.. and then you have the government coming up with ever inventive ways to squeeze EVERYONE a little bit more, be they unemployed, private sector, public sector or self employed.

But to their credit they do know that the Irish are so insecure in themselves that the best way to push these things through is to pit one side against the other and mix it up every so often.. meanwhile the top echelon continue to draw their overpaid salaries, perks and multiple pensions or exploit our swiss-cheese like tax system while the "little people" fight over scraps.

We have a lot of problems in this country, but the poor fecker trying to get by on the dole while he tries to find work and not fall into a bottle with the stress and "stigma" of it all isn't one of them

Sand wrote: »

Are you saying the dole should be bench-marked to include the cost of servicing your debts?

How about iPhones? Cable TV? Running your car? A few new games for the X-Box? Funding a few drinks out each week?

Did you try telling you bank that you have no job so they'll just have to deal with it? That you fully intend to honor your debt but you need to get a new job and cant afford to make payments out of the dole in the meantime? Banks are engaging in crazed "extend and pretend" deals to avoid having to write up bad debts. You weren't in as weak a position as you might have imagined.

The bottom line is that the dole in Ireland is unaffordably generous for a small, bankrupt state like Ireland. You might as well argue that gravity is unfair for all the difference it makes.

Oh there's so much wrong with this post I don't know where to begin, but...

People like yourself need to realise that you (like the rest of us) could find yourself out of work in the morning, and that lifestyle you had, loans you took out which were perfectly serviceable while you were working haven't disappeared with your job and will still need to be paid.

I love the whole idea that you can just ring the bank though and tell them "I've no job so tough.. you'll just have to wait until I do". That may work for the big boys (are you familiar with the quote along the lines of: "borrow 1000 from the bank and they own you, borrow 10,000,000 and you own them") but for ordinary Joe that will just land them in court - and we know too that swift justice is dispensed in this country to those who can't afford to work the system or don't have the right contacts (which is why people end up being sent to jail for having no TV license and other such minutiae)

As for the rest of your examples...

- Phones: This isn't a luxury these days, it's an essential if you actually plan to get a job (ditto broadband). Of course, only in Ireland is key infrastructure deemed an "extra" - probably why our "smart economy" isn't so smart!

- Cable TV: I had Sky at the time and it was reduced to the minimum only because I didn't have the €300-400 outlay required to switch to FTA. But then what was I thinking? How dare I expect to have even a semblance of normality in my unemployed life right? :rolleyes:

- Running the car: I have a 06 Passat that I bought in 2008 and which now has 223,000 km on it. Unfortunately I've never been able to buy a new car every year ya see, oh and in case you hadn't noticed.. public transport ranges from impractical to non-existent once you go beyond Dublin.
How then would I get to all those interviews at short notice or even to the shops in some cases? Or would you rather I move back to Dublin (as I eventually did when I got my current job) and claim more in rent allowance?

- XBox games: Sorry, don't have one. Do have a PC though but haven't played, never mind bought a game in ages - does that count?

- Off to the pub: I could barely afford that now, never mind when I was on €188 a week. I guess I'm not as good as getting free drinks as others?


In short, you are a perfect example of this insecure, "me fein" type that is far too concerned with what everyone else is doing with "his/her taxes" than waking up to the real problems and waste that goes on in this country.

Apt username though - as in "have your head stuck in..."

Captain Chaos wrote: »

I am working full time and I can't afford a holiday this year, or for the next few years the way things are. And it's only going to get harder with the cost of living still going up, there will be more and higher taxes by the end of the year too.

I have no idea how people can exist on €188 per week.

And before the high horse brigade come in here, no I don't have a mortgage. Right now though I wish I had as it would be cheaper than my rent by a good margin.

That's because it is not 188 Euro per week. It is much more than that, rental allowance, medical cards, child allowance, school allowance, disability benefits, back to education allowances. Pensioners get a great deal too to be honest, no matter how much money they have already. Crazy system.
You should get back what you paid in for the 1st year and then rapidly decline. People who never paid anything should get bare bones allowances, that's it. Working people in private industry in Ireland are dumb schmucks subsidising a lot of longterm lazy schmucks. The PS are taken care of though so they can accept the system.

maninasia wrote: »

That's because it is not 188 Euro per week. It is much more than that, rental allowance, medical cards, child allowance, school allowance, disability benefits, back to education allowances. Pensioners get a great deal too to be honest, no matter how much money they have already. Crazy system.

Ah another poster who thinks everyone gets the raft of "freebies" eh? Go and read back some of the posts by people who are dealing with the reality day in and day out then come back to us

You should get back what you paid in for the 1st year and then rapidly decline. People who never paid anything should get bare bones allowances, that's it. Working people in private industry in Ireland are dumb schmucks subsidising a lot of longterm lazy schmucks. The PS are taken care of though so they can accept the system.

I agree with the first part.. there should be a sliding scale AND support when you DO get a job (as opposed to the current system where you're cut off instantly and left to fend for yourself for the first 4-6 weeks)

Ditto that if someone has never worked and no interest in it they should only get the bare minimum

Private Industry though wasted just as much in the "good times" as anyone else and made the same stupid decisions as many people did - or have you forgotten that the banks in this country were privately owned until relatively recently?

As for the PS, that's another inaccurate generalisation. While yes there are a lot of overpaid, lazy institutionalised middle-management types that should be weeded out, there are also a lot of younger front-line hard working people who you're tarring with the same brush (I could never praise nurses enough for example) and these people are also the ones who bare the brunt of any cuts that are implemented so to say they're "taken care of" isn't quite true.

geneyuss wrote: »

there is absolutely nothing wrong with his post, its his opinion , do you critisie everybody so vigorously off-line ? unemployeble maybe ? :cool:

If you mean do I challenge stereotypical inaccurate generalisations like some of what has been posted in this thread, then yes.. I'm not one for just accepting crap or poor service or incompetence/apathy in general though

As for the last line - if you'd bothered to actually read what was posted you'd have gathered that not only am I working but I'm doing well in it.

But by all means, feel free to trade barbs anonymously from behind your screen there - it's certainly not bothering me