[~Rebel~]

Originally Posted by KeithAFC

Why is it madness? A lot of Arsenal fans are now turning on Wenger and it will only get worse.

It's madness because the only reason Arsenal have consistently been in the champions league places with their transfer spend is Wenger.

Change managers and give the same transfer budget, and watch the club drop down.

The only thing I could criticize the man for is wages, and I'm not even sure if that's his remit.

[KeithAFC]

Originally Posted by ~Rebel~

It's madness because the only reason Arsenal have consistently been in the champions league places with their transfer spend is Wenger.

Change managers and give the same transfer budget, and watch the club drop down.

The only thing I could criticize the man for is wages, and I'm not even sure if that's his remit.

This is a myth. Wenger is one of the big reasons for this. Instead of putting in an extra 10 or 15k for Mata, we decided not to sign him. It is the same with so many other players.

We signed Silvestre instread of Vincent Kompany. How did we not get Vincent Kompany who is one of the best defenders in Europe now? Wenger always goes for the cheap option.

He has dismantled the team. He was so deluded that he thought Fabregas and Nasri would stay and had absoutely no plan at all in that transfer market. He was so desperate, he ended up signing all the players on the last day.

Tactically we are awful, we can't defend and our shape is all over the place. That is down to the manager.

The board is a pack of wankers but you can't ignore the obvious errors that Arsene Wenger has made. I would rather we look to rebuild the whole team from the back, with a new manager in who can build from the back. I think the Wenger era is coming to an end.

[keano_afc]

While I think its wrong to blame all the current problems on the manager, its ignorant to say he's blameless at the same time.

Fair enough he can do little about our injuries. But lets not pretend this is unusual. Every season we lose our top players for months on end, the problem is that the back up is cheap crap, and that is Wengers fault.

Yesterday's team was full of internationals, class players that should be capable of beating a newly promoted team. We were schooled, no doubt about it. The performance was horrendous, the same lethargic crap we've come to expect around this time of the season. There was no motivation, and that is Wengers fault. I've been saying for a couple of seasons now that he's lost the ability to get the best from this team and I stick by that.

Our chances of getting 4th spot are totally reliant on RvP staying fit. Every game we hold our breath that he wont break down, considering his past. For a team challenging at the top to be completely depending on one player is crazy. And that is Wengers fault. He has had the opportunity in 2 transfer windows to buy good proven support for RvP. We get a Korean who is so below standard he gets subbed off for the reserves. I dont believe the excuses that we dont have money, the revenues from the Nasri sale and the spineless flogging of Fabregas were more than enough to buy and wage a decent player.

So while he has been unlucky, he's also been naiive and too stubborn for his own good. He can get us back to the top again, but he really needs to examine himself and his motivational tactics.

[L'prof]

I can see why people are getting a bit annoyed, but ~Rebel~ is right. If a new manager were to come in with the same constraints as Wenger we'll soon find ourselves in a far worse position. If a new manager was given money to spend, I'd be absolutely livid that it wasn't given to Wenger!

This is his 16th season in charge of Arsenal and in that time his net spend is about £4m if even. That's £250k a season. I don't see how anyone could argue that Wenger chose to spend so little, so under those constraints who the hell do we bring in that won't lead us to oblivion???

[emergingstar]

Just want to say I think Ramsey is getting unfair and people calling for him to be sold Is madness

Are people forgetting this is basically his first season, only back from a horrific leg break and have to play way to much football I think already

Now he was utter ****e yesterday but not once did the lad go missing he kept looking for the ball and trying,it wasn't coming off but he kept at it. We can't say that about other players who just disappeared

The lad is only 21 and is gonna be world class I think people should go a bit easier on him

He needs a go on the bench and so does Walcott, but we have no one to go in rosicky is nearly never fit to start, the ox is not ready, and I think benyaoun is only a 20 min man

When ya have 25 of a squad it's hard to compete with 13 players out I don't think anyone not even man city would compete and alot of them players that are out are our very best players

The wenger out brigade back again is laughable, the man done wonders building the team back together he can't compensate for 13 players been out

But he has to take some blame we needed full backs he new that and never acted I think that was the main reason we lost them two games

Wenger to blame for this run bad form yes wenger out give over

[Blatter]

My gut feeling is that I think Wenger will go in the Summer anyway, for a multitude of reasons. (Not that I think Arsenal should want him to leave)

He's a good bet to take over at Barca if Pep leaves imo.

[Pepe LeFrits]

Originally Posted by ~Rebel~

It's madness because the only reason Arsenal have consistently been in the champions league places with their transfer spend is Wenger.

Change managers and give the same transfer budget, and watch the club drop down.

The only thing I could criticize the man for is wages, and I'm not even sure if that's his remit.

That's a pretty big only. He is involved with the wages and Arsenal spend £110m a year on his players; Arsenal are traditionally the fourth highest spending team in the league although Liverpool have pushed us back to 5th in that regard now I believe. So really, I don't see how getting fourth with fourth translates to Wenger being the only man capable.

[gosplan]

Hey, wouldn't it be great if we were just doing things backwards this season.

i.e. instead of being crap when it most counts from Feb on, we just turned it on then.

I'm not confidant of this though - so much depends on getting everyone fit and keeping them fit and I am waiting for the RVP gamble to blow up horrifically in Wenger's face - I reckon it'll happen during the first game after the transfer window closes.

It's just do annoying because we've got such a strong first 11, we just never see them.

And I know we suck at defending but we didn't for while when we actually had our first choice defenders on the pitch.

[Frisbee]

We need goals.

Goals from a striker other than Robin and goals from the wings.

Henry is a bargain bin temporary answer. We need two more players before the window closes or we'll be playing on Thursdays next season.

[emergingstar]

Originally Posted by Frisbee

We need goals.

Goals from a striker other than Robin and goals from the wings.

Henry is a bargain bin temporary answer. We need two more players before the window closes or we'll be playing on Thursdays next season.

I'd rather us slip down the table than play thurs football next year

But fully agree we need signings for fourth

[jonny666]

Originally Posted by emergingstar

I'd rather us slip down the table than play thurs football next year

Me too. Least then we can concentrate on gettin back into the CL places without any distractions.

If we do make the Europa league. Would ye want Wenger to go for it or do a spurs?

[Underground]

Jaysus,2 defeats in a row and the "Wenger Out" brigade shows up already,madness.

[keano_afc]

Originally Posted by Underground

Jaysus,2 defeats in a row and the "Wenger Out" brigade shows up already,madness.

Ablely supported by the "Wenger can do no wrong" brigade. Both sides of view are wrong, some people seem to think Wenger is above reproach though.

[maximoose]

Originally Posted by Underground

Jaysus,2 defeats in a row and the "Wenger Out" brigade shows up already,madness.

In fairness, they've been around since the summer!

[Pepe LeFrits]

Wenger will sign an attacking player of some description before the transfer window closes, as ‘the prize’ is at risk. This time however it won’t be enough and we will miss out on the top 4.

It’ll be all doom and gloom during the summer, and van Persie leaving will be hailed as a sign of the coming apocalypse. Wenger will sign someone underwhelming as a replacement but there’ll be a soft undercurrent of ‘Arsenal will do better than expected, wait and see’. A strong run early next season will have this group clucking I-told-you-sos.

This strong run will ultimately result in Arsenal reclaiming ‘the prize’ next season. However the following summer we’ll lose at least one of Vermaelen, Koscielny, Sagna or Szczesny. They’ll be replaced from within. There’ll be panic but also more clucking as Arsenal win 4th place in 2013/14 again. With other clubs reducing their spending this will be hailed as a triumph and ultimate vindication of Wenger's policy of 9 years without a trophy. The 10 year plan is ready to deliver.

The 10 year plan will begin with a defeat away to Shrewsbury. Despite this, 2014/15 will be a difficult start, but the team will put together a strong run. At some point (the second week in January), the team will even look like title challengers - the ultimate in damning indictments of the doubters - but these dreams will have collapsed by the second week in February. However the mood will be boosted with Wenger signing a new contract.

In the summer another key player will leave, but again there’ll be optimism that the young players are surely going to deliver and end the 10 year wait. Things will fall apart the following March, when a thrilling 5-4 defeat at swash-buckling Stoke, managed by Kevin Keegan, ends title hopes.

Arguments will be put forth for Wenger’s removal, but these will be dismissed out of hand as knee-jerk complaints.